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Author Topic: SS rejecting for too soft, out of focus for all my Sony RX10 images  (Read 10780 times)

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Phadrea

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« on: February 05, 2015, 06:56 »
0
I am so frustrated as I have just purchased the excellent Sony RX10 (or so I thought was excellent after all the reviews) so I can get excellent video as well as stills. All shots submitted from this camera have been rejected for just

Focus--Subject is blurry, too soft, or out of focus when viewed at full resolution.

Even though I nailed the focus, got the confirmation beeps. Even in LR they look sharp enough but for some reason this camera does not fit their taste.

Tried posting an image here but when loaded all my text had gone blank.



« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2015, 07:23 »
0
You could post a full size image to dropbox and add a link here ?

+ if you save your processing (all steps) from RAW as a new preset you can export that as a .lrtemplate file - which is in a plain text format. That way you can quickly share the processing which will probably help people work out what you are getting wrong.

« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2015, 07:27 »
+4
RX10 has a really tiny sensor (13,2 x 8,8 mm), that may cause the problem. There isn't a lens in the world that will resolve 20 megapixels on that tiny area. There are reasons why people like cameras with full size (36 x 24 mm) sensors. (Or cameras with even larger sensor)

Sorry to ask this, do you know how a tack-sharp image looks at 100% on your screen?

My first idea is for you to make your images smaller, even the minimum size.

But you really need to post an example so we can be sure what this is about.

Phadrea

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« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2015, 07:30 »
0
Even with a small sensor camera you can still get a sharp image. Here is a Jpeg straight out of camera (I also shot Raw)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/22xozknmb2mky3z/DSC00597.JPG?dl=0


If you read this guy's blogs ( and look at his images) on the RX10 he seems to think it's up to the job as a pro camera.

http://visualsciencelab.blogspot.co.uk/2014/01/the-first-sniff-test-with-sony-rx10.html

I just want to confirm it's a camera issue and not SS being picky as they sometimes can be, even with my trusty Nikon D200.

« Last Edit: February 05, 2015, 07:35 by Herg »

Semmick Photo

« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2015, 08:03 »
+7
I'd say the middle part of the pipe is acceptable focus, borderline, but the top right corner is indeed out of focus which can happen. Softness in the corners even happens on a 24-70L II.

However, its a 20MP image, I would downsize to say 12MP and it will pass for sure.

PS:  I downsize all my images to 12MP. Big enough for 25-38 cent.  ;)

Phadrea

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« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2015, 08:12 »
0
Thanks for the feedback and info. Could you please tell me how I do this in Lightroom ?

PaulieWalnuts

  • On the Wrong Side of the Business
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2015, 08:15 »
+4
I'd say the quality and sharpness looks very good. Maybe they don't like the subject and are just using sharpness as an easy out.

« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2015, 08:19 »
0
corners are too damaged, you need to crop this image, lens @ 2,8 are not  good enough , blur is too noisy, maybe iso 50?, learn lightroom first , buy new camera, dont upload this image, maybe it will 2 or 3 times sold, image should be sold 20x, sorry.....

Semmick Photo

« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2015, 08:24 »
+2
Thanks for the feedback and info. Could you please tell me how I do this in Lightroom ?
On the image, right click

Export > image sizing

There is a drop down menu with different options

Phadrea

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« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2015, 09:15 »
0
corners are too damaged, you need to crop this image, lens @ 2,8 are not  good enough , blur is too noisy, maybe iso 50?, learn lightroom first , buy new camera, dont upload this image, maybe it will 2 or 3 times sold, image should be sold 20x, sorry.....

The lens is supposed to be sharp corner to corner. It was taken 125 iso. Not sure what you mean by "buy a new camera". You will be surprised what random images I have taken sell on SS. Stuff you just wouldn't think which is why I shoot all subjects. I also did a closer shot of the pipe.

« Reply #10 on: February 05, 2015, 09:21 »
0
The lens is supposed to be sharp corner to corner. It was taken 125 iso.

Yes but the lens is wide open and, more importantly, you are focused relatively close. So that means a very narrow depth of focus. Even with the tiny sensor. And the subject matter is not all in one plane - so some is in focus and some is on the edge of focus. Also - lenses are seldom sharp corner to corner wide open.

ETA: I realise that I am talking about focus when this is actually about sharpness.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2015, 09:23 by bunhill »

Phadrea

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« Reply #11 on: February 05, 2015, 09:37 »
0
Thanks for the feedback and info. Could you please tell me how I do this in Lightroom ?
On the image, right click

Export > image sizing

There is a drop down menu with different options

thanks

Phadrea

    This user is banned.
« Reply #12 on: February 05, 2015, 09:45 »
0
Thanks for the feedback and info. Could you please tell me how I do this in Lightroom ?
On the image, right click

Export > image sizing

There is a drop down menu with different options

So I type in (12) in the megapixels box. And (240) pixels per inch. I render this smaller size jpeg and compare to normal size and can't see any visible difference. Should I ?
« Last Edit: February 05, 2015, 09:49 by Herg »

Beppe Grillo

« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2015, 09:52 »
0
Considering that with such a camera as the Sony RX10 you will never get the quality of a full frame camera with a same image size, my advice is to over-sharp a little your full size images in post production (smart sharp in Photoshop does miracles) and then export the images no more than 8 or 10 MPixels (as shown above by Semmick Photo).


« Reply #14 on: February 05, 2015, 10:01 »
+3
I'd say the quality and sharpness looks very good. Maybe they don't like the subject and are just using sharpness as an easy out.

Looks ok to me too, although I do see some oversharpening halo around the upper parts.

Phadrea

    This user is banned.
« Reply #15 on: February 05, 2015, 10:06 »
0
 That's strange because I opted for sharpening to be off. I shot jpeg and RAW just to see how the RX10 made jpegs. I opted for vivid though. This image has not been touched in LR, only the RAW version which was submitted.

If I can get near to the Nikon D200 quality I will be happy but perhaps this is going to be my first camera for video and second as stills. The D200  (when sensor has been cleaned) will be my main for quality as it seems more reliable. Shame.

Thanks for the feedback and suggestions.

« Reply #16 on: February 05, 2015, 10:13 »
+1
That's strange because I opted for sharpening to be off. I shot jpeg and RAW just to see how the RX10 made jpegs. I opted for vivid though. This image has not been touched in LR, only the RAW version which was submitted.

If I can get near to the Nikon D200 quality I will be happy but perhaps this is going to be my first camera for video and second as stills. The D200  (when sensor has been cleaned) will be my main for quality as it seems more reliable. Shame.

Thanks for the feedback and suggestions.

If the rx10 is anything like my rx100 III there is no way to turn off in-camera sharpening of JPEGs. Same goes for the very heavy-handed noise reduction. Shoot Raw.


« Reply #17 on: February 05, 2015, 10:18 »
+2
For what it's worth I nearly always find that the output from my  RX100 (same sensor) needs a touch of sharpening to appear "sharp" to me.
ETA I nearly always shoot RAW.

Phadrea

    This user is banned.
« Reply #18 on: February 05, 2015, 11:07 »
0
Yes I always shoot RAW and edit in Lightroom. The RX100 has the same sensor but not the same lens. The Zeis on the RX10 is in another league, or so I hope.

« Reply #19 on: February 05, 2015, 11:22 »
+1
Zeiss on the rx100 as well. I don't know if there's much to choose between them in that way apart from the rx10's much greater zoom range, and the rx100's bigger aperture.
I'd assumed that part of the slight softness thing (and it is only slight IMO) was to do with tending to shoot at at bigger apertures. 

OM

« Reply #20 on: February 05, 2015, 20:04 »
0
I'd say the middle part of the pipe is acceptable focus, borderline, but the top right corner is indeed out of focus which can happen. Softness in the corners even happens on a 24-70L II.

However, its a 20MP image, I would downsize to say 12MP and it will pass for sure.

PS:  I downsize all my images to 12MP. Big enough for 25-38 cent.  ;)

Agree with Ron. For shot in bright sunlight, middle of shot is borderline acceptable @100% with softness in corners. Maybe worth resubmission when downsized but beware SS review tends to dislike black shadows and may fault the image on all manner of other factors (if they don't like it)!

Once had an image rejected on poor isolation which wasn't isolated but had a 'line' in the image from use of a rendering filter (starburst effect). So, I removed the offending line and said that it was due to a filter rather than isolation and resubmitted. I can only assume that my contradicting their assumption of poor isolation got the image sent directly to Attila who came back with the following:

Quote
Focus--Subject is blurry, too soft, or out of focus when viewed at full resolution.
Noise--Image contains excessive noise, grain, artifacts and/or is poorly rasterized.
Lighting Problems--Image contains color fringing and/or inappropriate lens flares.
Poor Lighting--Image has exposure issues, unfavorable lighting conditions, and/or incorrect white balance


In other words.....please throw this image away. It is irretrievable (or words to that effect).

« Reply #21 on: February 05, 2015, 20:19 »
+2
IMHO there is nothing wrong with that photo.

Rinderart

« Reply #22 on: February 05, 2015, 21:22 »
0
reviewers as you know look at 100%. I can't comment without that. everything looks fine in a print that size. Also I would lose the vivid setting, It overloads the sensor. if ya want it to pop, Just use levels or a bit of luminosity in PS/Match color.

« Reply #23 on: February 06, 2015, 01:21 »
+1
I have used the RX10 for stock images for one year. The image quality is plenty good, but you can't look at it as a 20MP camera. Downsize to 12MP or a bit less, and you'll be fine.

Semmick Photo

« Reply #24 on: February 06, 2015, 02:23 »
0
reviewers as you know look at 100%. I can't comment without that. everything looks fine in a print that size.
its a full res 20mp image. How can you not check that at 100%?


 

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