Author Topic: Shutterstock is an embarassment (Read 30350 times)

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #200 on:** May 05, 2024, 17:18 »

Quote from: Brasilnut on May 04, 2024, 06:03

Check out their challenges page and custom projects, can earn $4 per image accepted. It's both fun and profitable.

It takes me an average of 5 minutes per clip to edit, grade, export, keyword, write a description, and upload. I wouldn't do that for $4 unless they guaranteed 100% acceptance of every clip I submitted.

Uncle Pete · « **Reply #201 on:** May 05, 2024, 21:13 »

Quote from: Roscoe on May 03, 2024, 01:35

Quote from: Doug Jensen on May 02, 2024, 16:15
Quote from: Uncle Pete on May 02, 2024, 16:06
Just a quick and easy way to profit, from your backlog.

But I won't profit at all if the metadata is crap. 85% of nothing is the same as 100% of nothing. Beleive me, I could do some half-assed metadata myself and FTP the clips myself and not give up any percentage. But why waste my time?

If someone could demonstrate to me they could do excellent metadata I'd gladly give up 25%. But they can't. It takes effort to describe the content correctly and choose the right keywords and exclude unhelpful keywords -- but they won't make the investment in time and attention. Metadata is king!! Most people totally underestimate it's importance. 9 times out of 10 people have asked me to look at their portfolio because they aren't getting sales, it turns out their metadata is crap.

I would be very careful with Wirestock. You also will need to take a monthly subscription in order to get your content distributed to agencies. $14.99 for 200 submissions per month. On top of the 15% commission they take.

I tested them when it was still free, except for the 15% commission, and the keywording done by them was below par. That said, content uploaded through Wirestock gets sold on the agencies.

I got increasingly more dissatisfied with them, as they just do what they like with your content without giving much transparency or control over it. They onboard new agencies as they like, and some of them are agencies you might not want to be affiliated with (bottom of the barrel stuff). Back then, their site was also full of bugs which took forever to fix. In the end, the monthly subscription killed it for me, and now I just take the money from what I uploaded back then.

I would only use them for content you don't really care about, and never plan to upload. So if you have a few thousands of useful clips that are sitting there and you don't plan to upload it you might give it a try. In that case, I would contact them directly, and try to work out a deal. 200 assets/month upload limit is ridiculous and will take you forever.

I think you covered that quite well.

I was only making a simple point, which has turned into many side discussions, variations, inspections, and contradictions.

Here's what I was trying to point out. If someone has 5,000 videos and is too busy with better ways to make money and more profitable endeavors. They could dump them on a distribution platform, and continue doing the more profitable work.Yes, another negative is, paying for 200 files a month, which is also limiting. Or some annual plan. How long would it take to upload 5,000 files?

You also hit something in that WS makes deals. Someone with 5,000 video files, could probably say, here's what I have, and WS would jump at the volume and quality of someone established. But I can't speak for them or any promises of some hypothetical. I can say that, WS does make special deals, outside of the published.

Let me reduce this to minimal math. If I have 500 files, making nothing and I upload them "somewhere" and I make $1. I have $1, and doing nothing, I have NOTHING. Which is more?

Yes I know, there's no incentive to make $1, but $1, $100 or $1,000 is always going to be more than nothing. The only sure thing in this is, if someone does nothing, uploads nothing, I can promise them a sure thing. They will earn nothing.

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #202 on:** May 06, 2024, 09:32 »

Quote from: Uncle Pete on May 05, 2024, 21:13

The only sure thing in this is, if someone does nothing, uploads nothing, I can promise them a sure thing. They will earn nothing.

Sometimes nothing is better than something that takes more effort than it is worth.

I also want to be mindful of not uploading content that cannibalizes my own similar content. For example, I have about 5000 4K clips that are edited, graded, and waiting for metadata. But almost all of that content is similar to other stuff I already have submitted before. So, if I already have a dozen nice clips of elk bugling in Yellowstone, will another dozen significantly improve my earnings? Doubtful. Do I want to allow an agency to sell clips for $1 that are similar to clips that regularly earn $30 per download? No. Clearly uploading more and more similar content has diminishing returns.

If I really want to increase my earnings, I would need to create content that is markedly different from what I already have in my portfolio. And that is true for every contributor that already has a successful portfolio. If you want to earn more, you really need to spread your wings and come up with stuff that does not cannibalize what you already have working for you.

The problem is, I have no interest in shooting what I think will sell. I shoot what I want to shoot for fun, and any income it may earn is a secondary consideration. So, as long as I'm not willing to go shoot stuff like hipsters playing ukuleles on the beach or silver-haired senior citizens people cycling through a park while grinning like morons -- even though there is money to be made there -- my earnings will not increase in proportion to the size of my portfolio.

Excuse me now, while I go shoot another 200 clips of birds in flight. :-)

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #203 on:** May 06, 2024, 09:35 »

Quote from: Uncle Pete on May 05, 2024, 21:13

I can say that, WS does make special deals, outside of the published.

I aksed you earlier, but didn't see an answer. Can you post a link to the page on Wirestock where they talk about their service of generating metadata? I can't find it anywhere on their site. I hope you would agree that is a very serious topic to learn about before signing up. Where is it?

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #204 on:** May 08, 2024, 18:09 »

Hmmm, I guess Uncle Pete is ghosting me or he has no answer to a simple question. Either way, I think that confirms exactly what I thought about Wirestock.

cascoly · « **Reply #205 on:** May 09, 2024, 12:08 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on May 08, 2024, 18:09

Hmmm, I guess Uncle Pete is ghosting me or he has no answer to a simple question. Either way, I think that confirms exactly what I thought about Wirestock.

Pete is busy promoting his crapstock portfolio...

here's what WS says

https://wirestock.io/about-us what we do

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #206 on:** May 09, 2024, 12:23 »

Quote from: cascoly on May 09, 2024, 12:08

here's what WS says
https://wirestock.io/about-us what we do

Thanks for the link. I must say I am overwhelmed my the amount of detail they provide:
"Here at Wirestock, we eliminate all the manual steps such as keywording and captioning".

That's it. Not a single scrap of information beyond that one sentence. And if that doesn't convince me that they know what they are doing, nothing will. $:-\$

cascoly · « **Reply #207 on:** May 10, 2024, 14:24 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on May 09, 2024, 12:23

Quote from: cascoly on May 09, 2024, 12:08
here's what WS says
https://wirestock.io/about-us what we do

Thanks for the link. I must say I am overwhelmed my the amount of detail they provide:
"Here at Wirestock, we eliminate all the manual steps such as keywording and captioning".

That's it. Not a single scrap of information beyond that one sentence. And if that doesn't convince me that they know what they are doing, nothing will. $:-\$

they used to have more details, but i couldn't find them. they always did metadat earlier (w variable results) but i havent uploaded since they went to a premium option

Uncle Pete · « **Reply #208 on:** May 13, 2024, 13:41 »

Quote from: cascoly on May 09, 2024, 12:08

Quote from: Doug Jensen on May 08, 2024, 18:09
Hmmm, I guess Uncle Pete is ghosting me or he has no answer to a simple question. Either way, I think that confirms exactly what I thought about Wirestock.

Pete is busy promoting his crapstock portfolio...

here's what WS says

https://wirestock.io/about-us what we do

Yes and I actually work for a living sometimes, especially in the Summer.

Quote from: Doug Jensen on May 08, 2024, 18:09

Hmmm, I guess Uncle Pete is ghosting me or he has no answer to a simple question. Either way, I think that confirms exactly what I thought about Wirestock.

First part, I don't work for WS, I don't think their keywording is particularily good. It's visually descriptive, and we all know that without details, that wouldn't be as good as, the artist who knows.

They charge to have an account and take 15%, unless that changed. There's a 200 limit, but I'm pretty sure, with your reputation and history, if you said, I have 5,000 files... they would jump at the opportunity. Maybe for free and maybe, mail a hard drive, we'll do everything else.

I'm going to make my point, as a person and what I was trying to say TO YOU, not about WS or anything else.

If you have a pile of horse crap in one hand, and 5,000 files on a hard drive... which one is more? If you uploaded 5,000 files to WS and got 85% of whatever they make you, for doing nothing else but taking the time to upload them, or you have no account, no files and nothing. Which one is more valuable.

Stop nit picking at side issues and details, and expecting me to know WS business. I was simply saying, if you upload the files, they will get distributed to any of the places you select, and you'll make money. Which is? "more than what you have now which is nothing."

Now for myself and my motivation? I get $8 if you use the link. And some kind of pennies, if you get some downloads. I hope you make a million dollars, because I'd make...

1. When you refer a new contributor to Wirestock and they become a premium subscriber, you’ll instantly earn $8.

2. Additionally, you will earn ten percent (10%) of the total royalties generated by your referral for a full year. For example, if your referral earns $500 in royalties, you get an extra $50 in your pocket.

Important: Wirestock will pay you the referral commission from our share of the earnings (the 15%), so rest assured that your referral’s earnings will not be affected in any way. It’s a fantastic way to benefit from helping grow the Wirestock community!

I'm only in it for the money. https://wirestock.io?ref=peter.klinger Mercenary, money grubbing, promotion, referral link = https://wirestock.io?ref=peter.klinger

BTW here's more from WS about what they pay you.

https://wirestock.io/docs/faq?q=doYouHaveAReferral

"Why Do I Need Wirestock?

Selling on all major marketpaces from a single account is a unique feature that helps creators save time and boost sales by more than 10 times. In addition Wirestock’s one-of-a-kind “Easy Submission” tool takes the writing of metadata off of creators’ shoulders, filling out descriptions, titles, keywords, and other required fields for them. The required information will be filled out by Wirestock submission experts, so you will be getting top quality while boosting your sales in the meantime.

How Do I Get Paid?

Payment structure

You will get 85% of all royalties earned through Wirestock’s partner marketplaces. The earnings will be displayed on your dashboard. At the end of each month, you will be paid the total amount earned if the balance on your account exceeds the minimum payout amount."

Conclusion? You can make 85% by submitting the files, that are making nothing. And you are now making 100% of nothing, instead of 85% of something. If you make $1, it's more than nothing. You said you have 5,000 files, and no time to do anything with them. WS will do the data and distribution and pay you whenever you reach $30 in credit. (oh and the coolest part is, they will give me $3!)

Click here now, everyone, make me some money? https://wirestock.io?ref=peter.klinger

cascoly · « **Reply #209 on:** May 13, 2024, 15:18 »

note, though, you can't have them submit to any agency you've already submitted those images to

Roscoe · « **Reply #210 on:** May 14, 2024, 11:07 »

Quote from: cascoly on May 13, 2024, 15:18

note, though, you can't have them submit to any agency you've already submitted those images to

And you don't always have control over that. If they onboard a new agency and it's one that you are already submitting to via a personal account, you might end up in a situation where they submit images that are already there... and get accepted. Easy to miss such notification from them because their mails tend to end up in a spam folder or you just might be on holiday and miss it. I have that with Getty (via iStock on my personal account, and via Wirestock). And they sell via both channels. I haven't seen any consequences of that, but I guess theoretically it can happen that one of the accounts get suspended.

Anyhow, that's a situation you have with any distributor. Same with EyeEm in the past.

Uncle Pete · « **Reply #211 on:** May 14, 2024, 14:47 »

Quote from: Roscoe on May 14, 2024, 11:07

Quote from: cascoly on May 13, 2024, 15:18
note, though, you can't have them submit to any agency you've already submitted those images to

And you don't always have control over that. If they onboard a new agency and it's one that you are already submitting to via a personal account, you might end up in a situation where they submit images that are already there... and get accepted. Easy to miss such notification from them because their mails tend to end up in a spam folder or you just might be on holiday and miss it. I have that with Getty (via iStock on my personal account, and via Wirestock). And they sell via both channels. I haven't seen any consequences of that, but I guess theoretically it can happen that one of the accounts get suspended.

Anyhow, that's a situation you have with any distributor. Same with EyeEm in the past.

Yes, there's another negative. I don't know how or what I could do to end the 3¢ uses by Extra Channels. Maybe that was Evanto or ? They did add everything to IS when that came back online. I'm sure I have duplicates being sold under two accounts. Pond5 wrote me to say I either stole and image or mine was stolen, because two accounts have the same image. Guess what? It was mine from Wirestock.

Hasn't hurt me, but you are right, there is some lack of control. On the other hand, I won't pay to play, so only the oldest images from, upload everything and see what passed, when WS opened, is online. It's "everything" going back to about 2009.

AS, SS, I upload on my own. Which makes WS prefect for distribution of aging Microstock, where I don't have to have an account and wait 10 years to cash out. IS, AL, DT, I have some from both myself and WS.

There's my biggest attraction. Make $30, anywhere, any combination of agencies, get paid.

Sorry for the thread hijack: Shutterstock is an embarassment

dbvirago · « **Reply #212 on:** May 14, 2024, 18:19 »

Quote from: qunamax on July 03, 2023, 06:33

Quote from: stockman11 on June 23, 2023, 16:26
My SS earnings used to be 15x higher than now, and they just keep nosediving from month to month. Once a good earner, now abomination. Seems like it will join mid-tier agencies soon. Inexcusable.

During this same time, my Adobe Stock earnings has been growing, and Istock has been consistent.

I'm considering to start treating SS like the other mid-tier agencies and completely stop uploading there.

Identical experience for me too.

This. In the 20 years I've been doing this, I've never even considered an exclusive agreement, but if Adobe offered one, I'd drop the rest of them, inlcuding SS. They used to be 50% of my total revenue, now they are 10-20% while adobe is 60-80%.

YadaYadaYada · « **Reply #213 on:** May 15, 2024, 06:55 »

Quote from: dbvirago on May 14, 2024, 18:19

Quote from: qunamax on July 03, 2023, 06:33
Quote from: stockman11 on June 23, 2023, 16:26
My SS earnings used to be 15x higher than now, and they just keep nosediving from month to month. Once a good earner, now abomination. Seems like it will join mid-tier agencies soon. Inexcusable.

During this same time, my Adobe Stock earnings has been growing, and Istock has been consistent.

I'm considering to start treating SS like the other mid-tier agencies and completely stop uploading there.

Identical experience for me too.

This. In the 20 years I've been doing this, I've never even considered an exclusive agreement, but if Adobe offered one, I'd drop the rest of them, inlcuding SS. They used to be 50% of my total revenue, now they are 10-20% while adobe is 60-80%.

Nearly every sale now is a Single Other for 10 cents. Adobe will never offer exclusive, but if they did, I'm with you.

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #214 on:** May 15, 2024, 08:28 »

So far this month, I've had almost exactly the same number of downloads at Shutterstock as at Adobe.
The average sale at Adobe has been $11.60
The average sale at Shutterstock has been $16.47

That's about 40% more income for the same number of sales. Shutterstock isn't what it used to be, but it is still king.

wds · « **Reply #215 on:** May 15, 2024, 09:41 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on May 15, 2024, 08:28

So far this month, I've had almost exactly the same number of downloads at Shutterstock as at Adobe.
The average sale at Adobe has been $11.60
The average sale at Shutterstock has been $16.47

That's about 40% more income for the same number of sales. Shutterstock isn't what it used to be, but it is still king.

Just curious, are you in the USA?

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #216 on:** May 15, 2024, 09:59 »

Quote from: wds on May 15, 2024, 09:41

Just curious, are you in the USA?

Yes, why do you ask?

wds · « **Reply #217 on:** May 15, 2024, 11:25 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on May 15, 2024, 09:59

Quote from: wds on May 15, 2024, 09:41
Just curious, are you in the USA?

Yes, why do you ask?

Only because in other previous posts (by other stills photogs), there seemed to be a trend where US based Shutterstock contributors seemed to be complaining about dropping SS sales and contributors outside the US seemed to be happier with their SS results.

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #218 on:** May 15, 2024, 11:29 »

Quote from: wds on May 15, 2024, 11:25

Only because in other previous posts (by other stills photogs), there seemed to be a trend where US based Shutterstock contributors seemed to be complaining about dropping SS sales and contributors outside the US seemed to be happier with their SS results.

Just to be clear, I only sell video. Stills is a waste of time.
Nevertheless, I am also experiencing fewer sales and lower revenue at Shutterstock. On the other hand, Adobe is slowly rising, but still not as good as Shutterstock by total dollar volume or per-clip revenue.

wds · « **Reply #219 on:** May 15, 2024, 12:06 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on May 15, 2024, 11:29

Quote from: wds on May 15, 2024, 11:25
Only because in other previous posts (by other stills photogs), there seemed to be a trend where US based Shutterstock contributors seemed to be complaining about dropping SS sales and contributors outside the US seemed to be happier with their SS results.

Just to be clear, I only sell video. Stills is a waste of time.
Nevertheless, I am also experiencing fewer sales and lower revenue at Shutterstock. On the other hand, Adobe is slowly rising, but still not as good as Shutterstock by total dollar volume or per-clip revenue.

Interesting. I primarily sell stills....could be that at SS video (vs. other agencies) is holding it's own and it is on the stills side where SS seems to be doing seriously worse than AS.

trucic · « **Reply #220 on:** May 15, 2024, 12:57 »

… shutterstock was really a star, especially for video… but they slapped us hard, with those sub plans and royalties… they do sell, by quantity they do - but our part of cake have became a particle.. after years of nor uploading on both SS and AS, first one is going down and second rises even with lower portfolio size…

DanielVisuals · « **Reply #221 on:** May 15, 2024, 18:45 »

I wouldn't blame Shutterstock for the lowering of revenue. In my job exporting agricultural products, I understand the impact of market forces. The producers, like farmers and stock content creators, suffer the most from increased competition. Instead of blaming specific agencies, adapting to the market is essential.

Pacesetter · « **Reply #222 on:** May 15, 2024, 22:32 »

Here's how my sales are looking so far in May. Shutterstock was showing promise in April and even at the beginning of May, but has since slowed considerably. Shuttertock assets are (at this moment) 2586 videos and 1776 still images, while Adobe is 2135 videos and 1066 still images. iStock not represented as payment is yet to arrive.

Brasilnut · « **Reply #223 on:** May 16, 2024, 10:18 »

Shutterstock is indeed an embarassment but the rest of the industry show serious signs of terminal decline at least for my niche.

I've crunched some numbers since 2019 and the picture isn't pretty. Difficult to justify any sort of investment and upgrades with these results.

Key takeaways (SS only)
Port size 2019 (stills): 10,128
Port size May 2024 (still): 12, 297
Increase of 21%

Port size 2019 (clips): 1,030
Port size May 2024 (clips): 1,993
Increase of 94%

Now for my results, see below.

In summary, a decline from 2019 peak for clips of 60% on average downloads and 17% for stills.
Let's not forget that inflation from 2019 to 2024 is about 24% (US) or 4% a year on average.

Is it worth it as a business model for me, not really.

[email protected] · « **Reply #224 on:** May 16, 2024, 11:19 »

this month shutterstock slows down. anyone experience that ?

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Author Topic: Shutterstock is an embarassment (Read 30350 times)

Doug Jensen

Uncle Pete

Doug Jensen

Doug Jensen

Doug Jensen

cascoly

Doug Jensen

cascoly

Uncle Pete

cascoly

Roscoe

Uncle Pete

dbvirago

YadaYadaYada

Doug Jensen

wds

Doug Jensen

wds

Doug Jensen

wds

trucic

DanielVisuals

Pacesetter

Brasilnut

[email protected]

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