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Author Topic: iStock ELs not paying properly?  (Read 34674 times)

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« Reply #125 on: November 16, 2010, 11:41 »
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Were you banned as well cclapper?

Apparently I have not been banned from the forums, as I was able to post one this morning. But I expect that thread will be locked very soon.

I took a payout on Sun. am and it left $.17 in my account. Today, I still have $.17 in my account. Either sales are not being reported correctly or my wooyaying-nauseating comment in another thread here has offended the mighty gods and they decided to punish me with no sales, because 2 days with NO downloads has not happened to me since I first started uploading a few years ago! I checked my most downloaded images and they are still showing in the best match as they did before.

November sales (one of amazing last four mouths) are total crap, at least for me.

November usually sucks big time for me.  After dropping exclusivity in mid-october, I had been expecting a very dismal November.  However, surprisingly my downloads have really not slumped much at all. I'm down in earnings only because of the percentage drop when I left exclusive, but number of downloads appears to be fairly stable.


ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #126 on: November 16, 2010, 11:50 »
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I took a payout on Sun. am and it left $.17 in my account. Today, I still have $.17 in my account. Either sales are not being reported correctly or my wooyaying-nauseating comment in another thread here has offended the mighty gods and they decided to punish me with no sales, because 2 days with NO downloads has not happened to me since I first started uploading a few years ago! I checked my most downloaded images and they are still showing in the best match as they did before.
November sales (one of amazing last four mouths) are total crap, at least for me.
Yes, my November sales on Istock are pretty bad too.  But in Cathy's case, with NO sales on a weekday (Monday) that sounds more like some sort of site glitch.  Not that Istock ever has those...  ::)

@Cathy, how are your sales today? I got one just after midnight iStock time and nothing since.
I was wondering if there was some sort of reporting glitch, but one of my CN just said he had a good day yesterday and a good start to today.
My 'test' files are around where they've been for a while in best match and DM is still reporting hundreds of views.

« Reply #127 on: November 16, 2010, 12:35 »
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@Cathy, how are your sales today? I got one just after midnight iStock time and nothing since.
I was wondering if there was some sort of reporting glitch, but one of my CN just said he had a good day yesterday and a good start to today.
My 'test' files are around where they've been for a while in best match and DM is still reporting hundreds of views.

OK, there had to have been some sort of glitch (  ::) ) because I went to do a few errands around 11:00. Just got back. Now I have $8.11 in my account. Four downloads from 9:31am, 9:41am, 10:02am and 10:26am. Hmmm. Aren't DL purchases usually recorded instantly on our account?

lisafx

« Reply #128 on: November 16, 2010, 12:39 »
0


OK, there had to have been some sort of glitch (  ::) ) because I went to do a few errands around 11:00. Just got back. Now I have $8.11 in my account. Four downloads from 9:31am, 9:41am, 10:02am and 10:26am. Hmmm. Aren't DL purchases usually recorded instantly on our account?

They are supposed to be, AFAIK.  It's only the bar graph that takes a day to update...

« Reply #129 on: November 16, 2010, 12:41 »
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OK, there had to have been some sort of glitch (  ::) ) because I went to do a few errands around 11:00. Just got back. Now I have $8.11 in my account. Four downloads from 9:31am, 9:41am, 10:02am and 10:26am. Hmmm. Aren't DL purchases usually recorded instantly on our account?

They are supposed to be, AFAIK.  It's only the bar graph that takes a day to update...

The new and improved F5! Leaves our money in the IS account longer!

« Reply #130 on: November 16, 2010, 15:49 »
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ROFL. Just gotta love the "update" from management. More lame BS. Pathetic.

Paraphrasing: "It's really hard to fix, even though we had it right BEFORE we changed it." what? They can't just put it back to how it was?

« Reply #131 on: November 16, 2010, 16:38 »
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Today in the IS forum I suggested that contributors get together and contract some kind of ombudsman....or advocate. It was deleted by the moderator....which sucks big time. Do any of you photogs with IS know of any conversations or efforts to hire an advocate....someone to watch over our interests? It wouldn't cost much per contributor. Am I crazy or is this a good idea?

An union? Forget it... It's not possible. What could be hoped, when many people who just weeks ago were talking of integrity and were calling for a general upoalidg boycott to IS are now uploading themselves as crazy again? In this kind of work and internet relationship, creating an union is utopia. Market forces are what decide. There's a point (a price /comission point) where for most people exclusiviness or even regular membership is not worth. Should this point be reached, things would happen naturally. "Old" micro agencies would fade, some new with brigther ideas would emerge.

traveler1116

« Reply #132 on: November 17, 2010, 05:19 »
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Yesterday I had an E+ file EL get 33.60 for 125 credits.  The minimum credits to buy the EL would be 130 because xsmall E+ files are 5 credits.  So because I'm silver I get 40% of money from ELs that works out to between 64.6 cents per credit and 57.9 cents per credit depending if they bought L size.  Am I correct and does this mean it hasn't been fixed yet? 

RT


« Reply #133 on: November 17, 2010, 06:30 »
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I'm not suggesting that IS create this position. I'm saying that we contributors demand this advocate.

Contributors - "We demand an advocate"

iS - "No"

Contributors - "Right then, we'll ummm, well we'll ummmm, ooh I know we'll ummmmm, OK we'll all leave come on everybody who's with me? (Sudden feeling of being alone creeps in!)

« Reply #134 on: November 17, 2010, 07:24 »
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Yesterday I had an E+ file EL get 33.60 for 125 credits.  The minimum credits to buy the EL would be 130 because xsmall E+ files are 5 credits.  So because I'm silver I get 40% of money from ELs that works out to between 64.6 cents per credit and 57.9 cents per credit depending if they bought L size.  Am I correct and does this mean it hasn't been fixed yet? 

Dunno, but we know it hasn't been fixed yet anyways.

traveler1116

« Reply #135 on: November 17, 2010, 10:27 »
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Is there a thread open on IS now that will let the Admins communicate to us what is being done and what the likely time frame for getting this fixed will be?  Just kidding I know the answer....but seriously why haven't there been any announcements on this yet.

« Reply #136 on: November 17, 2010, 11:14 »
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Is there a thread open on IS now that will let the Admins communicate to us what is being done and what the likely time frame for getting this fixed will be?  Just kidding I know the answer....but seriously why haven't there been any announcements on this yet.

There is an open thread here, and I suggest you open a support ticket. I think that they need to be a little more formal about bugs that withhold royalties from contributors (you'll see I've said that in the thread :))

I don't know if they will close my support ticket (as they did the others), pointing at the forum thread with a promise as a "resolution". If they do, I'm going to open another one.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #137 on: November 17, 2010, 11:22 »
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Is there a thread open on IS now that will let the Admins communicate to us what is being done and what the likely time frame for getting this fixed will be?  Just kidding I know the answer....but seriously why haven't there been any announcements on this yet.

There is an open thread here, and I suggest you open a support ticket. I think that they need to be a little more formal about bugs that withhold royalties from contributors (you'll see I've said that in the thread :))

I don't know if they will close my support ticket (as they did the others), pointing at the forum thread with a promise as a "resolution". If they do, I'm going to open another one.

That was an earlier reply, which I and others got.
I wrote again, saying that the matter was not resolved, and the first answer was unacceptable and got this reply on the 12th:
"I do apologize and yes at the time (and still) that is the only information we have been given.  I will pass your comments along to my Manager and check with "Joyzee" as well who posted the last admin update to see if there is a date now as to when these missing funds will be added.  Once we have that the forums will be updated as well."
Four more days and counting ...

« Reply #138 on: November 18, 2010, 15:55 »
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My support ticket did get closed - very politely and empathetically but still closed.

So I had a read of the artist supply agreement to see what it said about payment timing. The exclusive agreement (which I think is the same in this respect as the general one) says:

In response to a written request, iStockphoto will endeavor to make payment of fees in respect of purchased downloads of Accepted Exclusive Content on a monthly basis on or about the 15th day of the month following the purchase of Accepted Exclusive Content, except when sales reporting from a distribution partner is delayed, in which case payments will be made in the month following the date such sale is reported, provided such fees aggregate a minimum of US$100, failing which fees owing will be retained until they exceed such minimum.

Seems pretty loosey-goosey in that it doesn't even include the word "reasonable" with endeavor and says nothing about what happens if they blow the deadline.

My new ticket requests that they compute my withheld royalty and pay it to me regardless of whether they fix the code on the site that computes El royalties. They want to tie those two (and I can see that it'd be less work for contributor relations to wait until they fix the code to do the back payments) but I see no reason they need to be.

The agreement says request in writing, so my ticket is a written request to be paid. I would hope it'd be sooner, but I want to start the clock ticking so I can complain again after December 15th if they haven't paid.

It's not Joy's fault that this mess is happening, and I feel bad that I'm making work for contributor relations staff who likewise aren't to blame for this either.  I think it's important to do whatever we can to ensure we get paid promptly.

It's not a ton of money in my case, but I guess my sense-of-injustice button got pushed big time by their cavalier attitude to paying us.

« Reply #139 on: November 18, 2010, 16:07 »
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My support ticket did get closed - very politely and empathetically but still closed.

So I had a read of the artist supply agreement to see what it said about payment timing. The exclusive agreement (which I think is the same in this respect as the general one) says:

In response to a written request, iStockphoto will endeavor to make payment of fees in respect of purchased downloads of Accepted Exclusive Content on a monthly basis on or about the 15th day of the month following the purchase of Accepted Exclusive Content, except when sales reporting from a distribution partner is delayed, in which case payments will be made in the month following the date such sale is reported, provided such fees aggregate a minimum of US$100, failing which fees owing will be retained until they exceed such minimum.

Seems pretty loosey-goosey in that it doesn't even include the word "reasonable" with endeavor and says nothing about what happens if they blow the deadline.

My new ticket requests that they compute my withheld royalty and pay it to me regardless of whether they fix the code on the site that computes El royalties. They want to tie those two (and I can see that it'd be less work for contributor relations to wait until they fix the code to do the back payments) but I see no reason they need to be.

The agreement says request in writing, so my ticket is a written request to be paid. I would hope it'd be sooner, but I want to start the clock ticking so I can complain again after December 15th if they haven't paid.

It's not Joy's fault that this mess is happening, and I feel bad that I'm making work for contributor relations staff who likewise aren't to blame for this either.  I think it's important to do whatever we can to ensure we get paid promptly.

It's not a ton of money in my case, but I guess my sense-of-injustice button got pushed big time by their cavalier attitude to paying us.

I hope you get your money.   Don't feel bad for holding them accountable for what they owe you.  Of course it's not her fault, but it is her job. They are paid employees and this is their job. It's not like you're being snotty about it, you're only asking for what is rightfully yours and they should be working to clear up the mess and get you what is yours.  I see nothing wrong with that. 

« Reply #140 on: November 18, 2010, 16:12 »
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It doesn't make sense to pay them before they fix the code, because then, they'll be having to do special calculations over and over instead of just once.

I just don't know why it is taking so long to fix.

« Reply #141 on: November 18, 2010, 16:54 »
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It doesn't make sense to pay them before they fix the code, because then, they'll be having to do special calculations over and over instead of just once.

I just don't know why it is taking so long to fix.


I realize it doesn't make sense for them to pay first, but what is the point of us (contributors) being endlessly reasonable while they d!ck us around?

The site's just a mess of bugs and while I'm delighted that buyers are apparently able to keep buying and this week looks like being a BWE, the only thing they're consistently delivering are excuses (as to why things aren't fixed) and requests to be patient.

At this point I think we need to be hard line about things until they start being more responsible and responsive.

They are obliged to pay us for the licenses sold and they're not doing it. When I had my own business and didn't get paid by clients I got used to politely hounding those who don't pay up on time. I'm quite prepared to do this with iStock.

I have lots of guesses about why they're not fixing these problems and not one of them amounts to an acceptable excuse.

« Reply #142 on: November 18, 2010, 17:01 »
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I just don't know why it is taking so long to fix.

Basically because they don't really care. It's not a priority. They've designed a little competition to keep the children occupied with instead.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #143 on: November 18, 2010, 17:09 »
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My support ticket did get closed - very politely and empathetically but still closed.

So I had a read of the artist supply agreement to see what it said about payment timing. The exclusive agreement (which I think is the same in this respect as the general one) says:

In response to a written request, iStockphoto will endeavor to make payment of fees in respect of purchased downloads of Accepted Exclusive Content on a monthly basis on or about the 15th day of the month following the purchase of Accepted Exclusive Content, except when sales reporting from a distribution partner is delayed, in which case payments will be made in the month following the date such sale is reported, provided such fees aggregate a minimum of US$100, failing which fees owing will be retained until they exceed such minimum.

Seems pretty loosey-goosey in that it doesn't even include the word "reasonable" with endeavor and says nothing about what happens if they blow the deadline.
All iStock's 'commitments' to its contributers are very loosely worded with words like 'reasonable' which have no legal definition. Yet our obligations to them are cast iron, (if not always crystal-clear).

« Reply #144 on: November 18, 2010, 17:29 »
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I just don't know why it is taking so long to fix.

Basically because they don't really care. It's not a priority. They've designed a little competition to keep the children occupied with instead.


They've said that they are treating this as a priority, but if this is how their priorities get handled I'd hate to see what happens to "regular" to-do list items!

And on the topic of the little competition, I just got a newsletter from IS and it said that 950 iStockers nominated work for the Stockys contest. That seems like an embarrassingly small number even given the subset of total contributors that are actively submitting to the site.

I didn't submit because I can't find an ounce of enthusiasm for a celebration given the slasher-movie games they're playing with our royalties. Perhaps others felt similarly?

« Reply #145 on: November 18, 2010, 17:46 »
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Well, I didn't submit either.  I'm guessing it's all silvers and below...

traveler1116

« Reply #146 on: November 19, 2010, 06:31 »
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Silver here and I'm not submitting either. They really need to pay us our money as a bare minimum, are they going to add interest for the delay?

« Reply #147 on: November 19, 2010, 11:51 »
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My support ticket did get closed - very politely and empathetically but still closed.

So I had a read of the artist supply agreement to see what it said about payment timing. The exclusive agreement (which I think is the same in this respect as the general one) says:

In response to a written request, iStockphoto will endeavor to make payment of fees in respect of purchased downloads of Accepted Exclusive Content on a monthly basis on or about the 15th day of the month following the purchase of Accepted Exclusive Content, except when sales reporting from a distribution partner is delayed, in which case payments will be made in the month following the date such sale is reported, provided such fees aggregate a minimum of US$100, failing which fees owing will be retained until they exceed such minimum.

Seems pretty loosey-goosey in that it doesn't even include the word "reasonable" with endeavor and says nothing about what happens if they blow the deadline.
All iStock's 'commitments' to its contributers are very loosely worded with words like 'reasonable' which have no legal definition. Yet our obligations to them are cast iron, (if not always crystal-clear).

------------------------------
Even if Istock were clearly in violation of its agreement there is this

"Any and all disputes arising out of, under or in connection with this Agreement, including without limitation, its validity, interpretation, performance and breach, shall be submitted to arbitration in Calgary, Alberta, pursuant to the rules of the Arbitration Act (Alberta) in effect at the time arbitration is demanded."

and also

"You agree to waive any right you may have to (i) trial by jury; and (ii) to commence or participate in any class action against iStockphoto related to the Site, this Agreement or any agreements contemplated hereby."

Not to mention if somebody did take any legal action, Istock would no doubt drop the contributor from Istock entirely.
 

« Reply #148 on: November 20, 2010, 04:54 »
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"You agree to waive any right you may have to (i) trial by jury; and (ii) to commence or participate in any class action against iStockphoto related to the Site, this Agreement or any agreements contemplated hereby."
 

Wow. So you cannot really defend your rights given by the IS agreement because you waive it upon signing it. You obviously still can defend yourself in case you think there is some sort of violation of law (because you cannot waive right to do so).

« Reply #149 on: November 20, 2010, 16:29 »
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I doubt anyone will do it because the amounts of money involved (individually) don't warrant it, but it's highly unlikely that the whole contract as written would hold up in court if legally challenged.

Burble in contracts sometimes only has force because one side has the money and the lawyers and the other doesn't. They can write anything they like. That doesn't per se make it a legally enforceable contract, in Alberta or anywhere else.


 

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