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Author Topic: Kodak gets into blockchain/cryptocurrencies  (Read 6634 times)

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namussi

« on: January 09, 2018, 19:21 »
+1
https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20180109006183/en/KODAK-WENN-Digital-Partner-Launch-Major-Blockchain

ROCHESTER, N.Y.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--Today Kodak and WENN Digital, in a licensing partnership, announced the launch of the KODAKOne image rights management platform and KODAKCoin, a photo-centric cryptocurrency to empower photographers and agencies to take greater control in image rights management.


« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2018, 20:48 »
+3
I'd love to be a part of this project. Sounds awsome. I actually started to write whitepaper for something similar, but eh, Kodak sounds better  ;D 8)

namussi

« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2018, 21:16 »
0
http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-42630136

Kodak's other initiative, the KodakCoin, is being created as part of an effort to build a global ledger of picture rights ownership that photographers can add their work to.

Associated KodakOne software will be used to crawl the web and find pictures that have been used without permission.

The company said it would then "manage the licensing process," so the photographer can be paid, in KodakCoin.

"Kodak has always sought to democratise photography and make licensing fair to artists," said Kodak chief executive Jeff Clarke.

"These technologies give the photography community an innovative and easy way to do just that."




« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2018, 01:57 »
+4
I hope they can pull it off.  it sounds like a great project and the perfect use for the blockchain technology. 

It looks a little like they are a photo business who is hiring out the blockchain / crypto part though - and that they don't really have much knowledge about either cryptos or stock agencies.  I'd rather see a business being set up solely for the purchase of licensing images with the blockchain.  Perhaps I'm biased, but I've just seen so many times where a company wants a phone app and to do so, they hire out the project to an 'app making company' and almost always, the app is HORRIBLE and buggy and doesn't work.  I think to myself that the company must of had this built for them by someone who doesn't really have that much invested in the app or doesn't care.

A small company who only makes apps and sells them themselves ends up making much much better apps.  I'm afraid this may happen to Kodak and their crypto / stock agency.  I hope I'm wrong.

SpaceStockFootage

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« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2018, 02:51 »
+3
I'm slightly confused.

"Associated KodakOne software will be used to crawl the web and find pictures that have been used without permission.

The company said it would then "manage the licensing process," so the photographer can be paid, in KodakCoin."


Just thinking out loud here, but surely this would only work if Kodak is the only stock agency and/or place to license photos? Otherwise, how will it be able to detect images that have been used with permission through Shutterstock, for example, if they've not been registered with the blockchain? An image will show up as being used without permission if it is sourced through a site that doesn't use Kodak's blockchain to register the usage. So the only way you'd they could 100% accurately crawl the web and find images used without permission... would be if every stock agency out there started registering sales with Kodak... and I'm not sure they'd be able to get such a level of buy in.

And would it be possible to separate the registering and the paying? So the sites register the license with Kodak, but they still handle the payment in real money rather than coins. If it only works with registering and paying through Kodak, then all other sites would probably become obsolete... or would need to become obsolete for the system to work to its full effect. I can't see it happening any time soon.

As I say, just thinking aloud. I may be missing something... it sometimes happens!

niktol

« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2018, 04:17 »
+2

As I say, just thinking aloud. I may be missing something... it sometimes happens!

This is what I got from this. They are creating yet another agency where the contributors will be assured that the use of their files within the system is thoroughly tracked. If files with the same images are uploaded elsewhere, they won't be tracked. Just like bitcoin cannot track your dollar mortgage payments because they are different systems. The coins are an inseparable part of the ledger so they will have to be converted into conventional currency like fotolia credits except that the conversion ratio might be constantly changing (which will spell problem). My guess is that they are counting on the file tracking feature  to attract contributors.

Of course giants like Shutterstock will not be forced into the ledger, they will either ignore it or create their own. A shuttercoin or whatever. They only need to hire one person (or a small group) to get this done. Whether this ledger will create something of value for contributors remains to be seen because tracking files and being able to do something about infringements are two different things. 
« Last Edit: January 10, 2018, 04:54 by niktol »

« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2018, 04:34 »
0
I'm slightly confused.

"Associated KodakOne software will be used to crawl the web and find pictures that have been used without permission.

The company said it would then "manage the licensing process," so the photographer can be paid, in KodakCoin."


Just thinking out loud here, but surely this would only work if Kodak is the only stock agency and/or place to license photos? Otherwise, how will it be able to detect images that have been used with permission through Shutterstock, for example, if they've not been registered with the blockchain? An image will show up as being used without permission if it is sourced through a site that doesn't use Kodak's blockchain to register the usage. So the only way you'd they could 100% accurately crawl the web and find images used without permission... would be if every stock agency out there started registering sales with Kodak... and I'm not sure they'd be able to get such a level of buy in.

And would it be possible to separate the registering and the paying? So the sites register the license with Kodak, but they still handle the payment in real money rather than coins. If it only works with registering and paying through Kodak, then all other sites would probably become obsolete... or would need to become obsolete for the system to work to its full effect. I can't see it happening any time soon.

As I say, just thinking aloud. I may be missing something... it sometimes happens!

It's not what you are missing it's what you are adding that's causing you a problem, Stock.

« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2018, 06:23 »
+2
We already have companies that can track images.  How is adding a buzzword making that any different?

niktol

« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2018, 08:32 »
+1
We already have companies that can track images.  How is adding a buzzword making that any different?

Supposedly a better management system, even if only incrementally. I presume the measure equates to barcoding and putting magnetic stripes on pencils to make sure metaphorical bank employees don't take them home.

It may not prevent vault break-ins though.

« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2018, 09:11 »
+1
Here is my thoughts. I think Kodak has a brand that has not been lost just out of work. Their brand name is still top shelf.  With this new block chain currency people will react with excitement. All the stock agencies will pay Kodak a finders commission to have their images policed. When Kodak finds infringements on images the stock companies and image owners will get a bitcoin type payment. Photographers and Stock Agencies will like the payment in this type of bit coin because in principal value may increase in time. Kodak Stock should go to the moon with this new business model..Just watch....you heard it first here. W.Scott McGill   

SpaceStockFootage

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« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2018, 09:36 »
0
When Kodak finds infringements on images the stock companies and image owners will get a bitcoin type payment. 

Why would Kodak pay me money if they find an image being used which hasn't been licensed properly? How would they benefit from paying out all this money?

Photographers and Stock Agencies will like the payment in this type of bit coin because in principal value may increase in time.

I won't like the payment in this type of bit coin, as in principle, the value may also decrease in time. I'll stick with cash for now.

« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2018, 09:44 »
0
Here is why Kodak will pay you. When Kodak finds an image that is not commissioned for use they will send a demand letter/e-mail for payment or they will go to court after misuse of image. Large to small companies will pay the fee rather than go to court .  One out of twenty individuals will pay the fee over fear, just like when the collection companies call. I have already made 2K today on Kodak stock....it has started...  W.Scott McGill

« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2018, 12:40 »
0
When Kodak finds infringements on images the stock companies and image owners will get a bitcoin type payment. 


Why would Kodak pay me money if they find an image being used which hasn't been licensed properly? How would they benefit from paying out all this money?

Photographers and Stock Agencies will like the payment in this type of bit coin because in principal value may increase in time.


I won't like the payment in this type of bit coin, as in principle, the value may also decrease in time. I'll stick with cash for now.


The dollar, Yen, Ruble, and any conventional currency else can increase of decrease in time. You get paid with KodakCoin you convert it to your local currency, you don't sit on it. Unless you want to play the market and hold coin. Payment is payment, what you do with it after that is your choice. Kind of like getting credits on a stock site and when you cash out you get money.

https://kodakcoin.com/ KodakOne site I don't think this was added yet? I don't know if Kodak will own this or hire KOne to run the licensing part using the Kodak name, and KodakCoin. Very confusing. WENN digital will manage the coin under the Kodak name.

Kodak Cash Miner http://www.zdnet.com/article/kodak-bitcoin-miner-on-display-at-ces-2018/


SpaceStockFootage

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« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2018, 12:51 »
0
I have already made 2K today on Kodak stock....it has started

Well... your shares may be worth 2K more than they were yesterday, but what are they worth in comparison to when you bought them? The increase of their share price has started, nothing else.

So basically, you're saying the business model isn't so much block-chain and crypto-currencies, but a company perusing copyright infringement claims? Could work, I guess. Surely 90% of the letters they send out (at least to start) will be to people who have legally licensed the image elsewhere? How popular is this company going to be when it comes to the stock photo buying public, if they're having to respond to demand letters or court summons every week?

Kodak Stock won't go to the moon with this new business model. It might look like it is to start with, but once it's launched and it's not quite as popular and/or revolutionary as they'd have you believe.. it'll be back on terra firma before long. Just watch....you heard it first here.

SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2018, 12:54 »
+1
You get paid with KodakCoin you convert it to your local currency, you don't sit on it.

How do I convert it? Obvioulsy it's new, so nobody knows exactly... but say they were paying in Bitcoin instead.

« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2018, 13:08 »
0
How do I convert it? Obvioulsy it's new, so nobody knows exactly... but say they were paying in Bitcoin instead.

At any exchange where it's listed. Or directly with another person. You choose.

« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2018, 13:10 »
+1
Sold my wall street stock and made 2200 profit in less than 24 hours.....I will take that....but I do think this photo mode from Kodak will work...Right now photo stock shooters who is getting you money on your lost stolen photo work.  Most likely you don't even know what is stolen, I do not know what has been stolen from me, but have always wonder about low tier agencies. Now with programs out their that will remove watermarks even more stolen works in future.   Kodak will not care how the public receives them as long as them make money for their wall street stock and for there new photo stock shooters. If they sell their bit coin to the open market it most likely will go up in value. Word on the street the Kodak coin may sell as soon as Feb.


« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2018, 13:23 »
+2
You get paid with KodakCoin you convert it to your local currency, you don't sit on it.

How do I convert it? Obvioulsy it's new, so nobody knows exactly... but say they were paying in Bitcoin instead.

Doesn't matter what they pay, the coin exchanges let you convert to any other coin, or take out the value is your local currency. You will have a Coinbase https://www.coinbase.com/dashboard account for example. That's connected to your bank account. You remove the value to your local currency at the exchange rate for the coin.

Here's what the market looks like. I can guess that 90% of these will eventually be nothing or flat value. Just like everything else, the top coins will get the market. Bitcoin is losing shares to the new entries right now, but should last it out as one of the survivors. https://coinmarketcap.com/

If I have one kind of coin I can exchange it for any other kind of coin. There is a fee for every transaction, that's where the mining comes in.

« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2018, 13:39 »
+1
Here is my thoughts. I think Kodak has a brand that has not been lost just out of work. Their brand name is still top shelf.  With this new block chain currency people will react with excitement. All the stock agencies will pay Kodak a finders commission to have their images policed. When Kodak finds infringements on images the stock companies and image owners will get a bitcoin type payment. Photographers and Stock Agencies will like the payment in this type of bit coin because in principal value may increase in time. Kodak Stock should go to the moon with this new business model..Just watch....you heard it first here. W.Scott McGill   
The value of the coin may also decrease in time also it doesn't matter what photographers and agencies like its a buyers market. Unless a benefit to customers can be identified it will fail. I can follow the logic of the Blockchain for registering the images....buy why payment in cryptocurrency....an infringement not only has to be found it has to be enforced...that's the hard part.

« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2018, 16:23 »
0
I remember a few years back the music industry went after folks for coping music. Some of the perps were kids . I even remember some of the kids had copied hundreds of thousands of dollars of music. Not sure what the end outcome was but it made a lots of people think about coping music.

« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2018, 16:27 »
0



Email

I think this went to court in 2008
A federal jury on Friday ordered a Boston University graduate student who admitted illegally downloading and sharing music online to pay $675,000 to four record labels.
Joel Tenenbaum, of Providence, admitted in court that he downloaded and distributed 30 songs. The only issue for the jury to decide was how much in damages to award the record labels.
Under federal law, the recording companies were entitled to $750 to $30,000 per infringement. But the law allows as much as $150,000 per track if the jury finds the infringements were willful. The maximum jurors could have awarded in Tenenbaum's case was $4.5 million.
Jurors ordered Tenenbaum to pay $22,500 for each incident of copyright infringement, effectively finding that his actions were willful. The attorney for the 25-year-old student had asked the jury earlier Friday to "send a message" to the music industry by awarding only minimal damages.

« Reply #21 on: January 11, 2018, 10:45 »
+3
Here is my thoughts. I think Kodak has a brand that has not been lost just out of work. Their brand name is still top shelf.  With this new block chain currency people will react with excitement. All the stock agencies will pay Kodak a finders commission to have their images policed. When Kodak finds infringements on images the stock companies and image owners will get a bitcoin type payment. Photographers and Stock Agencies will like the payment in this type of bit coin because in principal value may increase in time. Kodak Stock should go to the moon with this new business model..Just watch....you heard it first here. W.Scott McGill   
The value of the coin may also decrease in time also it doesn't matter what photographers and agencies like its a buyers market. Unless a benefit to customers can be identified it will fail. I can follow the logic of the Blockchain for registering the images....buy why payment in cryptocurrency....an infringement not only has to be found it has to be enforced...that's the hard part.

Seems some people here didn't follow the links or read before they posted the replies. https://www.kodak.com/US/en/corp/Press_center/KODAK_and_WENN_Digital_Partner_to_Launch_Major_Blockchain_Initiative_and_Cryptocurrency/default.htm

License the work within the system, enforce copyright, for agencies and photographers, WENN will get a percentage of the collections in other words, a percentage of what they find, before they pay us. Photographers who use KODAKOne will be able to register and license their work in its secure ledger.  License? New agency or we license? I don't know.

Registration for images, I share some of the same doubts, but if they do the work, finding infringement and send me money, what's the problem and all the negativity? I'd assume we must first pay to register our work and then hope they find something. Bit of a risk. I'm also questioning if that registration will be effective or just be a way for Kodak to make money on a worthless product that promises what it can't deliver.

Crypto currency has no borders. You can get coin and convert coin anywhere on the planet. You convert it into your local currency, it's that easy. We won't be getting paid worthless, every changing, bits of a specific use only coinage. It's universal, unlike dollars, Euro, Pounds, rubles, Yen, Dracma, Rands, Real, or worse drachma? Countries with runaway inflation can make your money worthless overnight.

Sure the value of the KodakCoin will fluctuate, but it will also be the payment for work as well as the payment to us, no exchange rates, one universal coin for all the transactions. Then we turn it into whatever we want. I'll take US dollars.

Until we see the whole plan and how it might work, or not, I'd say this is someone trying to make a move that could help us. All the naysayers, have your mind made up, continue to be hopeless and complain how our work is stolen, resold or given away for free. Complain about the fees for converting our earnings from dollars or euros into our own currency. The decision to participate is voluntary.

Makes me wonder if some of the current agencies will participate and switch to crypto coin over fiat money. The exchange rates and paying us in US dollars is a problem and expense for them as well. Imagine an agency in Africa, China or Russia. They pay in universal crypto currency,  we exchange that for whatever we want. Small fees for transactions, unlike PayPal and the others.

« Reply #22 on: January 11, 2018, 10:56 »
0
YadaYadaYada  very well stated....great info..thanks 

« Reply #23 on: January 11, 2018, 11:44 »
+1
YadaYadaYada  very well stated....great info..thanks

Hope some of that was helpful. BTW I don't know, I won't predict, I just think this is interesting. I don't claim to fully understand Cryptocurrency either, just that it's not as cryptic as crypto sounds. It's easier to trade, once I got an account, than stocks. Money transfers and the commissions are minimal, based on the transaction not the size, if I read my transaction logs right.

The stock market boom in the roaring 20s
The tech boom in the 1990s,
The housing boom in the 2000s,
Microstock sorry folks it was a boom,
And now the booming cryptocurrency market.

What's next? A wild ride up and down and finally if anyone pays attention to booms and history, a big bust. But we have stocks, tech, housing, micro, and there will be survivors of this boom who will become stable businesses and part of the global economy.

Here's what's good, in my view, about KodakCoin and KodakOne and all the hoopla. They have a trusted name and trusted partner in WENN. The stock will rise, the coin should take off like all the rest and eventually reach stability. Here's what I question. The claims and ability to protect our work and fees for registration of this questionable promise. Add to that they refer to licensing which is vague? Are they going to license or is this just or our own licensing? Many questions and not nearly enough answers.

I'm positive because this all looks exciting and interesting. I'm cautious about great expectations because there's so much hype and many vague promises included.

GraniteCove

« Reply #24 on: January 11, 2018, 11:56 »
0
Agree, well said. At the moment the success all of this is contingent upon a unified system which not only includes the large agency players but also extends to Google as well. I'm with others who just can' t get their head around how a standalone service like Kodak is implementing can possibly differentiate between theft and legitimate use unless part of their strategy does include a new agency where files are sold exclusively. I realize there are many visual artists (pros and amateurs alike) out there who would never have anything to do with stock (especially microstock) so perhaps that is where their focus will be for now - a niche market protecting private online portfolios as the big players (unlikely I think) come on board. But that's where I am most at a loss. Kodak, with their recent history to me does'nt seem like the best positioned company to be getting into the protection rackets. As an investment I think I'd hold off until Google implements their own version.  For now KodakCoin for me feels more like KodakCon, but we'll see.


 

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