A couple of years back I sold a few things on ebay with no problems at all.

A couple of months ago I sold an iMac, since I bought a laptop. It sold for over $500. The buyer paid me promptly and I shipped the computer next day, UPS with tracking info. Paypal would not release the money to me until a) the buyer received the shipment and Paypal could verify tracking info or b) the buyer left positive feedback on ebay.

I provided BOTH things and yet Paypal would not release the money. After speaking to three different people who gave me various sorts of runarounds and told me there wasn't anything they could do, I finally spoke to a supervisor (about three days later) who released the money.

I use Paypal to receive all of my microstock payments and never have an issue, but I will NEVER sell anything on ebay again. Ebay and Paypal are linked so closely that it seems like the way to go. My beef isn't really with ebay, but with the Paypal connection.

eBay owns PayPal ... if you deal on eBay your stuck with them. That is why I quit after 10 years.

-Larry

I assume you knew ebay's and paypal's rules going in and if you looked up the negative feedback before you sold to her you should have known the risk you were taking.  That is what risk is all about - sometimes you lose.  (Don't feel bad Lehman brothers and a whole lot of other financial institutions don't seem to understand risk or protecting against it any better than you do.) 

You pays your money - or ships your ipod - you takes your chances.

fred

that's not how ebay works -- the seller cant see a buyers fdbk b4 they bid; and it would take a lot of time to look afterwards -AND ebay doesnt look kindly on selers who cancel legitimate bids.

with the new fdbk system it wouldnt matter anyway - since sellers cant leave neg fdbk

steve

it'll be even closer soon -- ebay will soon forbid payment by check or credit card [they eliminated cash sales last year]

Maybe check, but they'll never forbid payment by credit card. If they did that they'd lose a large chunk of their business.

I use to sell a few things every once in a while at ebay but then the fees they started charging became so outrageous that it wasn't worth.

The main reason that paypal decides most things in favor of the buyer is that most buyers buy with credit cards and with credit cards the customer is allowed to dispute charges and the merchant normally gets screwed (offline too). If they didn't side with the buyer then paypal would be stuck with the bill every time a customer disputed a credit card charge.

ADVICE:
I would never use paypal to transfer money or to get my microstock earnings because the way US laws are written, Paypal is not subject to the normal laws and rules for processing transactions. You're basically subject to the whims of eBay.

Please don't mix up paypal and ebay.I put my earnings from istock into my paypal account.I then transfer the funds from paypal to my curent bank account with NO charge over �50.
I happy with this  arrangment as most of the money i earn from my photos will be re-invested in camera kit.

Shank, Paypal is owned by ebay. Paypal is ebay. How do you not mix up paypal and ebay? I'd never use paypal to transfer funds because it is an unregulated financial company. It's like giving your money to Bernard Madoff, it's a black box and you don't know what will happen with your money.

Please excuse ying yang.He is not been well of late...
Paypal is a perfect finanicial solution for your banking needs..period.
Ebay is a place you sell your unwanted crap or buy some more..period.

And I know Paypal has had security issues, but it costs me $0 for the transfers I do (as opposed to Moneybookers who charge for every transaction) and as soon as the money is put into Paypal I transfer it out. My risk of loss is very minimal. I would NEVER leave thousands in there, or even hundreds, that's for sure.

Quote from: shank_ali on December 18, 2008, 15:20

Please excuse ying yang.He is not been well of late...
Paypal is a perfect finanicial solution for your banking needs..period.
Ebay is a place you sell your unwanted crap or buy some more..period.

There is a big bridge in New York I'd like to sell. It's called the Brooklyn Bridge ...... are you interested? 

-Larry

No joke. And shank, while you're buying the Brooklyn Bridge I know this great investment fund you can put your money in. It's run by Bernard Madoff and he's an investment genius. Look shank, paypal is not a bank and you shouldn't treat it like one. If you're ok with giving an unregulated company your money than that's ok with me.

For those that aren't as trusting as shank you should know that moving the money from your paypal account to your bank account doesn't mean your money is safe. Your contract with paypal authorizes paypal to make ACH withdraws from your bank account without notifying you. Because paypal is NOT a financial institution by law it is not subject to the laws and regulations that regulate banks. You have no recourse if you have money "deposited" on paypal and use that money to purchase items. The only safe way to use paypal to accept money is to have two seperate bank accounts. The first one is linked to paypal, the other is not. When you withdraw money from paypal into account #1 you should immediately transfer that money to account #2 so that they can't get the money back through use of a ACH transaction if, for instance a buyer says the thing you sold them didn't arrive and disputes the charge to his/her credit card.

The Bridge is mine and i shall increase the toll charge in the new year.
Ying Yang your financial advice is noted.If something aint broke why fix it.istock>>paypal>>barclays bank>>>wallet>> brothel 

With regards to PayPal in eBay transactions, my view of things has definitely changed after this experience. I used to wonder why sellers charged what seemed to me like excessive shipping rates, but now I realize that I'm the one who has been charging too little for shipping and using the cheaper shipping options. In trying to keep buyers happy, I got burned. Obviously now it has to be tracking number and delivery confirmation on all items, even if that mean more cost to buyers. Plus with the way PayPal robs sellers on transaction fees, it's no wonder the sellers have to pad their shipping costs.

Most eye-opening to me is the notion that buyers are king as far as PayPal is concerned. I wrote to PayPal to find out why they even allow buyers to file disputes at any time after a transaction is complete, even within a few days of sending payment. As expected, no response. But it seems to me that they must know that some buyers are abusing the system, filing disputes just to reclaim payment when they really did receive the item, and yet PayPal really doesn't seem to care. I have to imagine that since it is so easy to file a dispute and get a refund if a seller doesn't use tracking numbers, this kind of fraud must happen on a daily basis. No doubt many crooks know about this loophole, and use it to their advantage frequently. And what is PayPal's response? Not only do they not seem bothered by the problem, but they take steps to make it as easy as possible for someone to file a dispute and get their money back. I bet you could file a dispute the day after sending payment and the refund would be happily processed by PayPal. And what recourse does the seller have? Nothing. Not even feedback anymore, meaning no way to warn other sellers about a con-artist buyer.

I now know to protect myself when using eBay. But how many other sellers out there don't? How many sellers are getting ripped off every single day? It's a sad state of affairs for sellers at eBay and PayPal.

So when I told the buyer that I shipped it First Class (meaning without tracking), that opened the door for her to contact PayPal and get her money back.

So the harsh lesson here is this: While I wish I could continue to trust people and give them the benefit of the doubt, the fact is that people on eBay are generally scum, and will steal the shirt off your back first chance they get.

As much as I feel for you, to expect someone else to pickup the bill for your mistake is not right, maybe the Ebay Buyer is telling the truth and the Driver, Postman, Warehouseman or one of the many other people that handled the package ripped it off, that can happen as well, Ebay are aware of most scams and if this buyer has a claims history they will act.

If I buy or sell an Item for $5.00 I will only use a signed for service, or collection in person and that is all I would accept, not because I do not trust the seller or buyer, but because things do get "Lost in Transit", I recently purchased a Laptop, I was out when it was delivered, and when I got home there was a "Left with Neighbour" card, but no parcel with the neighbour so I went straight to the carriers depot, when the driver returned it was "Found" in the van.

I send my expences which have no value to anyone else in weekly, the only time they were sent not signed for they were "Lost", it is just a peace of mind more than a monetry reason that I will not use an un-recorded service no matter what the value.
 
The real lesson you have learned here: Not all people on Ebay are Scum, some people in all walks of life can be, and you run a risk and are responsible to cover the cost if you send an item unrecorded or not-tracked and it is "Lost in Transit".

David (106 Ebay Transactions with no problems)

I can't believe I have got to page 4 of this discussion and no-one has mentioned ebid.net or the Google Checkout payment system.

With all of ebay's upheavals over the past 18 months or so,ebid.net (which has been going for about 10 years now), has seen a huge increase in its membership.

This has mainly been sellers, fed up with being ripped off by ebay AND paypal (rising fees, restrictions on payment methods, paypal forced down their throats, not being able to leave non-performing buyers neg feedback... ... ... ).

The latest being a maximum shipping charge of �2.75 for books - this does not cover sufficent insurance for items over �36 or even allow for trackable post. the upshot being that sellers have to (again) raise their start or BIN price (again) to offset fees and postage costs - this has further implications when items get lost or missing in the post.

Simply put, it is becoming ridiculously difficult for any one man seller to make a living from ebay.

Many of those sellers have moved over to ebid.net - however, the ebay buyers who don't have to worry about fees etc are staying put.

Ebid is FREE to sell with small Final Value Fees which you don't pay if you don't use Gallery and have Seller+ membership.

Ebid allow Google Checkout, which is cheaper for the seller to administer. It is also easier from the buyer's point of view as they don't need a paypal balance.

Ebid is also pretty much a buyer's market at the moment.

The whole community is still small enough to keep an eye on scammers, who are dealt with more or less immediately. All sellers must be verified, as (I think) are buyers. no-one is allowed to have two or more accounts , not even a forum posting ID.

People are afraid of change and may be timid to try ebid.net and Google Checkout (either as seller or buyer).

At least you all know of them now.

http://ebid.net/

http://checkout.google.co.uk/

For non=UK http://checkout.google.com/