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eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« on: November 03, 2009, 21:23 »
0
Hello,

I am looking for an acceptable photography monitor somewhere around 21-24". I have read I should look for IPS panels (or maybe PVA).
I have found these:


22 inches:
(all 1680x1050)

Dell UltraSharp 22 inch
250$
IPS
http://accessories.dell.com/sna/products/Displays/productdetail.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=bsd&cs=cabsdt1&sku=320-7825

NEC EA series 22 inch
300$
IPS
http://www.necdisplay.com/Products/Product/?product=223ad6db-baf6-46db-82e8-bfb2571cf178


23/24 inches:
(all 1920x1200)

Samsung F2380
350$
cPVA
http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/office/monitors/professional/LS23NVTABW/ZA/index.idx?pagetype=prd_detail&tab=spec

NEC EA series 24 inch
450$
IPS
http://www.necdisplay.com/Products/Product/?product=223ad6db-baf6-46db-82e8-bfb2571cf178

Philips 240PW9EB
480$
IPS
http://www.p4c.philips.com/files/2/240pw9eb_27/240pw9eb_27_pss_aen.pdf

HP LP2475w
570$
IPS
http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/us/en/en/WF05a/382087-382087-64283-72270-3884471-3648442.html

Samsung 245T
600$
cPVA
http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/office/monitors/professional/LS24HUCEFV/XAA/index.idx?pagetype=prd_detail&tab=spec

Dell Ultrasharp 24 inch
750$
IPS
http://accessories.dell.com/sna/products/Monitors/productdetail.aspx?c=ca&l=en&s=bsd&cs=cabsdt1&sku=320-8277

NEC LCD2490WUXi2 24 inch
950$
IPS
http://www.necdisplay.com/Products/Product/?product=29d41c3a-c07c-4dda-a199-13b8823de971


26 inches:
(all 1680x1050)

Acer AL2616Wd
620$
IPS or PVA (?)
http://www.acer.ca/acer/product.do?link=oln85e.redirect&changedAlts=&kcond48e.c2att101=-1&CRC=2759084358#wrAjaxHistory=0


It seems the 22 inchers are good deals and the first of the 24 inches... but is cPVA good for photography? Which experience do you have with the two different resolutions? (I already have 1680x1050 on my 15.4" laptop screen, so I am kind of worried that it will look too big on a bigger screen) Are the monitors at these prices ok for photography? the more expensive ones here, say the 750$ and 900$ ones are actually very expensive for me...

Thanks!
Simone
« Last Edit: November 04, 2009, 01:12 by simsi »


« Reply #1 on: November 03, 2009, 21:43 »
0
I have this one which has good reviews:

It came wioth my desktop system and the 1920x1080 resolution is very nice.  Be sure to have a look at monitor calibrators as well.
http://www.gateway.com/systems/product/529668278.php

« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2009, 22:11 »
0
Hi Simsi,

I vould look for PVA panel, they are beter (more money)
I have Samsung SyncMaster 244T and I am very happy with it
I think this one is same just new design
Samsung 245T
600$
cPVA
http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/office/monitors/professional/LS24HUCEFV/XAA/index.idx?pagetype=prd_detail&tab=spec

Good luck

Kone

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2009, 22:25 »
0
oh really, i thought IPS was better than PVA?
yeah....600$ is approx. my upper limit. is that monitor really good? or is a cheaper one sufficient?

« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2009, 22:51 »
0
oh really, i thought IPS was better than PVA?
yeah....600$ is approx. my upper limit. is that monitor really good? or is a cheaper one sufficient?

It is good monitor

"Re IPS or PVA"
pva if fine in my opinion if your not a gamer (than go with IPS)
Both will give you an 8 bit true color. However professional PVA monitors can display 10 or more bits to give you a larger color palette. PVA tends to have higher contrast and richer blacks than IPS, but have low refresh rate.

You really can't go wrong with IPS or PVA, but just don't go with TN. MVA is the cheaper solution of IPS and PVA with true 8 bit color, but they aren't as popular.


Kone

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2009, 22:58 »
0
hm...so the quality order is

TN - PVA - IPS

??

then why here the IPS ones are cheaper? OK i found very expensive IPS ones (i think they had 10 or 12 bit or so!!), but in this price range it seems PVA is more expensive.

I have also seen the Acer AL2616wd for 620$. It is 26 inches for the price of the Samsung 245T and would substitute my TV  ;D

noone has any experience with these cheap ips ones?

Simoen

« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2009, 23:02 »
0
oh really, i thought IPS was better than PVA?
yeah....600$ is approx. my upper limit. is that monitor really good? or is a cheaper one sufficient?


 TN Film, MVA, PVA and IPS

 
Panel Technologies
 
TN Film (Twisted Nematic + Film)

With their fast response times, TN Film panels are arguably the most responsive in the market today. Response times of 4ms G2G and under are common place. Black depth is not quite as good as VA panel types, but has improved significantly in recent times, aided further by the introduction of high dynamic contrast ratios. Colour accuracy is very good with proper calibration; however some people are put off by the 6-bit colour depth. Modern FRC methods and improved panels make TN Film still pretty decent in terms of colour accuracy, but remain behind VA and IPS panels. Movie noise is often a problem, especially where overdrive technologies are excessively used, or implemented with poor control. Perhaps the most obvious down-fall of TN Film is the restrictive viewing angles, especially vertically. TN Film based displays are normally very cost effective however, and dominate most sectors up to and including the 22 range.

MVA (Multi-Domain Vertical Alignment)

MVA panels offer typically very good black depth, a notch above TN Film. The viewing angles are also greatly improved, and are wide in both horizontal and vertical fields. Colour depth is nearly always a true 8-bit, with no need for FRC methods. Colour accuracy is very good, and movie playback is probably the smoothest and least prone to noise' on MVA based matrices. Response times are decent with modern overdrive methods, but not quite as fast as TN Film panels. MVA screens are considered very good all round. Viewing angles are slightly inferior to IPS panels however, and a characteristic contrast shift can be seen as you move your line of sight off-centre. This is why IPS panels are considered more suitable for colour critical work, and are more widely used in professional display ranges. Premium-MVA (P-MVA) and Super-MVA (S-MVA) are variants of this technology and represent the modern generation of such panels. AdvancedMVA (AMVA ) is very new, and is designed to offer the next generation of improvements in this technology.

PVA (Patterned Vertical Alignment)

Samsung's own version of VA matrices, offering very similar characteristics to MVA based screens. Movie noise is more accentuated however, and overdrive control is more variable. Black depth is very good; arguably the best in the market, and again PVA panels are pretty decent all round. Super-PVA (S-PVA) panels represent the latest generation of PVA screens and feature some improvements over the older PVA panels.

IPS (In Plane Switching)

IPS and Super-IPS (S-IPS) panels are well regarded at the moment. They offer the widest viewing angles in the market, and are superior in this regard to VA matrices. They do not suffer from the off-centre colour / contrast shift of VA panels and are commonly used in colour critical professional displays as a result. Response times are variable, but some modern overdriven panels are very responsive in practice, even being comparable to the fastest TN Film panels. Colour depth is 8-bit and colour accuracy is very good. Black depth is not as good as VA based displays, but modern dynamic contrast control has improved performance in this area for multimedia application. IPS based screens are typically the most expensive however, but some modern panels are very good all round. Movie playback is noisy in most cases, and a step behind MVA panels.
 
 
See more here:
http://www.pureoverclock.com/review.php?id=641&page=3

Kone ;D

« Reply #7 on: November 03, 2009, 23:15 »
0
I have the Dell 2209wa and couldn't be happier with it.just perfect value for the money and I'd certainly  recommend it!

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2009, 01:14 »
0
first of all: thanks for your incredibly useful post(s)!!! Now I really understand more.

It seems for pure photographers IPS is the choice. For people that also watch movies, PVA seems better.
For me I guess both is fine. I am watching movies, yes, but I am not a purist tracking down all the noise and rattle and so on :-) I just enjoy the movie.


hm... i am now trying to narrow down my options...

either taking a 22 inch cheap one like the Dell - or taking the Samsung 245T, which is big and good. And then I also found the Acer 26 inches at the same price of the 24ers, it seems its either IPS or PVA.

What do you think about this? Isn't a 26 inches monitor too big?

thank you!
simone
« Last Edit: November 04, 2009, 01:16 by simsi »

« Reply #9 on: November 04, 2009, 07:39 »
0
first of all: thanks for your incredibly useful post(s)!!! Now I really understand more.

It seems for pure photographers IPS is the choice. For people that also watch movies, PVA seems better.
For me I guess both is fine. I am watching movies, yes, but I am not a purist tracking down all the noise and rattle and so on :-) I just enjoy the movie.


hm... i am now trying to narrow down my options...

either taking a 22 inch cheap one like the Dell - or taking the Samsung 245T, which is big and good. And then I also found the Acer 26 inches at the same price of the 24ers, it seems its either IPS or PVA.

What do you think about this? Isn't a 26 inches monitor too big?

thank you!
simone

Well

What do you think about this? Isn't a 26 inches monitor too big?
It is your call
For my taste .... yea bit to big but if you use it as tv as well - maybe not

Kone

« Reply #10 on: November 04, 2009, 08:30 »
0
What are you using for a graphics card? No point in having a high res monitor if your card cant handle the resolution.  I for one am quite happy with my 23" monitor and 1920x1080 resolution.

vonkara

« Reply #11 on: November 04, 2009, 11:15 »
0
22-23-24 inches is way enough for being comfortable. I don't have a beast as graphic card and it handle the highest resolution perfectly.

 Then I don't think it will be a problem, as long as your graphic card handle the software features. As example I use photoshop 6.0 at full resolution, which have been released in 2000. When I use PS CS4 my editing is almost 2x slower.

Personally I would go with Samsung's LCD. But I am already sold to them as either my Hd television and computer screen is this brand. Acer, HP, Dell are also good brands.

Mine is only 3000:1 of contrast and it work good for now, you can get way better contrast now in 2009, which allow you in part to have a better view at noise
« Last Edit: November 04, 2009, 11:20 by Vonkara »

« Reply #12 on: November 04, 2009, 12:56 »
0
I got the Samsung 245T last year and I love it.  It was just plug and play with my Mac.


« Reply #13 on: November 04, 2009, 14:30 »
0
I just picked up a Dell ultrasharp 2408wfp (24") on eBay for about $350 after cashback, brand new. It's not latest version but with great ratings.

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #14 on: November 04, 2009, 16:03 »
0
oh well yeah I didn't mention that these prices are Canadian.......
ebay from the US will cost me import taxes in addition. :-( why can't i live in the us??? (Ok canada is better heheheh)

lisafx

« Reply #15 on: November 04, 2009, 17:10 »
0

I have Samsung SyncMaster 244T and I am very happy with it
I think this one is same just new design
Samsung 245T
600$
cPVA
http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/office/monitors/professional/LS24HUCEFV/XAA/index.idx?pagetype=prd_detail&tab=spec


I agree on the Samsung.  I have the 244T also and it is really excellent quality - accurate colors and very clear detail.   I paid around $1,000 for it.  

If you can get the 245T for $600 you should jump on it!  

FWIW the highest end Dells (ultrasharp) are not nearly as good according to reviews I have read.  I got the 244t based on comparison reviews in 2 different photography magazines. 

If you are serious about imaging your monitor is your most important piece of equipment after your camera (maybe even more important).  If you can't accurately see color and detail you will have a rough time getting images accepted.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2009, 17:15 by lisafx »

« Reply #16 on: November 04, 2009, 17:44 »
0
I agree that Canada is better, but Im biased.  You could check Vistek (Canadian company) online and see if they have monitors.  They ship free in Canada.  BTW if you ever do get anything shipped in from the U.S. avoid UPS like the plague because they will gouge you something fierce with their brokerage fees!  USPS is far better and you'll only have to pay GST and PST.
BTW if you order from Vistek you only pay GST.

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #17 on: November 04, 2009, 18:15 »
0
Hi eppic,

actually I am in Quebec....vivent les taxes....
i have never understood this completely. when i order online i have to check where i live, and taxes are calculated accordingly. but sometimes i only get charged the 5% (i think that is GST)! how come? how can i do that, which shops are like this and which not? (for a monitor this means a lot of difference).
sorry the stupid question. I am Austrian originally. We have our taxes included everywhere, and you pay what is written, always. Now that's much easier!!!!

BTW the monitors at Vistek are horribly expensive! Except a few Eizo FlexScan ones, are they good?

Simone

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #18 on: November 04, 2009, 18:22 »
0
so...i am coming down to either a cheap monitor (22"), Dell Ultrasharp 2209WA, 250$, or something like the 245T, 650$.
is it worth the huge difference?
what the 245T has that the other one doesn't is higher resolution, bigger size, and HDMI. I can't imagine a 22 inch monitor with 1680x1080... it's the resolution of my 15 inch laptop!

« Reply #19 on: November 04, 2009, 20:18 »
0
oh well yeah I didn't mention that these prices are Canadian.......
ebay from the US will cost me import taxes in addition. :-( why can't i live in the us??? (Ok canada is better heheheh)

Hey I am Canadian too

Kone

« Reply #20 on: November 04, 2009, 20:22 »
0
I'm in Ontario. If you have "Canada Computers" in Quebec, they have the cheapest prices for the Samsung 245T.

I ordered mine in the store, then picked it up. I was just slightly over $600. ($628 taxes in rings a bell).

You can order from them online and they might deliver it to a local store? But they were definitely the cheapest.

« Reply #21 on: November 04, 2009, 20:26 »
0
I'm in Ontario. If you have "Canada Computers" in Quebec, they have the cheapest prices for the Samsung 245T.

I ordered mine in the store, then picked it up. I was just slightly over $600. ($628 taxes in rings a bell).

You can order from them online and they might deliver it to a local store? But they were definitely the cheapest.

Same here

Kone

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #22 on: November 05, 2009, 00:43 »
0
Canada Computers looks cool. We don't have that in Quebec, but they ship here and I checked, I'd only pay GST, yay!
But they don't have the 245T in the list. :-( And none of the others I liked.

I found Mike's computers, that's in BC and I also only pay GST, moreover no shipping, so allover it's 635$...
https://www.mikescomputershop.com/syncmaster-245t-wide-black-p-2518.html

What do you think?
However, there is still the cheapo 22 inch option. I really don't know what to choose...

Thanks for all your suggestions!!
« Last Edit: November 05, 2009, 00:55 by simsi »

« Reply #23 on: November 05, 2009, 01:35 »
0
I would just go with the cheaper dell. I doubt there is a big enough difference to warrant spending an extra $380. Hell you could get 2 of the dells for that. Certainly that would be better for most people.

« Reply #24 on: November 05, 2009, 08:24 »
0
You could also check out henrys.com or tigerdirect; they're both Canadian. Mike's computers is a small franchise out here in BC where I live.  About the taxes; GST is federal so that tax applies no matter where in Canada you live.  PST is provincial only, so if you order something online and you dont reside in the province where the product is being shipped from, the PST doesnt apply to you because you dont reside in that province, so thats why they ask you where you live.
You could also check out futureshop online as they also have online shopping and give you the option of either shipping it to your door or you can pick it up at your local store.

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #25 on: November 05, 2009, 08:56 »
0
yeah, i think you are right. the only thing about the dell is the low resolution....
so what do you think about these two? they're 23 inch, so already have the higher resolution and are IPS/PVA, and are at reasonable price.


Samsung F2380
300$
cPVA
http://www.samsung.com/us/consumer/office/monitors/professional/LS23NVTABW/ZA/index.idx?pagetype=prd_detail&tab=spec

NEC EA series 24 inch
480$
IPS
http://www.necdisplay.com/Products/Product/?product=223ad6db-baf6-46db-82e8-bfb2571cf178


A 22/23 inch at reasonable price with IPS/PVA could be perfect I guess.

Thank you!
Simone
« Last Edit: November 05, 2009, 09:04 by simsi »

lisafx

« Reply #26 on: November 05, 2009, 08:57 »
0

What do you think?
However, there is still the cheapo 22 inch option. I really don't know what to choose...


Are you buying this monitor for general use or specifically for imaging?  

For general use the Dell or the other cheapos would probably be perfectly adequate.  

If you are buying it specifically for imaging then you will most likely want to get the 245T.  At a minimum.  It is by far the cheapest monitor that has graphics quality.

vonkara

« Reply #27 on: November 05, 2009, 09:42 »
0
Why shipping the product when you can get it everywhere at Future shop or best buy?

Futureshop
http://www.futureshop.ca/FSStoreLocator/Cities.asp?prov=Quebec&logon=&langid=EN

Best buy
http://www.bestbuy.ca/FSStoreLocator/Cities.asp?prov=QC&logon=&langid=FR
« Last Edit: November 05, 2009, 09:43 by Vonkara »

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #28 on: November 05, 2009, 10:05 »
0
lisafx: i buy this for imaging... yes, you are right. others said the quality of the cheaper ones is also ok, and they are also IPS panels, so I thought it was fine...

Vonkara: Bestbuy and Futureshop don't really have those monitor models. :-( they're too much consumer oriented...

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #29 on: November 05, 2009, 17:36 »
0

« Reply #30 on: November 05, 2009, 18:26 »
0
LisaFX is correct!!  If its for imaging, then the Samsung 245T is a good choice. Don't cheap out if you are using it to process photos for stock. You might be sorry.

Good luck. Regards
Penny :o)

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #31 on: November 05, 2009, 19:30 »
0
what ..... i took it, ordered right now. now you need to be proud of me, otherwise i will only think of my bank account shrinking! :(

« Reply #32 on: November 05, 2009, 22:00 »
0
what ..... i took it, ordered right now. now you need to be proud of me, otherwise i will only think of my bank account shrinking! :(

And?!
What
Samsung 245T??!??

Kone

« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2009, 05:57 »
0
what ..... i took it, ordered right now. now you need to be proud of me, otherwise i will only think of my bank account shrinking! :(

Does it really matter for stock !?  Are are you printing for exhibition ??  I wonder ?   :-\

And now you'll need a Calibrator !!!  More money !  :o

lisafx

« Reply #34 on: November 06, 2009, 10:49 »
0
what ..... i took it, ordered right now. now you need to be proud of me, otherwise i will only think of my bank account shrinking! :(

Congratulations Simsi!  I am sure you won't be disappointed. 

Besides, the great pictures you will upload and sell will pay for it.  And you can also write it off as a business expense on your taxes :D

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #35 on: November 06, 2009, 14:30 »
0
oh no, they ran out of the monitor and my order was cancelled - more time to think...lol ;D

anyway I already do have a calibrator....

« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2009, 14:50 »
0
try here... they have a couple of open box specials and it was only $25. to ship to Ontario.

http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=28369&promoid=1087&srccode=cii_6580890&cpncode=18-6141715

Good luck.

P

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #37 on: November 06, 2009, 14:58 »
0
oh wow thanks...unfortunately it seems not available, open box neither. never mind, I'll find a solution. :) mike's computers gets them next week (i called) and ships for free, so it is just 635$ overall.


 

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