Author Topic: Money where my mouth is. (Read 25752 times)

PeterChigmaroff · « **Reply #25 on:** September 14, 2010, 18:15 »

Here's why nothing will change...

I only wish my own financial position...

Wish I could afford...

doing the same, if I could afford...

I can't afford to ...

There is nothing wrong with the above sentiments. It's just that you can't hope to enact change when you have no bargaining position.

sharpshot · « **Reply #26 on:** September 14, 2010, 18:25 »

^^^ I can afford to stop uploading and I will start deleting images when the commission change happens. Who knows what difference it will make if a lot of people take small steps to reduce the images on istock? It certainly wont help them.

nruboc · « **Reply #27 on:** September 14, 2010, 18:27 »

I'm not happy to hear about your decision (new competitor), but I respect . out of it, and wish you good luck. I'm following your decision on dumping IStock altogther, although I wasn't a big contributor anyways - never did agree with industry low 20%, not to mention 15%

Dreamframer · « **Reply #28 on:** September 14, 2010, 18:37 »

dgilder, that was a hard decision, but I completely understand you, and agree with you. My biggest income from microstock was from audio files at Istock, and I deleted them all and canceled my audio exclusivity. Only after doing it I learned there are audio libraries that sell much better, and share 50/50 with their artists.
After joining few other audio libraries I found some horrible comments about Istock. There is a generalized opinion that Getty treats artist very poorly.
These are some of the comments about Istock from other artists:

http://musiclibraryreport.com/music-libraries-h-to-l/istockphoto/

No kind words about Istock/Getty

nruboc · « **Reply #29 on:** September 14, 2010, 18:38 »

BTW, I just used up the last of my purchasing credits on this one:
http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-photo-6686960-hotel-business-travelers.php

I had credits because some clients insisted on getting something from IStock against my strongest objections. From now on, if they want something from IStock, they find a new designer.

gbalex · « **Reply #30 on:** September 14, 2010, 18:41 »

Quote from: dgilder on September 14, 2010, 15:22

I don't know how long this will last on iStock's forums, so I figured I would post here.

Quote
Not only have I have decided to remove money from the picture entirely, I am removing my own personal situation from my decision.

iStock is treating its independents, illustrators, videographers, and audio contributors unfairly. If the exclusive's higher percentages were unsustainable, then they should be the only ones impacted and given targets to hit. Cutting independents pay by 10-25% is wrong, and paying less than 20% royalties for something you are only re-marketing is reprehensible. Morally, ethically, I can no longer continue to do business with iStockphoto.

I have just canceled my exclusivity, and will be removing my entire portfolio of images over the next 30 days. To my fellow contributors, good luck on your future endeavors, Farewell.

For any buyers who might need some of my photos after the 30 day period, you will be able to find them at Shutterstock, Dreamstime, and Fotolia.

I have to say I have a tremendous amount of respect for you and the values you put into practice. If everyone in the world operated at your level the world would be a much better place.

I will certainly give your port consideration when choosing images in the future.

lisafx · « **Reply #31 on:** September 14, 2010, 18:55 »

Quote from: Zeus on September 14, 2010, 18:15

Here's why nothing will change...

I only wish my own financial position...

Wish I could afford...

doing the same, if I could afford...

I can't afford to ...

There is nothing wrong with the above sentiments. It's just that you can't hope to enact change when you have no bargaining position.

David's decision is admirable. However there are other ways to protest being discussed in various threads both on here and on IS, including:

1) Leaving exclusivity
2) Stopping uploading new images
3) Spreading the word to buyers

Certainly each of us can only do small things, but the cumulative effect could be large.

click_click · « **Reply #32 on:** September 14, 2010, 19:09 »

Quote from: lisafx on September 14, 2010, 18:55

...
1) Leaving exclusivity
...

Lisa, did you consider the fact that if an exclusive drops exclusivity, that he/she will play into iStock's hands?
Even though the contributor will be able to upload everywhere else, the same images on iStock will create a higher percentage for iStock than being exclusive.

It would only make sense as an exclusive contributor to drop exclusivity and leave the agency altogether like the OP is doing.

This of course can ONLY make sense if you can sustain (I hate that word by now) your lifestyle without your exclusivity-income. Now the question is, how many exclusives can afford that...?

dgilder · « **Reply #33 on:** September 14, 2010, 19:28 »

Quote from: click_click on September 14, 2010, 19:09

This of course can ONLY make sense if you can sustain (I hate that word by now) your lifestyle without your exclusivity-income. Now the question is, how many exclusives can afford that...?

Oh, I have no guarantee of being able to sustain my lifestyle. Its going to take awhile to work back up to the income level I have right now from iStock. In the meantime I will have to make some cutbacks, canceling internet at the studio, possibly moving to a cheaper studio or doing only on-location shoots for awhile. Its just that I won't be ruined financially by not having income from iStock.

click_click · « **Reply #34 on:** September 14, 2010, 19:41 »

Quote from: dgilder on September 14, 2010, 19:28

Quote from: click_click on September 14, 2010, 19:09
This of course can ONLY make sense if you can sustain (I hate that word by now) your lifestyle without your exclusivity-income. Now the question is, how many exclusives can afford that...?

Oh, I have no guarantee of being able to sustain my lifestyle. Its going to take awhile to work back up to the income level I have right now from iStock. In the meantime I will have to make some cutbacks, canceling internet at the studio, possibly moving to a cheaper studio or doing only on-location shoots for awhile. Its just that I won't be ruined financially by not having income from iStock.

Kudos. It's rare to see somebody with that kind of dedication and willing to make sacrifices. I'm sure you're already in the middle of talking to many agencies in order to pump your images to them. If not, I recommend to get in direct touch with them so you're on your way as quickly as possible.

Some agencies will gladly process your images for free so you only have to FTP the images to them. They'll do the keywording and categorizing.

Best of luck!

SNP · « **Reply #35 on:** September 14, 2010, 19:42 »

I hope it is worth it. by your admission, seems you've made a bad business decision if all the emotion is removed and you're cutting corners on things like internet access in your studio. anyways, good luck, you're a nice guy...

I have no doubt iStock would welcome you back at any point, that much I have seen with others who went non-exclusive to make a statement over past changes. still trying to find the heroism in cutting off your nose to spite your face...

rubyroo · « **Reply #36 on:** September 14, 2010, 20:24 »

Much respect for standing up for your principles and ethics.

Two quotes I recall come to mind:

"If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything"

and

"Better to die on your feet than live on your knees"

madelaide · « **Reply #37 on:** September 14, 2010, 20:38 »

Quote from: hawk_eye on September 14, 2010, 19:42

I hope it is worth it. by your admission, seems you've made a bad business decision if all the emotion is removed and you're cutting corners on things like internet access in your studio. anyways, good luck, you're a nice guy...

I have no doubt iStock would welcome you back at any point, that much I have seen with others who went non-exclusive to make a statement over past changes. still trying to find the heroism in cutting off your nose to spite your face...

hawk_eye, why do you criticize so much people who are not accepting losing so much of their IS earnings? You might say it's too early for a drastic decision, but giving up a partnership that is not working well makes total sense, even if you lose money.

cthoman · « **Reply #38 on:** September 14, 2010, 20:53 »

Quote from: madelaide on September 14, 2010, 20:38

hawk_eye, why do you criticize so much people who are not accepting losing so much of their IS earnings? You might say it's too early for a drastic decision, but giving up a partnership that is not working well makes total sense, even if you lose money.

I have to tend to agree. If you think a deal isn't fair, it makes sense to cut your losses and get out. Some of it may be emotional, but when have you ever not gotten emotional over being ripped off.

SNP · « **Reply #39 on:** September 14, 2010, 21:01 »

fair enough. but it's my guess you're all happy to watch David flounder while you wait it out to see what happens, so he truly is the only one putting his money where his mouth is and I think it will be to his detriment. I hate to see a valuable contributor do that to himself out of misguided loyalty (not because you don't deserve his loyalty, so don't nail me to that cross please, but simply because it is far too early to be jumping ship).

I think iStock has not been given nearly enough credit in this. that you feel a revolution is the only and best way to get them to listen...anyways, whatever. I'm beating my head against the wall. good luck David, sincerely. I do believe you've made an error and I truly am sad to see you go.

Norebbo · « **Reply #40 on:** September 14, 2010, 22:33 »

Quote from: Zeus on September 14, 2010, 18:15

Here's why nothing will change...

I only wish my own financial position...

Wish I could afford...

doing the same, if I could afford...

I can't afford to ...

There is nothing wrong with the above sentiments. It's just that you can't hope to enact change when you have no bargaining position.

Bingo. Stopping all uploads and removing our portfolio's is the only way to make istock take notice. It's a shame. Last week we were all calling for blood, and now it seems that most are unwilling to follow through and do what is right to make a difference.

Istock (Getty) is going to come out a winner in all this. They know they have us by the you-know-what, and they are going to get what they want. The scary thing is that other microstock agencies are watching this unfold, and it's only a matter of time before they all start trimming royalties too. Why? Because this whole fiasco is proving that they could get away with it if they want to and 99% of the contributors are going to accept it.

If we accept this, we are sheep.

jamirae · « **Reply #41 on:** September 14, 2010, 22:48 »

Quote from: click_click on September 14, 2010, 19:09

Quote from: lisafx on September 14, 2010, 18:55
...
1) Leaving exclusivity
...

Lisa, did you consider the fact that if an exclusive drops exclusivity, that he/she will play into iStock's hands?
Even though the contributor will be able to upload everywhere else, the same images on iStock will create a higher percentage for iStock than being exclusive.

It would only make sense as an exclusive contributor to drop exclusivity and leave the agency altogether like the OP is doing.

This of course can ONLY make sense if you can sustain (I hate that word by now) your lifestyle without your exclusivity-income. Now the question is, how many exclusives can afford that...?

actually I calculated it out. and with the lower credit costs for non-exculsive images at iStock, iStock will actually be making LESS off my images when I cancel exclusivity. I put together a spreadsheet to check all the numbers - I used hypothetical 1 credit = 1 dollar (because that was simpler to deal with) and I only have images up to xlarge so the larger sizes don't really matter. attached is a screenshot to show what I mean. feel free (though it probably goes without saying

) if anyone sees any errors in my calculations here.

sharply_done · « **Reply #42 on:** September 14, 2010, 23:25 »

Quote from: jamirae on September 14, 2010, 22:48

actually I calculated it out. and with the lower credit costs for non-exculsive images at iStock, iStock will actually be making LESS off my images when I cancel exclusivity.
...

Yes, that's known by anyone who's taken the time to examine the ins-and-outs of iStock. I think it's even been mentioned a few times on this forum - guess not everyone was paying attention.

nruboc · « **Reply #43 on:** September 14, 2010, 23:29 »

Quote from: hawk_eye on September 14, 2010, 21:01

fair enough. but it's my guess you're all happy to watch David flounder while you wait it out to see what happens, so he truly is the only one putting his money where his mouth is and I think it will be to his detriment. I hate to see a valuable contributor do that to himself out of misguided loyalty (not because you don't deserve his loyalty, so don't nail me to that cross please, but simply because it is far too early to be jumping ship).

I think iStock has not been given nearly enough credit in this. that you feel a revolution is the only and best way to get them to listen...anyways, whatever. I'm beating my head against the wall. good luck David, sincerely. I do believe you've made an error and I truly am sad to see you go.

And if it's downhill for Exclusives at IStock from this point, then he will look like the smartest exclusive at IStock for jumping ship now. I bet you would be the person on the Titanic shouting "don't worry this ship is too big to sink" Some people want to play it smart and if the ship is showing signs of sinking and be the first off

disorderly · « **Reply #44 on:** September 14, 2010, 23:34 »

Quote from: hawk_eye on September 14, 2010, 21:01

it's my guess you're all happy to watch David flounder while you wait it out to see what happens

You're wrong about this, along with so much else. The last thing anyone here wants is for David to suffer. I think he's making the right choice, but I wish the decision hadn't been necessary. iStock broke faith, and he's decided to take swift and decisive action. I respect him for doing so, I hope that his distress will be brief, and I hope he'll emerge in better financial shape when he's all done.

SNP · « **Reply #45 on:** September 14, 2010, 23:41 »

meh, why bother. good luck David, truly.

Nordlys · « **Reply #46 on:** September 15, 2010, 00:26 »

Brave move, but the right move. One sleeps better at night I can tell you.

Welcome back in the ranks of the indy's!

LostOne · « **Reply #47 on:** September 15, 2010, 01:21 »

Respect!

First they locked the topic but now they deleted it. They don't wanna let others know what you did.

lagereek · « **Reply #48 on:** September 15, 2010, 02:05 »

Wait a minute, hes a Gold member, right? wouldnt it have been wiser to stay and fight it out? I mean we can all jack it in but really what do we achieve? nothing really exept a financial loss plus the fact no one has heard the end of this.
Must say Im surprised so many are prepared to just give up, deleating pics, throwing the towell. Anybody can do this!!

Whats the matter with people? dont bother removing ports, youre achieving nothing, show a bit of guts and stay and fight!!

all the best.

dirkr · « **Reply #49 on:** September 15, 2010, 02:09 »

Quote from: sharply_done on September 14, 2010, 23:25

Quote from: jamirae on September 14, 2010, 22:48

actually I calculated it out. and with the lower credit costs for non-exculsive images at iStock, iStock will actually be making LESS off my images when I cancel exclusivity.
...

Yes, that's known by anyone who's taken the time to examine the ins-and-outs of iStock. I think it's even been mentioned a few times on this forum - guess not everyone was paying attention.

But what everybody leaves out of the equation: This is only true if you assume the same number of images is bought irrespective of price.
If, OTOH, image buyers are working on a fixed budget it looks different - they may buy more for cheaper prices.

As Istock has mentioned themselves in the announcements (or what I read out of it), their concern is the average commission paid out for the total sum of sales they are making. In that respect, cancelling exclusivity (but leaving the portfolio for sale on Istock) is 100% in line with Istock's goals.

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Author Topic: Money where my mouth is. (Read 25752 times)

PeterChigmaroff

sharpshot

nruboc

Dreamframer

nruboc

gbalex

lisafx

click_click

dgilder

click_click

SNP

rubyroo

madelaide

cthoman

SNP

Norebbo

jamirae

sharply_done

nruboc

disorderly

SNP

Nordlys

LostOne

lagereek

dirkr

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