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Author Topic: Rough shadows from paper  (Read 3564 times)

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« on: July 08, 2013, 13:57 »
0
I am using #1 super white widetone seamless background paper and often get ugly, rough grainy looking shadows where a black object meets the paper.  They look really noisy. 

More light or different paper/material ???   Even when I light with three and pop it with two SB 700's I can still occaisionally get this dark rough area.


« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2013, 14:07 »
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I am using #1 super white widetone seamless background paper and often get ugly, rough grainy looking shadows where a black object meets the paper.  They look really noisy. 

More light or different paper/material ???   Even when I light with three and pop it with two SB 700's I can still occaisionally get this dark rough area.

Post a picture.

« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2013, 15:43 »
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This is after dodging and bluring.  I try to go easy on PP especially exposure and such.

« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2013, 17:07 »
+1
Lift the object away from the piece of paper and reshoot. This allows the light to bend round the object. The other option is use white plexi glass and light from underneath.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2013, 17:11 by picture5469 »

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« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2013, 17:22 »
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Yeah you need to learn how to use the light.

Just as picture5469 has said and more.

Just cause you have white paper it doesn't mean you are going to get an isolation or even an on white, this is something you must learn to understand and be able to differentiate between the two.

« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2013, 22:54 »
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Someone told me keeping two stops difference between your background and object, gets you to isolated object on white. I did not get that concept yet, because I would need little powerful lights for that and I can not afford to put money right now.

What I do generally.  -- I have a white chart sheet paper of around 4 feet long and 2 feet wide. Make a fold from top above and slide it to make a half round curve, the down bottom ends are clipped to keep it in the position. I have 2 cheap lights. One I use for lighting the back and other for lighting the object. In my camera, I shoot RAW and manual mode. I do not click until I see ----0---- for exposure. It takes care of almost all shadows and rough edges.  Last remaining rough edges, shadows, dirt marks, dust particles on the sheet and other places are removed with dodge tool. I found dodge tool as the best tool for isolating objects. Lately, the number of rejections on FT and other sites have come down.

« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2013, 06:06 »
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Awesome,  I will make the adjustments,  thank you very much.   My old lightbox for negatives list  5000k lamps on the side of it,  I will try to utilize it .

Looking at this paper is does not look good lighting from the underside,  it looks rough, Is there a thin paper made for underside lighting ??  I will try the white chart sheet as suggested.
« Last Edit: July 09, 2013, 09:31 by old crow »

« Reply #7 on: July 09, 2013, 10:08 »
+1
Hi

If you look at my site www.picture5479.com   you will see it is virtually 100% isolations. Its a technique that needs to be developed. Took me a while.

I don't use paper. I use the lastolite background
http://www.fotosense.co.uk/lastolite-hilite-background-4ft-6in-x-3ft-6in-las8990.html?gclid=CI-BoMzWorgCFUrJtAodtyIAVw#fo_c=77&fo_k=12f99a20f8525f70f6748fef1f22fac0&fo_s=gplauk

Then I stand a small wooden table in front of this and place a piece of white  vinyl paper over the table
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/610mm-x-0-8mm-WHITE-MAGNETIC-VINYL-SHEET-/150512851221?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item230b43d915

The lastolite backing lights the object from behind, I use two strobes on the front to light the object. This is probably overkill but gives about a 99% isolation.

I would suggest you try raising the object away from the paper.

The other poster was right a 2 stop difference in light is about right to achieve a true isolation. Look at these videos
http://www.youtube.com/user/Lastolite

This will help your understanding.

« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2013, 06:24 »
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Thanks for the help,  lastolite video was very helpful although I am forced to build something due to expense.  Answer was what I thought,  more light and talent needed.

« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2013, 08:44 »
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if you've no experience with Pro printing, save your time and go in an expensive print shop, talk with the guys there and ask them advice about the best paper/printer/profile combo solution.

you WILL save time and money and headaches paying a professional to do the printing for you, trust me !

there's just too many factors to take into accounts, too many variables, too many limits in most of the machines about gamut/paper/profiles.

i wouldn't touch an inkjet printer with a 10 foot pole nowadays and i do have hands-on experience having worked in my past life in digital printing, it's a BIG MESS, for instance the black in your images are probably not printed using black ink but with a mix of black and green and it will come out differently on each paper unless you know exactly what you're doing.

there's no way for a consumer to save money on all this, inks and papers are overpriced, only print labs can provide a good deal.

« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2013, 09:39 »
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Just don't use paper when you shoot small objects, use plastic.

« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2013, 10:09 »
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if you've no experience with Pro printing, save your time and go in an expensive print shop, talk with the guys there and ask them advice about the best paper/printer/profile combo solution.

you WILL save time and money and headaches paying a professional to do the printing for you, trust me !

there's just too many factors to take into accounts, too many variables, too many limits in most of the machines about gamut/paper/profiles.

i wouldn't touch an inkjet printer with a 10 foot pole nowadays and i do have hands-on experience having worked in my past life in digital printing, it's a BIG MESS, for instance the black in your images are probably not printed using black ink but with a mix of black and green and it will come out differently on each paper unless you know exactly what you're doing.

there's no way for a consumer to save money on all this, inks and papers are overpriced, only print labs can provide a good deal.

? ???

« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2013, 10:45 »
0
Hi
In the last time i use to be in front of the computer more time than I use to do on studio set.
This is my way:
Clipping path is the item.(do not fear)
I shot with a white parer background with a curve and so.
I make one shot with a exactly exposure I need and I make an other one with one or two spots over or something like that(dont move the vamera). The over exposition I do whit two spots is just on light control not in he camera f.
I keep those two files like layers and them I make a cliping path on the right esposure subject. (when you do a lot of clipping paths you go fast and is usefull to add at your image reclaim).
I go with a new layer from the cut out object and I put between this object layer and the overexposure shot layer a new white layer. Then in this white layer i do a layer mask hide all. Then with soft very soft brush (in black) and with a soft opacity Im going up finding the shadow of the layer behind until the density that I want. You achieve a really white background (255-255-255) and the kind of shadow and degree you want.
You know, really is more dificult to explain it that make it. (please add that my english is not my mother language,I hope you'll understand). I'm used to and over time I'm pretty fast.

« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2013, 14:38 »
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I have found I need to have some serious light.  I have assembled a second tent with glass suspended over pvc so I can light the bottom with the tent on top of the glass and surrounding everything else. I am finding the material "sport white vinyl", an umbrella material very graainy and think it will show so the need for serious light is back.  The simple thing would have indeed been to elevate the subject,  but now I have the need for some serious light which I can not achieve on the cheap,  may just have to bite the bullet on lights.  Clipping paths are something I should be better at rather than the other selection tools.  Truth is I am just now teaching myself clipping paths as the tool is a bit awkward at first.  I have all the answers in front of me it is now my responsibility to make it happen.

For years I tried to cook a great steak,  kept reading and listening to everything.  Finally a friend made me leave the steak sit out until it was room temperature ( an hour).  It was a great steak.  My reply was that I did let it sit out,  all of ten minutes.  I am admittedly hard headed.  I will eventually make this work,  probably after buying some decent lighting.

Thanks for the help.

P.S.  Let your steak sit out for at least an hour  !!
« Last Edit: July 10, 2013, 14:41 by old crow »


 

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