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Author Topic: IRS Withholding Taxes for non U.S. Submitters  (Read 94303 times)

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RT


« Reply #350 on: June 02, 2009, 12:15 »
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Suppose you could legally pay the 30% US withholding in exchange for no other tax liability where you live. Would you think that would likely be a deal which was worth considering financially?

Speaking personally - You have got to be joking  :D That 30% could buy a lot of very necessary toys business equipment that can be written off against your tax return.




« Reply #351 on: June 02, 2009, 12:51 »
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You are talking rubbish... It doesn't have anything to do with international business handling. ALL INTERNATIONAL BUSINESSES have OFFICES AND ARE FUNCTIONING ON TAX AVOIDANCE PRINCIPLES TO BE COMPETITIVE!


You make me laugh, you claim to be a CEO of an agency and yet you didn't know about the US tax laws and think it has nothing to do with international business  :D


Sorry dude your non-knowing things comes to level where I must say you are talking stupid. IF JON KNEW for that HOW TO RUN INTERNATIONAL COMPANY he'd made that this issue about tax never come up!

IF I am CEO on Shutterstock I'd make some Shutterstock company on Cayman Islands or in Ireland and handle things as any other serious company handling things about taxes.

My company don't do business with USA because we are more with EU and Asian markets which bring us less harrasment to complete business!

And YES - US TAX doesn't have not single influence in running international business!


Milinz if you set up a stock company in Ireland you would find your new company in exactly the same predicament SS finds itself in now.

When the Irish tax authorities find out that you are paying royalties from your new stock photo firm they have the very same right to tax royalty income that arises and is payed by a company in their state AKA Ireland!

Below you will find the Tax Treaty agreement which Ireland has made with 50 countries.

Ireland's Tax Treaty agreement regarding ROYALTIES (which is what micro stock is covered under) is covered in (ARTICLE 12)

http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/law/tax-treaties.html

Commentary on typical provisions of Irish tax treaties
http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/law/commentary_irishtaxtreaties.pdf

"ROYALTIES (ARTICLE 12)

This article provides rules for the taxation of royalties. It limits the taxation in the source State of royalties paid to a resident of the other State. While the OECD model treaty grants full exemption from taxation in the source State, many Irish treaties allow for reduced rates of taxation of gross royalty payments.

The term royalties is defined in the article and covers payments in respect of copyright of literary, artistic or scientific work as well as patents and trademarks. Some treaties also cover leasing payments payments for the use of, or the right to use, industrial, commercial or scientific equipment which would otherwise normally come under Article 7 (Business Profits).

The source State retains the right to tax royalties attributable to a permanent establishment of the beneficial owner in that State. In that case, the provisions of Article 7 (Business Profits) will apply and the source State may tax the income at the normal business tax rate.

Royalties are deemed to arise in the Contracting State that the payer is a resident of or, if paid in connection with a permanent establishment in the Contracting State, in the State where the permanent establishment is situated.

In cases involving special relationships between the payer and beneficial owner of a royalty, the provisions of the article will only apply to the extent that the royalty does not exceed the amount that would have been paid between parties at arms length."
« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 15:10 by gbalex »

alias

« Reply #352 on: June 02, 2009, 12:52 »
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Suppose you could legally pay the 30% US withholding in exchange for no other tax liability where you live. Would you think that would likely be a deal which was worth considering financially?

Speaking personally - You have got to be joking  :D That 30% could buy a lot of very necessary toys business equipment that can be written off against your tax return.

OK thanks. You are fortunate to live in place which has a tax treaty. That makes things simple.

I'm super tax efficient. So nothing for me to offset against the 30% withholding which I am unfortunately stuck with if I continue to deal with US agencies which do not have regional offices. Since I already pay none. Or else I might move to the UK and pay less than none:)

alias

« Reply #353 on: June 02, 2009, 13:06 »
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@gbalex

More or less the same treaty exists between Canada and many other countries does it not? It is based on what is basically an OECD template. The reserved right to levy taxes is not the same as a policy to levy taxes.

I'm curious why only the US levies these taxes and / or withholding taxes.

However there is another issue. The treaty you are quoting details the tax arrangements which exist between nations which have a treaty. It does not detail the arrangements which exist where there is no treaty.

I'm not arguing with you. Just saying that what you are quoting is not the full answer.

Finally. I wonder whether non treaty photographers would end up paying less than 30% if they actually submitted a US tax return c/w deductions, costs, offsets etc.

« Reply #354 on: June 02, 2009, 13:19 »
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@gbalex

More or less the same treaty exists between Canada and many other countries does it not? It is based on what is basically an OECD template. The reserved right to levy taxes is not the same as a policy to levy taxes.

I'm curious why only the US levies these taxes and / or withholding taxes.

However there is another issue. The treaty you are quoting details the tax arrangements which exist between nations which have a treaty. It does not detail the arrangements which exist where there is no treaty.

I'm not arguing with you. Just saying that what you are quoting is not the full answer.

Finally. I wonder whether non treaty photographers would end up paying less than 30% if they actually submitted a US tax return c/w deductions, costs, offsets etc.

Yes Canada has a very similar tax treaty agreement and yes you are correct... most countries have the same wording in their tax treaties. This levels the playing field so that we can all do business together globally. 

I can not comment on the countries which have not signed the agreements.  However many small countries have.

If you talk to business leaders and owners who's businesses pay royalties you will find that governments do levy tax's on royalties that arise in their states or countries.  This is certainly not a new development.

It looks like microstock companies are/were unaware of these tax treaty requirements or they have decided to ignore them until the payees are/were forced to comply!





« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 13:22 by gbalex »

alias

« Reply #355 on: June 02, 2009, 13:36 »
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@gbalex

I think that what creates the difference with the US and US companies has its roots in the way in which US citizens have a liability to be taxed on their international earnings whether or not they even live or are even domiciled in the US. Very few nations do that. From that follows a whole different approach to collecting taxes.

Govts apart from the US are not collecting taxes on photo royalties.

**** sorry - to add: apart from the taxes which the agencies actually pay. Which is a different matter.

That is not a mistake.

Sure it might change. I'm not arguing with you.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 13:38 by alias »

« Reply #356 on: June 02, 2009, 13:43 »
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I'm not an expert on these things. Can somebody explain, why someone in an 0%-treaty-country has to do this paperwork? I do not see the point yet.  ???

« Reply #357 on: June 02, 2009, 14:19 »
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I'm not an expert on these things. Can somebody explain, why someone in an 0%-treaty-country has to do this paperwork? I do not see the point yet.  ???
Well, i phoned up the IRS today and asked them if instead of a notarised and apostilled passport they would instead accept vast amounts of incredulity.

No go, I'm afraid. And i was on the phone for hours, being totally charming... : (

I think the IRS require evidence that we are who we say we are; just in case we're no good darn cheaters trying to pretend to be british, or french, or some other foreigner when we're really not.

The story so far is that there is no way out of it. But stories have changed before..... : )

x

« Reply #358 on: June 02, 2009, 14:22 »
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Oringer wrote:

3) If you don't want to deal with this, then leave. We are happy to remove all your images for you. If I continue to read threads on the forum that you will be taking your images elsewhere, I will delete them myself and close your account. I've done it a few times already- I am not kidding about this.

This remind me of Michael Manley of Jamaica.
During his administration in a speech he said:

"...there are five flights a day from Jamaica to Miami. If anyone do not like what I do, they should take one."

Many did.

« Reply #359 on: June 02, 2009, 14:32 »
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Well, i phoned up the IRS today and asked them if instead of a notarised and apostilled passport they would instead accept vast amounts of incredulity.

No go, I'm afraid. And i was on the phone for hours, being totally charming... : (

I think the IRS require evidence that we are who we say we are; just in case we're no good darn cheaters trying to pretend to be british, or french, or some other foreigner when we're really not.

The story so far is that there is no way out of it. But stories have changed before..... : )

x

As far as I remember I had to upload a copy of my passport when registering to Shutterstock ;)

« Reply #360 on: June 02, 2009, 14:49 »
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@gbalex

I think that what creates the difference with the US and US companies has its roots in the way in which US citizens have a liability to be taxed on their international earnings whether or not they even live or are even domiciled in the US. Very few nations do that. From that follows a whole different approach to collecting taxes.

Govts apart from the US are not collecting taxes on photo royalties.

**** sorry - to add: apart from the taxes which the agencies actually pay. Which is a different matter.

That is not a mistake.

Sure it might change. I'm not arguing with you.


Spend a bit of time on Alamy's site... they are a UK company.

http://www.alamy.com/example-tax-payments.asp
"If you are not located in the following territories you need to review the Table of Treaty Rates which sets out the DTT (Double Tax Treaty) relief you may be eligible for. The table below assumes that you are eligible for the DTT relief.

Table of example payments for individual contributors"



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alamy

Milinz

« Reply #361 on: June 02, 2009, 15:07 »
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Suppose you could legally pay the 30% US withholding in exchange for no other tax liability where you live. Would you think that would likely be a deal which was worth considering financially?

Speaking personally - You have got to be joking  :D That 30% could buy a lot of very necessary toys business equipment that can be written off against your tax return.


Yes, that is main problem - some of unlisted countries do not recognize TAX payed to IRS. Maybe some people will need to notarize that IRS papers too and pay extra money for getting some tax extemption from your tax office in your country... And that comes to hassle without any justifying cause... In most cases 30% that is withheld in USA can't be calculated as payed tax in country where author lives... That means double-taxing!


alias

« Reply #362 on: June 02, 2009, 15:16 »
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@gbalex

I think that what creates the difference with the US and US companies has its roots in the way in which US citizens have a liability to be taxed on their international earnings whether or not they even live or are even domiciled in the US. Very few nations do that. From that follows a whole different approach to collecting taxes.

Govts apart from the US are not collecting taxes on photo royalties.

**** sorry - to add: apart from the taxes which the agencies actually pay. Which is a different matter.

That is not a mistake.

Sure it might change. I'm not arguing with you.


Spend a bit of time on Alamy's site... they are a UK company.

http://www.alamy.com/example-tax-payments.asp
"If you are not located in the following territories you need to review the Table of Treaty Rates which sets out the DTT (Double Tax Treaty) relief you may be eligible for. The table below assumes that you are eligible for the DTT relief.

Table of example payments for individual contributors"



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alamy


OK - In general i definitely would bow to your superior knowledge. But I want to ask this .

Are you absolutely certain that the page you have linked to is not actually about a VAT change rather than being about a tax on royalties? Is that page actually about something which is like the US withholding tax? I am not sure that it is.

That pages seems to relate to VAT. The table columns seem to be about VAT. VAT is what people in the US call 'sales tax'. Same as applies in most US states.

And that would make sense in the context of it being about a switch from Alamy Jersey to Alamy UK. Since Jersey is crown dependency but not part of the UK, makes its own regulation and does not levy VAT ( - or did not. IIRC I read that they are / might be introducing it). So moving from a relationship with Alamy Jersey to one with Alamy UK would involve dealing with UK VAT.

I could be completely wrong.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 15:19 by alias »

Milinz

« Reply #363 on: June 02, 2009, 15:27 »
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...


...


...


Milinz if you set up a stock company in Ireland you would find your new company in exactly the same predicament SS finds itself in now.

When the Irish tax authorities find out that you are paying royalties from your new stock photo firm they have the very same right to tax royalty income that arises and is payed by a company in their state AKA Ireland!

Below you will find the Tax Treaty agreement which Ireland has made with 50 countries.

Ireland's Tax Treaty agreement regarding ROYALTIES (which is what micro stock is covered under) is covered in (ARTICLE 12)

http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/law/tax-treaties.html

Commentary on typical provisions of Irish tax treaties
http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/law/commentary_irishtaxtreaties.pdf

"ROYALTIES (ARTICLE 12)

This article provides rules for the taxation of royalties. It limits the taxation in the source State of royalties paid to a resident of the other State. While the OECD model treaty grants full exemption from taxation in the source State, many Irish treaties allow for reduced rates of taxation of gross royalty payments.

The term royalties is defined in the article and covers payments in respect of copyright of literary, artistic or scientific work as well as patents and trademarks. Some treaties also cover leasing payments payments for the use of, or the right to use, industrial, commercial or scientific equipment which would otherwise normally come under Article 7 (Business Profits).

The source State retains the right to tax royalties attributable to a permanent establishment of the beneficial owner in that State. In that case, the provisions of Article 7 (Business Profits) will apply and the source State may tax the income at the normal business tax rate.

Royalties are deemed to arise in the Contracting State that the payer is a resident of or, if paid in connection with a permanent establishment in the Contracting State, in the State where the permanent establishment is situated.

In cases involving special relationships between the payer and beneficial owner of a royalty, the provisions of the article will only apply to the extent that the royalty does not exceed the amount that would have been paid between parties at arms length."




There is one little difference...

UK and Northern Ireland is mentioned somewhere in some other treaty I've found... So, I think it says 10% for most of listed countries.
In USA there is no list as well there is no way to legally ask from many other governmets that 30% to be calculated into domestic tax needed to pay ;-)

So be my guest and read this list with carefuly counting listed countries:

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/international/in_force.htm

So, you will find there is 121 Country listed which is mere double than in USA list!
« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 15:41 by Milinz »

« Reply #364 on: June 02, 2009, 15:49 »
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...


...


...


Milinz if you set up a stock company in Ireland you would find your new company in exactly the same predicament SS finds itself in now.

When the Irish tax authorities find out that you are paying royalties from your new stock photo firm they have the very same right to tax royalty income that arises and is payed by a company in their state AKA Ireland!

Below you will find the Tax Treaty agreement which Ireland has made with 50 countries.

Ireland's Tax Treaty agreement regarding ROYALTIES (which is what micro stock is covered under) is covered in (ARTICLE 12)

http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/law/tax-treaties.html

Commentary on typical provisions of Irish tax treaties
http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/law/commentary_irishtaxtreaties.pdf

"ROYALTIES (ARTICLE 12)

This article provides rules for the taxation of royalties. It limits the taxation in the source State of royalties paid to a resident of the other State. While the OECD model treaty grants full exemption from taxation in the source State, many Irish treaties allow for reduced rates of taxation of gross royalty payments.

The term royalties is defined in the article and covers payments in respect of copyright of literary, artistic or scientific work as well as patents and trademarks. Some treaties also cover leasing payments payments for the use of, or the right to use, industrial, commercial or scientific equipment which would otherwise normally come under Article 7 (Business Profits).

The source State retains the right to tax royalties attributable to a permanent establishment of the beneficial owner in that State. In that case, the provisions of Article 7 (Business Profits) will apply and the source State may tax the income at the normal business tax rate.

Royalties are deemed to arise in the Contracting State that the payer is a resident of or, if paid in connection with a permanent establishment in the Contracting State, in the State where the permanent establishment is situated.

In cases involving special relationships between the payer and beneficial owner of a royalty, the provisions of the article will only apply to the extent that the royalty does not exceed the amount that would have been paid between parties at arms length."




There is one little difference...

UK and Northern Ireland is mentioned somewhere in some other treaty I've found... So, I think it says 10% for most of listed countries.
In USA there is no list as well there is no way to legally ask from many other governmets that 30% to be calculated into domestic tax needed to pay ;-)

So be my guest and read this list with carefuly counting listed countries:

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/international/in_force.htm

So, you will find there is 121 Country listed which is mere double than in USA list!


Ireland which is where you stated would be a good country to set up a micro stock company has entered into tax treaty agreements with 50 countries.  The US has entered into tax treaty agreements with 68 countries. 

The percentage of tax liability required varies for each country according to those agreements.

Here is an example for Australia

"Australian tax agreement rates

Australia has entered into tax agreements with over 40 countries. These agreements prevent double taxation, reduce opportunities for tax evasion, and foster cooperation between Australia and other international tax authorities in enforcing their respective tax laws.

Australias tax agreements provide different tax rates for particular payments. For countries marked with an asterisk in the table below, please see Notes following the table for an explanation of the different rates that apply to unfranked dividend and royalty payments. The notes also cover the interest withholding tax exemptions in the US and UK agreements."

http://www.ato.gov.au/businesses/content.asp?doc=/Content/50240.htm&page=15

alias

« Reply #365 on: June 02, 2009, 16:05 »
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@gbalex

Ireland does not deduct tax from photographers against royalties. Nor does any other nation which anyone can think of apart form the US. The fact that the OECD tax treaty template allows for that is quite a different matter.

The Alamy page you linked to seems to relate to UK VAT which is equivalent to US sales tax.

You seem to be accidentally confusing issues relating to royalties and sales tax and linking to stuff about tax treaties.

Milinz

« Reply #366 on: June 02, 2009, 16:10 »
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@gbalex

Ireland does not deduct tax from photographers against royalties. Nor does any other nation which anyone can think of apart form the US. The fact that the OECD tax treaty template allows for that is quite a different matter.

The Alamy page you linked to seems to relate to UK VAT which is equivalent to US sales tax.

You seem to be accidentally confusing issues relating to royalties and sales tax and linking to stuff about tax treaties.

Sorry is Ireland not in UK? Maybe Ireland have its own international tax system?

Never mind then, London is place to setup stock agency. There is 121 country listed with that tax treaty. And yes OECD has great deal with not taxing in advance as US does.


« Reply #367 on: June 02, 2009, 16:44 »
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@gbalex

I think that what creates the difference with the US and US companies has its roots in the way in which US citizens have a liability to be taxed on their international earnings whether or not they even live or are even domiciled in the US. Very few nations do that. From that follows a whole different approach to collecting taxes.

Govts apart from the US are not collecting taxes on photo royalties.

**** sorry - to add: apart from the taxes which the agencies actually pay. Which is a different matter.

That is not a mistake.

Sure it might change. I'm not arguing with you.


Spend a bit of time on Alamy's site... they are a UK company.

http://www.alamy.com/example-tax-payments.asp
"If you are not located in the following territories you need to review the Table of Treaty Rates which sets out the DTT (Double Tax Treaty) relief you may be eligible for. The table below assumes that you are eligible for the DTT relief.

Table of example payments for individual contributors"



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alamy


OK - In general i definitely would bow to your superior knowledge. But I want to ask this .

Are you absolutely certain that the page you have linked to is not actually about a VAT change rather than being about a tax on royalties? Is that page actually about something which is like the US withholding tax? I am not sure that it is.

That pages seems to relate to VAT. The table columns seem to be about VAT. VAT is what people in the US call 'sales tax'. Same as applies in most US states.

And that would make sense in the context of it being about a switch from Alamy Jersey to Alamy UK. Since Jersey is crown dependency but not part of the UK, makes its own regulation and does not levy VAT ( - or did not. IIRC I read that they are / might be introducing it). So moving from a relationship with Alamy Jersey to one with Alamy UK would involve dealing with UK VAT.

I could be completely wrong.


It outlines both Vat and the rates for withholding's taxes charged to to foreigners outside of the UK as outlined in the UK's tax treaty's

http://www.alamy.com/stock-photography-faqs-tax-non-uk.asp

# What is Withholding Tax (WHT)?
Withholding Tax (WHT) is a government's imposition of a tax on distributions being made to foreigners. The purpose of the tax is to allow the government to make sure it exacts its share of a taxable event before the wealth leaves its shores and moves beyond its control. Thus, in Alamy's case it is the tax Alamy has to deduct and account for to the UK government when it is making royalty payments for the use of images to providers of those images who are not tax resident in the UK. It will only apply to Contributors who are NOT tax resident in the United Kingdom and who are paid outside of the UK mainland.

# What do you mean by tax resident?
You will normally be tax resident in the country in which you pay your tax bills and where you submit your tax return. However, tax residence is a complex subject which is determined by local legislation and case law in each country. We therefore recommend that you obtain confirmation from your local tax authority if you are uncertain as to your tax residence status.

# What do you mean by UK mainland?
The United Kingdom mainland comprises England, Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland but excludes the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man.

# How will this affect the payments made to me?
During registration you will be required to supply your tax details including an assurance regarding the country where you are registered for tax. Alamy will deduct withholding tax from your payment in line with the double tax treaty between the country you are tax resident in and the United Kingdom. This rate can vary from between 0% to 22%. For further details, please visit our Table of Treaty Rates.

If you do not answer the questions relating to Withholding Tax within My Alamy, then Alamy will deduct 22% of the net amount due to you in each payment run.

# What is the standard rate of WHT?
The standard rate of the tax in the UK is 22%. This is applicable for all payments relating to photographic royalties to all countries.

# Can I reduce the rate of WHT that I pay?
Yes. If there is a double tax treaty between the country you are resident in and the UK and you can assure Alamy that you are tax resident in that country then we can apply the treaty rate on all payments to you. The treaty rate in many cases, e.g. for the US and Canada reduces the rate of WHT from 22% to 0%.

# How I can inform you that I qualify for a reduced rate of WHT?
If you are already a registered Contributor then you need to provide details via the payment and tax details page. If you are a new contributor you need to answer the questions during the registration process.

# How will you deduct WHT from payments to me?
Alamy will deduct WHT at the applicable rate of tax from the net amount to be paid out to you after deduction of payment fees and any foreign exchange fees.

# How will I see WHT on my statement?
It will be a line item on your statement when a payment is made to you. It will appear after the payment and FX fees, but before the cheque sent/funds transfer line.

# What does Alamy do with the money deducted for WHT?
Alamy will pay over the money deducted to the proper government department responsible for the collection of this tax in the UK.
The money deducted is not our income and we do not benefit from deducting it.

# What do you mean by "Will you be making royalty payments to other photographers from the money you receive from Alamy"?
Do the images submitted by yourself as a Contributor include images that are not your own, i.e. you are representing these images on behalf of other photographers. If this is the case do you have to pay the respective photographers for their work dependent on your receipts from Alamy? For example, if you paid a one off price to another photographer to either own the rights to the image, or you have acquired the right to exploit the image, then you would answer no, but if you pay a percentage of any sales from that image to a photographer you would answer yes.

# I do not make royalty payments to other photographers but I do not understand the following statement:

    "Please confirm whether you are beneficially entitled to income you will receive from Alamy and that you meet the necessary conditions for the payment to be received gross under the relevant treaty between the country in which you are tax resident, and the United Kingdom"?

The statement asks whether you are beneficially entitled to the income, i.e. you should be beneficially entitled to the income as long as you legally own the rights to the images or you have acquired the right to exploit the image and underlying copyright from the legal owner. You will normally meet the necessary conditions for the payment to be received at the relevant treaty rate as long as you are tax resident in the country in which you have said you are resident. However, if you have any doubt as to your eligibility to benefit from the relevant double tax treaty then you should review the said tax treaty to ensure that you are not excluded by virtue of any specific terms of the treaty agreement.

# I make payments to other photographers but I do not know whether all my photographers are tax resident in the same country as I, what should I do?
You should continue to register or provide your details and finish the process by answering "No, not all 3 statements apply to me". You should then attempt to find out whether your photographers are tax resident in the same country as yourself, and if so, you can then come back and complete the details field again. If you find that not all of the photographers are tax resident in the same country as yourself then you should contact [email protected] with the breakdown of photographers. We can then contact you, as it is likely that we will need to find out more information from you.

# I make payments to other photographers who are all tax resident in the same country as myself but I do not understand the following statement:

    "That they, the beneficial owners of the income, meet the necessary conditions for the payment to be received gross under the relevant treaty between the country in which you are tax resident, and the United Kingdom."?

The statement asks whether the photographers you represent are beneficially entitled to the income, i.e. they should be entitled to the income as long as they legally own the rights to the images or they have acquired the right to exploit the image and underlying copyright from the legal owner. They will normally meet the necessary conditions for the payment to be received at the relevant treaty rate as long as they are tax resident in the country in which you have said they are resident. However, if you have any doubt as to their eligibility to benefit from the relevant double tax treaty then you should review the said tax treaty to ensure that you or them are not excluded by virtue of any specific terms of the treaty agreement.

# What do I do if my circumstances change?
You should update the Alamy website with your new details as soon as possible.

# How will I receive deduction certificates stating how much tax you have deducted?
Alamy will send out certificates every year. The certificates will state for each payment made to you how much tax was deducted in US$, the rate of tax, the date of payment and how much the gross payment was. The information will be in US$, as this is the currency your statement is in.

# What is the DTT rate for the territory I am tax resident in?
For further details, please visit our Table of Treaty Rates.

# Table of implications for WHT
« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 17:01 by gbalex »

alias

« Reply #368 on: June 02, 2009, 17:06 »
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@gbalex

You seem to be completely correct.

Can only be a matter of time before this becomes more widespread and not just with US agencies.

« Reply #369 on: June 02, 2009, 17:16 »
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@gbalex

You seem to be completely correct.

Can only be a matter of time before this becomes more widespread and not just with US agencies.

That is my conclusion!

« Reply #370 on: June 02, 2009, 18:37 »
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Sorry is Ireland not in UK? Maybe Ireland have its own international tax system?

The Republic of Ireland, or Eire, is not UK.  Missed some geography classes?   ;)

Milinz

« Reply #371 on: June 02, 2009, 19:35 »
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Sorry is Ireland not in UK? Maybe Ireland have its own international tax system?


The Republic of Ireland, or Eire, is not UK.  Missed some geography classes?   ;)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Ireland

"UK/YUGOSLAVIA DOUBLE TAXATION CONVENTION
SIGNED 6 NOVEMBER 1981
(CONTINUES TO APPLY TO SERBIA & MONTENEGRO)
....
CONVENTION BETWEEN THE UNITED KINGDOM OF GREAT BRITAIN AND NORTHERN IRELAND AND THE SOCIALIST FEDERAL REPUBLIC OF YUGOSLAVIA FOR THE AVOIDANCE OF DOUBLE TAXATION WITH RESPECT TO TAXES ON INCOME
...
General Definitions
(1) For the purposes of this Convention:
(a) The term "United Kingdom" means Great Britain and Northern Ireland, including any area outside the territorial sea of the United Kingdom which in accordance with international law has been or may hereafter be designated, under the laws of the United Kingdom concerning the Continental Shelf, as an area within which the rights of the United Kingdom with respect to the sea bed and sub-soil and their natural resources may be exercised;
(b) the term "Yugoslavia" means the territory of the Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia including also any area outside the territorial sea of Yugoslavia which has been or may hereafter be designated under the laws of Yugoslavia and in accordance with international law, as an area within which the rights of Yugoslavia to the sea bed and sub-soil and their natural resources may be exercised;
(c) the term "national" means:
(i) in relation to the United Kingdom, any citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies who derives his status as such from his connection with the United Kingdom;
(ii) in relation to Yugoslavia, a Yugoslav citizen and any other individual who derives his status as such from the law in force in Yugoslavia;
(d) the term "United Kingdom tax" means tax imposed by the United Kingdom being tax to which this Convention applies by virtue of the provisions of Article 2; the term "Yugoslav tax" means taxes and contributions, with the exception of the contribution for social security, imposed in Yugoslavia being tax to which this Convention applies by virtue of the provisions of Article 2;
(e) the term "tax" means United Kingdom tax or Yugoslav tax, as the context requires;
"

Btw here is whole treaty and you read it ;-)


http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/international/serbia-uk-double-taxation.pdf

Milinz

« Reply #372 on: June 02, 2009, 19:45 »
0
@gbalex

You seem to be completely correct.

Can only be a matter of time before this becomes more widespread and not just with US agencies.

That is my conclusion!

BTW, I don't mind to have 'withheld' tax from UK government because my country justifies that and I have less to pay to my country as well that is not opposite for UK citizens who earn in Serbia, Montenegro, Croatia and rest of ex Yugoslavia.


The main difference is UK tax of 10% which will be calculated as payed before I have to pay my domestic tax and 30% withhdrawn from US IRS which will not be calculated as payed!
« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 19:52 by Milinz »

« Reply #373 on: June 02, 2009, 19:47 »
0
I find it very interesting how the only people whining like babies about this are the people with extremely small portfolios.  And if I was Jon, I would remove your portfolios in a second.

I don't see any of the large portfolios complaining about this.  And they have the most to lose financially from this.  Why is that?  Where is the complaining from the top portfolios in the world (Mr. Arcurs, or Ms. Pargeter, or Andresr, etc. etc.)?  They stand to lose large sums of money from all of this.  Yet are they moaning about this on the forums?

This topic seems to have become an issue about U.S. politics (and should probably be moved as such to the ranting forums).  Well, let me tell you what the U.S. has done for most of you.  We have saved your butts from two World Wars.  Most of you would be living under a flag from Nazi Germany or the Land of the Rising Sun if it wasn't for the U.S.

You bitch and moan about the U.S. all the time, yet they are the ones that "keep the peace" around the world.  They could have conquered the world ten times over already, yet they are content with their small slice of the world over the pond.

Many of you complain about double taxation, yet many of your counties use a VAT system, which is the epitome of double (and triple and quadruple) taxation.

Why don't you people just get a life!

I wont comment about the tax / contributors. But ROFLAMO with the history and peacekeeping, I seriously hope that it is meant tongue in cheek  :)  
« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 20:38 by Phil »

« Reply #374 on: June 02, 2009, 20:09 »
0
Sorry is Ireland not in UK? Maybe Ireland have its own international tax system?


The Republic of Ireland, or Eire, is not UK.  Missed some geography classes?   ;)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Ireland


Northern Ireland is not Ireland.  Ireland (sites .ie) is another country.  You know, Dublin, St. Patrick, U-2, Guiness beer, James Joyce, Cliffs of Moher.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ireland


 

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