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Author Topic: Is it the end of microstock and royalty free  (Read 6687 times)

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RacePhoto

« on: March 09, 2011, 05:22 »
0
Perfect end to the day, a fear mongering message from some French photo union and who knows it might actually happen!

http://blog.melchersystem.com/2011/03/05/the-last-salvo/

Take that Fotolia?

Royalty free, in French, is translated by libre de droits, brutally translated to Free of any kind of rights. Maitre Jean Vincent explains that definition is deceptive and not true : Royalty free images are neither rights free nor free of royalties.

And more. Read the blog and wonder is this for real?


lagereek

« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2011, 05:48 »
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The French are a bit akward on just about everything. Ive done assignment work there many times and to put it frankly, they are a DIFFICULT nation in just about everything.
Having said that, it wouldnt at all surprise me if this happens, the danger is if other countries follow. As you say, not an economicaaly orientated economy, thats true so I can hardly see this even being a debate in English speaking countries, Germany and Scandinavia.

« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2011, 06:40 »
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the danger is if other countries follow.

How is this a danger?

ShadySue

« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2011, 06:57 »
0
Perfect end to the day, a fear mongering message from some French photo union and who knows it might actually happen!

http://blog.melchersystem.com/2011/03/05/the-last-salvo/

Take that Fotolia?

Royalty free, in French, is translated by libre de droits, brutally translated to Free of any kind of rights. Maitre Jean Vincent explains that definition is deceptive and not true : Royalty free images are neither rights free nor free of royalties.

And more. Read the blog and wonder is this for real?

The phrase 'royalty free' is indeed misleading for exactly the reasons stated. I've always thought that.

« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2011, 06:58 »
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It is possible the French will win a few battles but ultimately; they will lose the war.  In the process, the RF sites will have even more reason to cut our fees just to claim they need money to fight these court battles.

RT


« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2011, 07:16 »
0
All that might happen is that there will be a huge waste of both time and money which may possibly result in Royalty Free images being referred to as something different in France.

Or in other words - It walks like a duck, it quacks like a duck but to keep the french happy lets call it a cow.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2011, 07:20 by RT »

« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2011, 07:23 »
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Even if the photog union prevails, and even if this spreads to all nations and kills microstock as we know it, some other form of low-price image selling will emerge and fill the void.

Whenever I find myself wondering what the future holds for this little industry, I think of two things:

1. The world will continue to rely more and more on visual communication, rather than written.  Does anyone think there will be some monumental shift back to words describing everything, rather than powerful images -- either still photos or moving video?  No, good images will be in demand more and more, all around the world.

2.  As people in western countries as well as developing countries form their own businesses, they'll need images to get their messages out, and will they be able to afford high-priced images and video?  No, there will need to be low-priced options for finding the pictures they need.

So, a rising demand for images plus a demand for low prices = a need for a cost-effective option like microstock.  Even if somehow microstock crashes and burns tomorrow, something similar will rise from the ashes to replace it.  And whatever this new business is, it will need our images to succeed.

« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2011, 07:40 »
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Or in other words - It walks like a duck, it quacks like a duck but to keep the french happy lets call it a cow.

+1  COW ;D  (Mooooo-Qwack)





"French Fries"; "French Toast"

lagereek

« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2011, 07:51 »
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Must also be a French speaking duck or cow, since English is banned in France.

« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2011, 07:55 »
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I haven't checked the link but in BR and PT Fotolia sites also the translation reads "free of rights". But then wouldn't a common person also think that "royalty free" means free to use?

« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2011, 08:07 »
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This is nothing!!!

If i can sell any other artwork then I can sell my photo too...
And what mean professional??? Someone gave my certificate of quality or when I can live from my work... And who can give me such certificat?
Today every ethusiast can be better than anyone who produce certificates for "arts"
If my photographs can be threat to  professional work, then I am professional  too...

Price is problem...?
If the buyer decides for a cheaper version than for the "professional" ,its mean that is more regular valuation in relation to the quality ...
What does it mean that "professionals"  want to over-estimate the value of their work and somehow robbing customers because the price does not justify the difference in quality ...
They want a "premium" for their work, which becomes impossible in today's information world ....

Coming time with better valuation between effort, resources and final products.. ...
A lot of them in other activities enjoyed undeserved premium but every day less and less...

P.S.

States need taxes, rather than the protection of "self-styled or self-called professionals artists"" who often live at the expense of taxpayers ...
« Last Edit: March 09, 2011, 08:14 by borg »

ShadySue

« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2011, 08:19 »
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Must also be a French speaking duck or cow, since English is banned in France.
French ducks say 'coin coin', French cows all just laugh, AFAIK.  ;)

« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2011, 08:22 »
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All that might happen is that there will be a huge waste of both time and money which may possibly result in Royalty Free images being referred to as something different in France.

Or in other words - It walks like a duck, it quacks like a duck but to keep the french happy lets call it a cow.

Right.  Just because they can't translate something correctly...

« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2011, 08:42 »
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Just call it something else and keep giving me money - big deal.

« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2011, 09:07 »
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Some people need a bit of historical context. The first IP treaty was the Paris Convention and US only signed to a treaty like this 20 years later.

« Reply #15 on: March 09, 2011, 09:07 »
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Must also be a French speaking duck or cow, since English is banned in France.
French ducks say 'coin coin', French cows all just laugh, AFAIK.  ;)

What a cheesy joke !

« Reply #16 on: March 09, 2011, 09:37 »
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This is stupid. It's about what words mean:

1. the french word for free - as in zero price - is gratuit.
2. Libre means the state of being free - as in set free.
3. droits can mean both rights (as in how an image can be used) and rights (as in royalties). Because in France royalties are called droit d'auteur. Rights can mean royalties.

When you buy a royalty free (libres de droits) image you are buying an image which is, from then on, royalty free -- as in from then on you can use it without paying further royalties. That's what you get. Before you buy it it isn't. In that sense it is gratuit rather than libre. But it is surely also fair to say that it is libre (as in set free) from further royalties.

I believe that if these people were to force to be renamed than that would have potential implications for any other use of the word libre in France. For example self service shops in France are described as libre service.


microstockphoto.co.uk

« Reply #17 on: March 09, 2011, 10:17 »
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"Droits" in French, "Diritti" in Italian, all mean "Royalties" so the translation is no more ambiguous than the original "Royalty Free". The German "Lizenzfrei" has its own ambiguity as well, as one may think that a licence is not needed at all, not even once. So yes, we need a better name, but maybe it's too late.

But besides the "royalty-free" issue, I find this part the most interesting:

"if one was to purchase one image on Istockphoto for lets say $5 and use this image for a book, a magazine, an ad campaign, a brochure, on a TV set, in a Movie set, over and over again for 70 years ( life of a copyright), it would amount for less than a cent per usage. Under this law, that pricing is so low that it would not constitute a sale. Thus become illegal. Furthermore, even a third party, not involve in the transaction, can bring this sale to court and have it voided. Nothing in France can be sold for a derisory price, even if both parties accept."

They won't certainly be able to stop microstock, but if they help bringing a bit of awareness that prices are way too low, then it's good for us, not a danger at all.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2011, 10:35 by microstockphoto.co.uk »

« Reply #18 on: March 09, 2011, 10:51 »
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I think that article addresses the same issues everyone here on msg complains about in a slightly different way and a lot of you seem to complain about the french. It seems to me that the french value the right to make a living off your work in your trade and the rf model has a serious problem. It is too cheap now to make a living off for most of photographers.

Look at Sean's example of uploading 2000 photos last year and still no growth on downloads on istock. That is a scary statistic. Means more competition. A lot of RM shooters are doing rf grudgingly since this is where the buyers ultimately are now.

« Reply #19 on: March 09, 2011, 11:38 »
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Well, at least one person will have success (money) from this: the lawyer.

« Reply #20 on: March 09, 2011, 12:26 »
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Must also be a French speaking duck or cow, since English is banned in France.
French ducks say 'coin coin', French cows all just laugh, AFAIK.  ;)

What a cheesy joke !

Huge groan!!

« Reply #21 on: March 09, 2011, 19:29 »
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Just call it something else and keep giving me money - big deal.


+1
LOL

~ Eli
www.graphicgravy.com

RacePhoto

« Reply #22 on: March 09, 2011, 20:41 »
0
Or in other words - It walks like a duck, it quacks like a duck but to keep the french happy lets call it a cow.

+1  COW ;D  (Mooooo-Qwack)

"French Fries"; "French Toast"

I don't think the French "Moock" will fly. It was just interesting and odd.

["Better off Dead" - very funny movie]

OM

« Reply #23 on: March 10, 2011, 18:55 »
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Need to call RF something akin to 'WORM'.......Write Once Read Many. :D

Buy Once Use Many, Buy Once Use Infinitely, Pay Little Use Infinitely Evermore.........should go down well with the French 'PLUIE' which would make their group ParaPLUIE.  ;)

Dunno why they would single out Fotolia. It's a US registered corporation just like most of the rest. Anyway their little group can jump up and down all they like, any decision against RF would have to go eventually to the EU Court and they won't win there.

« Reply #24 on: March 10, 2011, 19:56 »
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Hi All,

 If we ever shoot in France we have to fly in non french models because of the countries opt out option. Even if you get a model release in France from a French model they have the right to come back later and change their minds or sue you. Beautiful country but their laws keep us shooting in other parts of Europe. Just to many hassles with the French government.

Best,
Jonathan


 

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