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Author Topic: Why you should never ever work with Wirestock  (Read 3422 times)

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ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« on: June 30, 2022, 11:46 »
+3
Hello

A little rant from me for hearing too much about Wirestock: https://xpiksapp.com/blog/never-use-wirestock/

Let me know what are you thoughts! Do you think this is all wrong and actually WS is a good time investment?


« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2022, 15:09 »
+1
If you are a pro stocker and make a fulltime income from it, then it is better to upload to your own ports.

But for stock newbies and everyone struggling with english, this is a very fair offer.

Other agencies take 50% for distribution and dont do your keywording for you.

I think they have etsablished a useful service. Nobody is forced to use them.

I see you are from xpics :)

I havent tried your service or stock submitter yet. Maybe I should.

I have 22 files on wirestock and two sales. too little to really have an opinion, but I like their workspace.

Unfortunately they are not connected to stockperformer. So it is better to supply agencies directly.
« Last Edit: June 30, 2022, 15:15 by cobalt »

« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2022, 15:09 »
+1
Some really excellent points. I always thought it was a bad idea. More so after the premium upgrade was introduced. Finding out about the absurd tie in time is just the nail in the coffin.

« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2022, 15:10 »
0
If you are a pro stocker and make a fulltime income from it, then it is better to upload to your own ports.

But for stock newbies and everyone struggling with english, this is a very fair offer.

Other agencies take 50% for distribution and dont do your keywording for you.

I think they have etsablished a useful service. Nobody is forced to use them.
It's an extra fee on top though. The agencies will still be taking the same cuts on top.

« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2022, 15:21 »
0
For people who can barely speak or write English, the keywording and description service is really worth it. Plus you reach a higher level much earlier together.

I send half my videos to Blackboxglobal and they also take 15%. But I get better results in how the files are ranked and better royalties, especially on SS with their crazy yearly system.

The higher ranking probably comes from being part of a large port with high volume uploads.

So yes, 15% is a cut, but the royalties are higher, at least on a few agencies.

Then there is the question of ranking in search, again not all agencies will prefer files from highly active uploaders, but some do.

It is simple, easy and frees up time to shoot more.

If you are a pro stocker, you dont need it, but I know a few people who seem very happy with wirestock, just like I am pleased with BB.

« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2022, 03:46 »
+1
Anyone noticed they are not uploading files to microstock sites from last few days/weeks. Even on many mails, there is no proper answer/ explanation for this. I am getting some same useless answer everytime.

If you notice their portfolios on microstock sites, not a single file is increasing.

« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2022, 09:03 »
+2
Anyone noticed they are not uploading files to microstock sites from last few days/weeks. Even on many mails, there is no proper answer/ explanation for this. I am getting some same useless answer everytime.

If you notice their portfolios on microstock sites, not a single file is increasing.

It's a long-running issue since beginning this year, or even last year. Anyhow, since they upgraded their website.

I noticed not a single file of my uploads was submitted to Alamy or Dreamstime for instance, and reached out to their support.
They told me they were gonna fix it 'soon' and that all pending files would be submitted, and that submissions to Shutterstock and Adobe are running fine.

To be honest, I'm not surprised that also Shutterstock's and Adobe's interfaces are broken again. Wirestock suffers, from the beginning, from sloppy programming and intermittent functionality issues. Sometimes the problem is fixed immediately, but some issues linger around and are never fixed. Or fixed and then kaputt again.

Apart from the reasons mentioned by the OP, it's another reason to not put all your eggs in the Wirestock basket.
Sooner or later, you'll find yourself in a checkmate position, and regret you migrated or uploaded everything to Wirestock. Use it wiseley! 

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2022, 09:14 »
+1
If you are a pro stocker and make a fulltime income from it, then it is better to upload to your own ports.

But for stock newbies and everyone struggling with english, this is a very fair offer.

I agree and I come to the similar conclusions in the blogpost. The only point is if you are newbie, being in the higher royalty rate will hardly make a huge difference for you financially (think you will earn $10/month instead of $4 per month). But if you have larger portfolio then you also do not need Wirestock.

« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2022, 12:08 »
0
Wirestock, has undergone some serious changes in the past year.
As far as I'm concerned they are about as good and as bad as the rest of the agencies.
I use Wirestock but don't allow them to upload to Shutterstock, Dreamstime and Adobe.
I do those myself. Since I put the title and keywords into the meta data, this is a very simple
operation for me. Basically all I have to do is upload.
I let Wirestock handle the rest, which means I don't get paid a whole lot but let no dime go unearned.
They now also act as a normal photo agency, but I think this will take some time to show results.
Wirestock is also extremely slow in reviews. For me this is only a slight irritation since I upload to the
big sellers myself.
Since I already took and edited the picture, added title and keywording I see no reason not to upload
to Wirestock.

farbled

« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2022, 14:12 »
+3
WS takes all the stress from me for uploading. I make more with them than I did as a solo submitter. I read the TOS beforehand (as I do for every agency I sign up with), so I knew what I was getting into and therefore most of the points in the blog article don't apply to me. Its not for everyone, but it is for me. :)

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #10 on: July 04, 2022, 02:20 »
+1
all the stress from me for uploading

Honestly would be much interested to hear more about it! What stress do you have with uploading? If you do not want to share here, please DM me. Thanks!

« Reply #11 on: July 04, 2022, 10:53 »
+1
all the stress from me for uploading

Honestly would be much interested to hear more about it! What stress do you have with uploading? If you do not want to share here, please DM me. Thanks!

i have no stress -- but captioning, tagging is most time consuming part of stock for me, so my main reason to use WS is because they do the work.

farbled

« Reply #12 on: July 04, 2022, 11:02 »
+1
all the stress from me for uploading

Honestly would be much interested to hear more about it! What stress do you have with uploading? If you do not want to share here, please DM me. Thanks!

For me, I have traditionally had some agencies take forever to hit payout, if they ever did. The uploading, tagging, everything became cumbersome, which files went where and when, all of it. I know there are tools but still... Anyway, with SS's cuts, I took a long look at everything and decided to simplify the whole thing. Wirestock did that for me. I haven't obsessed over stats and sales and stuff in over a year and I feel much better. Plus I get accumulated payouts, so if I make only a few bucks at DT or Pond5, they all get added together. Plus the SS earnings are more and better for me.
Are there cons to using them? Absolutely, so people should do their due diligence before going in. They may fail, or become unsustainable, and that is a risk same as any other new place to upload. But for now it works for me.

edited to add: this is new: techcrunch.com/2022/07/01/wirestock-getty/
« Last Edit: July 04, 2022, 11:26 by farbled »

« Reply #13 on: July 04, 2022, 12:01 »
0
edited to add: this is new: techcrunch.com/2022/07/01/wirestock-getty/
So again? Wasn't iStock one of the first partners of Wirestock in the beginning?
I remember it was, but they were dropped pretty soon (think because of the complex keywording system iStock uses, might be wrong here)

farbled

« Reply #14 on: July 04, 2022, 12:09 »
0
edited to add: this is new: techcrunch.com/2022/07/01/wirestock-getty/
So again? Wasn't iStock one of the first partners of Wirestock in the beginning?
I remember it was, but they were dropped pretty soon (think because of the complex keywording system iStock uses, might be wrong here)

Looks like they figured something out. I havent seen any other info yet.

Uncle Pete

  • Great Place by a Great Lake - My Home Port
« Reply #15 on: July 04, 2022, 12:14 »
0
edited to add: this is new: techcrunch.com/2022/07/01/wirestock-getty/
So again? Wasn't iStock one of the first partners of Wirestock in the beginning?
I remember it was, but they were dropped pretty soon (think because of the complex keywording system iStock uses, might be wrong here)

Looks like they figured something out. I havent seen any other info yet.

Yeah, they were originally one of the agencies, then not and now?

Dear Peter,

We've got some special news for you!

Wirestock is happy to announce the start of our collaboration with Getty Imagesa huge marketplace you can now sell on.
Please note that we will now be submitting all your content to iStock and Getty Images. If you would not like your portfolio to be submitted to iStock or Getty Images or you already have images that are published there, please let us know by replying to this email before July 12th.

We are happy to have you as a Wirestock creator.

Sincerely yours,
Team Wirestock


Is special anywhere as good as exciting?

Meanwhile, no more ESP no more complicated uploading, I'm putting everything IS in from WS from now on.

And for you, I suppose this will just be automatic added income, if you closed all your "other" and personal accounts?

farbled

« Reply #16 on: July 04, 2022, 12:27 »
0
edited to add: this is new: techcrunch.com/2022/07/01/wirestock-getty/
So again? Wasn't iStock one of the first partners of Wirestock in the beginning?
I remember it was, but they were dropped pretty soon (think because of the complex keywording system iStock uses, might be wrong here)

Looks like they figured something out. I havent seen any other info yet.

Yeah, they were originally one of the agencies, then not and now?

Dear Peter,

We've got some special news for you!

Wirestock is happy to announce the start of our collaboration with Getty Imagesa huge marketplace you can now sell on.
Please note that we will now be submitting all your content to iStock and Getty Images. If you would not like your portfolio to be submitted to iStock or Getty Images or you already have images that are published there, please let us know by replying to this email before July 12th.

We are happy to have you as a Wirestock creator.

Sincerely yours,
Team Wirestock


Is special anywhere as good as exciting?

Meanwhile, no more ESP no more complicated uploading, I'm putting everything IS in from WS from now on.

And for you, I suppose this will just be automatic added income, if you closed all your "other" and personal accounts?
Yup. I am not on istock but was once upon a time, my files are still on some of their affiliates (looking at you canva!) but I cant be bothered chasing or submitting to them. If ws is going to do it, why not? My stuff is older, and I made my pile from them already. Now I am scraping up whats left for my old stuff. :)


SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #17 on: July 04, 2022, 16:08 »
+2
Quote
Wirestock is a US-based venture-capital business

They're an Armenian-based business... just so you know.

« Reply #18 on: July 04, 2022, 16:33 »
0
I did a test run of 10 images with Wirestock. The keywording was horrible. I will give them a big miss.

« Reply #19 on: July 05, 2022, 06:24 »
+1
Quote
Wirestock is a US-based venture-capital business

They're an Armenian-based business... just so you know.
They run their business from Armenia, but the legal HQ, just a mailbox I assume, is located in San Jose.
Funding by venture capital companies like 2048 Ventures, Vulcan Capital, Angelsdeck or S7V (and others)

« Reply #20 on: July 05, 2022, 08:04 »
+3
To me, the Wirestock concept seemed great, so I started uploading to them.

But soon, long review times started to annoy me, and also that I didn't know if my images were accepted or rejected by the different agencies. There were also some strange rejections by Wirestock. And it could take weeks from an image was accepted by Wirestock, till it showed up at for example Shutterstock.

Then I had five images that I wanted removed again, because they were more artistic than my usual stock photos, and I wanted them to be accociated with my own name. I wrote Wirestock, and they agreed to remove them.
But after the 90 days + 30 days for each 100 items in my portfolio that are stated in "Terms of Use", 3 out of the 5 images were still online.

I wrote Wirestock that they had not lived up to their own "Terms of Use" and that I now wanted to terminate my account, which they agreed to to do.

So, now I just hope that they will live up to the 120 days that they need according to their "Terms of Use" when it comes to termination of an account.

But I have tried Wirestock now, and it's not for me. Guess I prefer to be more in control at each agency.

Uncle Pete

  • Great Place by a Great Lake - My Home Port
« Reply #21 on: July 05, 2022, 10:40 »
+1
Quote
Wirestock is a US-based venture-capital business

They're an Armenian-based business... just so you know.
They run their business from Armenia, but the legal HQ, just a mailbox I assume, is located in San Jose.
Funding by venture capital companies like 2048 Ventures, Vulcan Capital, Angelsdeck or S7V (and others)

Interesting because of the past interview, I thought they were actually where they are. No wonder the TOS say laws of California


But soon, long review times started to annoy me, and also that I didn't know if my images were accepted or rejected by the different agencies. There were also some strange rejections by Wirestock. And it could take weeks from an image was accepted by Wirestock, till it showed up at for example Shutterstock.

I agree

I wrote Wirestock that they had not lived up to their own "Terms of Use" and that I now wanted to terminate my account, which they agreed to to do.

So, now I just hope that they will live up to the 120 days that they need according to their "Terms of Use" when it comes to termination of an account.

Why would they not? Did you read the TOS when you joined?

But I have tried Wirestock now, and it's not for me. Guess I prefer to be more in control at each agency.

True and more control is better sometimes for some people


This is supposed to be a business and all of us need to read the TOS and contracts that we sign, before we join a site. Those Instant Pay files are forever. That's one time, one pay, the people who paid for that, have the rights FOREVER. Be careful what you select for that program, or opt in.

You may request that Wirestock remove Content that you have previously uploaded to Wirestock. You must make this request in writing to the following email address: [email protected]. Once Wirestock receives your request in accordance with this provision, Wirestock shall have 90 days to remove all your Content hosted by content marketplaces so long as you have uploaded to Wirestock no more than 100 items of Content. For each additional 100 items of Content, Wirestock shall have an additional 30 days to remove all your Content. For example, if you have uploaded 350 items of Content to Wirestock, then Wirestock shall have 150 days to remove all your Content.

The same applies to termination.

From the OP: (as long as I'm going on and on)

Quote
Wirestock is a US-based venture-capital business currently having only seed investments. By definition, they were not founded to help contributors, but to increase investors returns. Wirestock cannot change the buyer interaction, as its the job of the agencies themselves. The only revenue leverage they have is via the sellers.

Founded to help contributors? What in this business does that? Of course, they are what you called an ideal name, umbrella distributor, and no they can't change anything, "buyer interaction", but neither can we? What's wrong with someone having investors and running a business, when the end result is to make my work and life easier?

The pay program isn't for me, I'm doing this for easy uploading, and they can have the 15% for better ranking, better commissions and taking care of uploading. I still do my own keywording

"Wirestock does not promise that they will accept to their account all of your uploads" nope and neither does any other agency that we upload to ourselves? So what?

"Wirestock claims you get paid more because their account is in the higher rate level." Do they make that claim, or is that us. No matter, you are still wrong:
https://helpx.adobe.com/stock/contributor/help/royalty-details.html
Adobe has levels.
Lifetime Licenses (free downloads don't count)
Minimum Royalty Amount
0-999 $0.33
1,000-9,999 $0.36
10,000 and above $0.38

Your argument that the gain is minimal would seem to be ignoring that the minimal gain pays back for using WS.

IS no levels, but it will sure save me time.
SS has levels and that darn reset.
DT has levels, 123RF has Levels, I don't know Pond5, Deposit has levels - lifetime, based on downloads, 30% up to 38%. I'd think that the gain there would be much more than if I contribute myself. (2nd level is 5,000 downloads)
Alamy has levels, 20% which becomes 40%.

There is a good amount to be gained that will offset the 15% fee.

I don't know about Wirestock direct, I never had anything. And Extra channels is a mystery?

Risk vs rewards? I think Wirestock is a winner. But like some others I'll upload to AS and SS myself and for some, DT or Alamy, I upload my own, but others go along with WS. All the rest, I don't have account so I wouldn't be uploading to them. I advocate that plan. USe the WS service for places to gain extra income, where someone wouldn't want to spend the time with a personal account or waiting forever to get paid.

OK but after all that, no complications and especially now for IS. Just upload and forget about them. We can't upload the same to the same agencies. Anything rejected we can, so go for it? Be careful about what goes into Extra Channels or Instant Pay! BE CAREFUL.

I think their 85% artist percentage, for the work they do, is just fine. Not like someone slipped in some new fees or a cut, like...  ::)

Biggest benefit for me and why I use WS. I get paid as soon as I meet the payout. I don't have to wait years, or possibly a lifetime, to get a payout from 123RF or a DT sale. All sales are accumulated and we get paid, the month after the total reaches $30.

Let's call this "why you might want to work with Wirestock" ?  :) And why the blog post is biased towards the negative, unfair and ignores or distorts the facts.

Uncle Pete

  • Great Place by a Great Lake - My Home Port
« Reply #22 on: July 05, 2022, 10:54 »
0
Hello

A little rant from me for hearing too much about Wirestock: https://xpiksapp.com/blog/never-use-wirestock/

Let me know what are you thoughts! Do you think this is all wrong and actually WS is a good time investment?

Aside from all that above, I think it's a fair system and a choice that each person needs to decide on their own. Some won't use the service and don't like the way it works, or has worked. Others are in the middle and use parts, mixed with their own. (that's good enough for me) And some other people are all in with Wirestock.

Free Choice.

« Reply #23 on: July 05, 2022, 13:04 »
+2

Aside from all that above, I think it's a fair system and a choice that each person needs to decide on their own. Some won't use the service and don't like the way it works, or has worked. Others are in the middle and use parts, mixed with their own. (that's good enough for me) And some other people are all in with Wirestock.

Free Choice.

Correct. I fully understand the ones who go full in after evaluating the pro's and the cons. They make a well educated decision that suits their situation best.
I also fully understand the ones who avoid services like Wirestock, because, yeah, there are some potential painful disadvantages to it.

It's a free, personal choice, but before making a the decision, read topics like this and decide what's best for you.

I'm more in the middle, and use parts of them, or use them for certain content.
But honestly, the more I use them, the more I'm leaning towards cutting them out of future uploads.

« Reply #24 on: July 06, 2022, 08:45 »
0
https://xpiksapp.com/blog/never-use-wirestock/

in this link, they mentioned that they keep our total earnings for 90 days+ 30 days for each 100 files when we request for content /account deletion.
But where in the TOS mentioned that they keep 100% earnings in that period? They don't motioned that they keep all earnings in that time. They have to pay us our 85% even after we request to delete our files for that period.

« Reply #25 on: July 06, 2022, 13:00 »
+1
The bigget problem with services like WS is if they close down the business. Not that I think they will do - but what are the consequences? Will you still get royalties?

« Reply #26 on: July 06, 2022, 13:20 »
+1
The bigget problem with services like WS is if they close down the business. Not that I think they will do - but what are the consequences? Will you still get royalties?

Good point. For me, too, this is the main reason why I keep my hands off Wirestock.

If Wirestock were to disappear from the market, I assume that the images would happily continue to be sold by the partner agencies.

Money and pictures are then lost.


« Reply #27 on: July 06, 2022, 15:11 »
0
I think that answer to "wirestock yes or no" is really simple.
If you approach microstock photography as a business the answer is absolutely NO
If you think this is a little passive income from your random photography production, in this case YES it could be good service and it's OK to pay for it.
Very simple, no need to calculate too much, it's not all about money and percentage, only about how do you treat your job

farbled

« Reply #28 on: July 06, 2022, 15:16 »
+3
I think that answer to "wirestock yes or no" is really simple.
If you approach microstock photography as a business the answer is absolutely NO
If you think this is a little passive income from your random photography production, in this case YES it could be good service and it's OK to pay for it.
Very simple, no need to calculate too much, it's not all about money and percentage, only about how do you treat your job

And there are those of us that fit into neither category who weigh the pros and cons and decide accordingly. Oh and you don't have to pay for it if you choose not to. :)

« Reply #29 on: July 08, 2022, 18:25 »
+1
I think that answer to "wirestock yes or no" is really simple.
If you approach microstock photography as a business the answer is absolutely NO
If you think this is a little passive income from your random photography production, in this case YES it could be good service and it's OK to pay for it.
Very simple, no need to calculate too much, it's not all about money and percentage, only about how do you treat your job

overly simplistic -- if you're running a business and your concerns are "not all about money and percentage", you're not going to be in business very long!  as a business i choose WS because they save my business time & energy & my net income is higher

« Reply #30 on: July 08, 2022, 21:07 »
+1
Hello

A little rant from me for hearing too much about Wirestock: https://xpiksapp.com/blog/never-use-wirestock/

Let me know what are you thoughts! Do you think this is all wrong and actually WS is a good time investment?

I was there for a little while amd left once I found my images were being given away in a free site just because they didnt sell well. That really sucked.

« Reply #31 on: July 09, 2022, 02:47 »
+1
overly simplistic -- if you're running a business and your concerns are "not all about money and percentage", you're not going to be in business very long!  as a business i choose WS because they save my business time & energy & my net income is higher

I understand your answer and my opinion was of course only my point of view :)

What I would like to underline is that in general, in any business, in middle and long term, you have to be ready to change your mind, to react to external move, to adapt your offer to the market. Giving all to an external agent is big limitation on any future change.
Of course is up to you to define your business but I can't remember a good business story with someone that gives all the business choices to someone else.
I wasn't talking simply about money and percentage, not at all!
This is only my opinion
« Last Edit: July 09, 2022, 02:51 by derby »

« Reply #32 on: July 09, 2022, 04:16 »
0
Hello

A little rant from me for hearing too much about Wirestock: https://xpiksapp.com/blog/never-use-wirestock/

Let me know what are you thoughts! Do you think this is all wrong and actually WS is a good time investment?

I was there for a little while amd left once I found my images were being given away in a free site just because they didnt sell well. That really sucked.

You mean the instant pay program? I cant recall Wirestock giving images away for free other than instant pay, which you can opt out of.

« Reply #33 on: July 09, 2022, 08:31 »
0
Hello

A little rant from me for hearing too much about Wirestock: https://xpiksapp.com/blog/never-use-wirestock/

Let me know what are you thoughts! Do you think this is all wrong and actually WS is a good time investment?

I was there for a little while amd left once I found my images were being given away in a free site just because they didnt sell well. That really sucked.

You mean the instant pay program? I cant recall Wirestock giving images away for free other than instant pay, which you can opt out of.

They don't give away photos that don't sell well, Wirestock sells nothing, doesn't give away anything, and some of the other comments are also nothing but what if, as they go out of business? Facts are they distribute our work and take 15% for doing that. Like it or don't, but that's not why "you should never ever work with Wirestock". [end of quote] [repeat line] Wirestock sells nothing, the agencies, which are the same agencies, are the same as if we upload ourselves. How can anybody blame Wirestock!

Uncle Pete

  • Great Place by a Great Lake - My Home Port
« Reply #34 on: July 09, 2022, 10:49 »
+2
https://xpiksapp.com/blog/never-use-wirestock/

in this link, they mentioned that they keep our total earnings for 90 days+ 30 days for each 100 files when we request for content /account deletion.
But where in the TOS mentioned that they keep 100% earnings in that period? They don't motioned that they keep all earnings in that time. They have to pay us our 85% even after we request to delete our files for that period.

 :o I read the TOS and I just noticed your post. There's some odd version of someone's imagination involved.

"Mind you, of course you are not allowed to sell these files in the meantime! If for whatever reasons you will decide to terminate the service agreement with them, you will be locked out. And they will just get more profits from your files for some time."

1) Yes you can sell these files, who's going to stop you? Or will they close your account?  ;D 2) Being locked out doesn't equal not being paid, and I'd ask people who have closed their accounts, are they "locked out" and did they get all the money due them? The facts would be good to know. But nowhere does WS say, they will keep earnings.

While Taras makes a good point or two that we are paying 15% for this service and he feels that's not a good value, most of the rest is just digging deep for nit picking "maybe" or "What if" conclusions.

Fair enough, feel free to like or not like the terms, we signed those when we joined? Feel free to not join the distribution business of Wirestock, it's a choice. But please be fair in the attacks and criticism and use real information.

Upon termination of your account, either by you or Wirestock, Wirestock shall have 90 days to remove all your Content hosted by content marketplaces so long as you have uploaded to Wirestock no more than 100 items of Content. For each additional 100 items of Content, Wirestock shall have an additional 30 days to remove all your Content. For example, if you have uploaded 350 items of Content to Wirestock, then Wirestock shall have 150 days to remove all your Content.

Kind of strange that they have set a right to take 30 days for each additional items over 100. I don't know why they would want to, unless someone has some really high earning works? Odd wording as well. If I uploaded 1,000 files and close my account, these terms say, 30 days per hundred to remove the rest. That's the first 90 days and then 270 more days, which means someone with 1,000 files, wouldn't be clear of WS for about a year!

Either that or the wording is terrible?  :o I personally think that wording is terrible and the time is unreasonable. But nowhere that I see, do they say your account will be locked and you won't be paid.

https://wirestock.io/docs/terms_of_use


SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #35 on: July 10, 2022, 02:55 »
+3
While I have several issues with sites like these, the majority of them are useful services that are a decent option for some, and not so much for others. While I have used Wirestock and BlackBox, I do prefer to upload my own content directly as I have more control over everything... I'd never advise anybody to never ever work with them. It's not like they're scamming people, not paying out earnings or stealing people's content... they pretty much do what they say on the tin, and what they provide will work for some and not for others depending on their priorities. To be honest, I think it's pretty disgusting that a competitor would write such an article which is full of exaggerations, half-truths and worst case situations.

If I could be bothered, I'd write a why you should never ever work with Xpiks... and I'd be sure to apply the same level of journalistic integrity that you have. But I can't. Maybe one day.

« Reply #36 on: July 10, 2022, 17:38 »
+3
It certainly makes Xpiks look like a lousy company. I would never write anything like this about a direct competitor.

It screams of desperation, they really must be losing a lot of business to wirestock.

The easy solution would have been to offer a keywording and metadata service for the same 15% fee on royalties.

Ot just 12% to have a competitive advantage.

Instead of complaining, just expand the services you offer.


« Reply #37 on: July 12, 2022, 05:31 »
+2
To me a very odd article and seems it was posted only for business reason.

I can just keep the spirit of the article and could say "Why you should only work with Wirestock".

Why spending many hours keywording and uploading when you can do it in simply one click. In a time with many files online and revenues going to 10 cents it is better to save time. Wirestock makes you save time... a huge amount of time. I can use Xpiks for 10 hours to keyword my 300 photos or instead use 1 click.

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #38 on: July 14, 2022, 08:30 »
0
But where in the TOS mentioned that they keep 100% earnings in that period? They don't motioned that they keep all earnings in that time. They have to pay us our 85% even after we request to delete our files for that period.

It's mentioned nowhere that they keep 100%, also not mentioned in my rant. They keep only their share, but the files are essentially locked for you as by ToS you cannot sell them anywhere and effectively you delisted them from Wirestock. Meaning they have the legal right (which you agreed to by registering there) to NOT pay you, because you are deactivating the account.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2022, 09:13 by ribtoks »

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #39 on: July 14, 2022, 08:51 »
0
It certainly makes Xpiks look like a lousy company.

Ha-ha, don't worry. Xpiks did not become a more lousy company than it was after publishing the blogpost. Just I got upset with people falling into the trap (in my opinion).

I would never write anything like this about a direct competitor.

You see, I have opinions and desire to express them. It's up to you how do you perceive them. Also you slighly misunderstand this business: Xpiks and Wirestock offer a completely different value proposition. Wirestock is more of an agency itself and Xpiks is more like Photoshop. These are two different worlds.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2022, 09:25 by ribtoks »

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #40 on: July 14, 2022, 08:53 »
0
Why spending many hours keywording and uploading when you can do it in simply one click.

For the reasons I described in the article. The bottom line is: in my opinion the benefits from their keywording are way less than the risks involved. If you think otherwise, it's fine. Just I think it's worth warning people.

As for the business reason for the article - not really. There are tools out there besides Xpiks, I never force anybody to use anything. But I can raise awareness of the risks involved with Wirestock.

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #41 on: July 14, 2022, 08:56 »
0
If I could be bothered, I'd write a why you should never ever work with Xpiks...

And as truly honestly as I can: I would love to read that article! So please do bother. You can even write about it on this very forum. The reason is I have nothing to hide in Xpiks, no secret fees/hooks/etc. I'm just trying to make a good software that is useful. If you don't like it, I'm very interested to learn why!

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #42 on: July 14, 2022, 08:59 »
0
"Wirestock claims you get paid more because their account is in the higher rate level." Do they make that claim, or is that us. No matter, you are still wrong:
https://helpx.adobe.com/stock/contributor/help/royalty-details.html
Adobe has levels.
Lifetime Licenses (free downloads don't count)
Minimum Royalty Amount
0-999 $0.33
1,000-9,999 $0.36
10,000 and above $0.38

Your argument that the gain is minimal would seem to be ignoring that the minimal gain pays back for using WS.

You are right and I updated the article, mentioning the minimum royalty amount tier. The reason it was not there initially is that the difference between tiers is, in my opinion, totally insignificant (0.33 - 0.36 - 0.38). On imaginary 100 sales per month it will be 100*$0.03 = $3.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2022, 09:39 by ribtoks »

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #43 on: July 14, 2022, 09:15 »
0
1) Yes you can sell these files, who's going to stop you? Or will they close your account?  ;D

Of course not, the microstock where you will upload them will not allow duplicates. Wirestock has nothing to do there. If I was the Wirestock, I would sell these files the maximum allowed time by the ToS and delete them only the last day to increase the revenue. And I bet this is exactly what they are doing, otherwise they would not have the unreasonable "1 month for every 100 files" clause (not to mention that original 3 months clause is unreasonable too).

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #44 on: July 14, 2022, 09:42 »
0
I can use Xpiks for 10 hours to keyword my 300 photos or instead use 1 click.

It's a popular fallacy, exactly what I'm discussing in the blogpost. Of course it's never 1 click with Wirestock and it's never 10 hours with Xpiks (especially with AI keywording, batch editing, presets and what not). The point is that saving some time today with Wirestock puts you in an disproportional risk of wasting way more time later (and potentially loosing also earnings). That is the point I wanted to make in the article.

« Reply #45 on: July 14, 2022, 14:35 »
+1
I can use Xpiks for 10 hours to keyword my 300 photos or instead use 1 click.

It's a popular fallacy, exactly what I'm discussing in the blogpost. Of course it's never 1 click with Wirestock and it's never 10 hours with Xpiks (especially with AI keywording, batch editing, presets and what not). The point is that saving some time today with Wirestock puts you in an disproportional risk of wasting way more time later (and potentially loosing also earnings). That is the point I wanted to make in the article.

Well... everything is a risk... basically if shutterstock and adobe goes down everything goes down since they are the highest earners. We live only 1 time and i want to use now the most i can. I dont think that Wirestock will close any time soon and that they have a bright future. Nothing to worry about.

I used to do all the work myself and also used xpics. It is a great program but the when it comes to workflow and speed there is no comparison with Wirestock. I used to work every evening several hours for submissions. Now it is literally several minutes. For me personally i would be crazy to go back. I prefer to spend those won hours to be with my family.

Uncle Pete

  • Great Place by a Great Lake - My Home Port
« Reply #46 on: July 14, 2022, 21:48 »
+4
1) Yes you can sell these files, who's going to stop you? Or will they close your account?  ;D

Of course not, the microstock where you will upload them will not allow duplicates. Wirestock has nothing to do there. If I was the Wirestock, I would sell these files the maximum allowed time by the ToS and delete them only the last day to increase the revenue. And I bet this is exactly what they are doing, otherwise they would not have the unreasonable "1 month for every 100 files" clause (not to mention that original 3 months clause is unreasonable too).

Lets deal in facts instead of accusing and hypothetical? DO THEY? Or do you think they might? Or is there any evidence of fact behind what you bet?

What's to stop anyone from uploading to the agencies directly, except your supposition that "they" will not allow duplicates. Have you tried? And you still suppose that WS will do something that's unjust, to make more money, by somehow cheating the contributor? Is that true, it has happened, or just a, maybe they could?

Seems like you went on a fishing trip for reasons why WS was a bad deal, and ignored why for some people it's not all that bad. Plus you managed to ignore some of the good reasons, like higher levels, which you claim aren't important. So then the 15% isn't important either? And I say, the 15% is balanced by the higher levels. Hmmm? No loss... maybe?  ;)

But to be fair, I still upload on my own to Adobe and SS, and I don't think WS is the magic answer. But here's where it's a winner for me. Any time I make an accumulated $30 they pay me. That means some agencies that I won't make the $100 required, in the next 5-10 years, I'm getting paid right now.

Some people will like it and some will choose other ways to work. I don't find "Why you should never ever work with Wirestock" to be anything more than a leading title for your biased claims. I am often more unconvinced immediately when someone tries to lead me or starts with negatives, or "Don't you think..." and tries to tell me what I think or should think, just because they do.

Fine with me, that you don't like the program and there are questions and possibly ways that some might have locked their images, beyond the time, they would want to. But no I don't think there's as strong of a statement as why people should never work with WS, because we have a different personal viewpoint than you do.

I'm very happy using WS to upload to sites that I'd never want to have my own account. Pretty simple? I know that I'm paying a 15% fee for that service. I'm getting 85% of money that I'd never have.

And I still do all my own keywording, because I think WS keywording is inadequate, limited and not very good for describing images or attracting sales.

Agencies don't allow duplicates? You're really going to go with that as why WS is holding your images hostage  ;D Or because of all the money they will make, by not releasing your images back to you? Those must be some very special and high demand images.


« Reply #47 on: July 15, 2022, 11:01 »
0
Hello

A little rant from me for hearing too much about Wirestock: https://xpiksapp.com/blog/never-use-wirestock/

Let me know what are you thoughts! Do you think this is all wrong and actually WS is a good time investment?

I was there for a little while amd left once I found my images were being given away in a free site just because they didnt sell well. That really sucked.

You mean the instant pay program? I cant recall Wirestock giving images away for free other than instant pay, which you can opt out of.

They don't give away photos that don't sell well, Wirestock sells nothing, doesn't give away anything, and some of the other comments are also nothing but what if, as they go out of business? Facts are they distribute our work and take 15% for doing that. Like it or don't, but that's not why "you should never ever work with Wirestock". [end of quote] [repeat line] Wirestock sells nothing, the agencies, which are the same agencies, are the same as if we upload ourselves. How can anybody blame Wirestock!

Whatever helps you sleep at night but thats how they do it. Thats what they did to me.

ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #48 on: July 15, 2022, 12:12 »
+1
Lets deal in facts instead of accusing and hypothetical? DO THEY? Or do you think they might? Or is there any evidence of fact behind what you bet?

Uncle Pete, this is called logical deduction from publicly available information. You do not need to hypothesize will you die or not die if Russians will hit you with a bomb, that does not have to happen to you to make some conclusions. Microstocks do not allow duplicates in different accounts. Period. This is written in their terms of service. Wirestock sells your files 1 extra month for each 100 files. Written in the terms of service. This means, in plain English, that you cannot upload your own files under your personal account while you are in the process of closing Wirestock account (if you will) for as long as few years if you have few thousand files. If for you this seems to be far fetched, I'm sorry.

There is no single "imaginary" statement in my blogpost, all the information is based on facts from Wirestock terms and conditions. The only hypothetization is if they will go out of business, but this is clearly mentioned with "IF"s.

To the contrary of what you are saying, I did not forget about benefits, this is in the very very beginning in the section "Value proposition of the Wirestock".
« Last Edit: July 15, 2022, 12:22 by ribtoks »

Uncle Pete

  • Great Place by a Great Lake - My Home Port
« Reply #49 on: July 15, 2022, 13:03 »
0
Lets deal in facts instead of accusing and hypothetical? DO THEY? Or do you think they might? Or is there any evidence of fact behind what you bet?

Uncle Pete, this is called logical deduction from publicly available information. You do not need to hypothesize will you die or not die if Russians will hit you with a bomb, that does not have to happen to you to make some conclusions. Microstocks do not allow duplicates in different accounts. Period. This is written in their terms of service. Wirestock sells your files 1 extra month for each 100 files. Written in the terms of service. This means, in plain English, that you cannot upload your own files under your personal account while you are in the process of closing Wirestock account (if you will) for as long as few years if you have few thousand files. If for you this seems to be far fetched, I'm sorry.

There is no single "imaginary" statement in my blogpost, all the information is based on facts from Wirestock terms and conditions. The only hypothetization is if they will go out of business, but this is clearly mentioned with "IF"s.

To the contrary of what you are saying, I did not forget about benefits, this is in the very very beginning in the section "Value proposition of the Wirestock".

Best wishes for your software and projects. I just think you were a bit biased and heavy handed in the review. Of course I'd agree, you are free to think whatever you think you see in this.  8)



Of course not, the microstock where you will upload them will not allow duplicates. Wirestock has nothing to do there. If I was the Wirestock, I would sell these files the maximum allowed time by the ToS and delete them only the last day to increase the revenue. And I bet this is exactly what they are doing, otherwise they would not have the unreasonable "1 month for every 100 files" clause (not to mention that original 3 months clause is unreasonable too).

I promise you can, I could and many others have, uploaded duplicates and similar to "the microstock" where I upload. And you or I could look and find people who have many duplicate images, listed for Wirestock and also on their own personal accounts.

Also you suppose: That they are actually going to hold all the images they can, to squeeze out every penny, and prevent you from uploading to other places? And that's based on your personal logical deduction, because "otherwise they would not have the unreasonable ...clause" (I don't like that bit of the terms and maybe people who like to join and quit and join and quit, shouldn't like it either, but you are accusing and attributing motivations, based on your own imaginary reasons, not evidence?)

You bet that's what they are doing? Is that a fact or a hypothetical?  ;D

A bomb falling on someone is of course very real. You're right about that.


ribtoks

  • Founder of Xpiks
« Reply #50 on: July 15, 2022, 13:28 »
0
Also you suppose: That they are actually going to hold all the images they can, to squeeze out every penny, and prevent you from uploading to other places? And that's based on your personal logical deduction, because "otherwise they would not have the unreasonable ...clause" (I don't like that bit of the terms and maybe people who like to join and quit and join and quit, shouldn't like it either, but you are accusing and attributing motivations, based on your own imaginary reasons, not evidence?)

You bet that's what they are doing? Is that a fact or a hypothetical?  ;D

This is hypothetical. Just as the point of the article says: this is a legally possible situation and I'm stating that you probably do not want to check on yourself if this will hold true or not. Because if it will, you will be in trouble.

I agree with your statement that the tone of the article could be classified as a bit too strong, and I'm truly sorry if somebody's feelings were hurt in a way.

Uncle Pete

  • Great Place by a Great Lake - My Home Port
« Reply #51 on: July 15, 2022, 13:42 »
+1
Also you suppose: That they are actually going to hold all the images they can, to squeeze out every penny, and prevent you from uploading to other places? And that's based on your personal logical deduction, because "otherwise they would not have the unreasonable ...clause" (I don't like that bit of the terms and maybe people who like to join and quit and join and quit, shouldn't like it either, but you are accusing and attributing motivations, based on your own imaginary reasons, not evidence?)

You bet that's what they are doing? Is that a fact or a hypothetical?  ;D

This is hypothetical. Just as the point of the article says: this is a legally possible situation and I'm stating that you probably do not want to check on yourself if this will hold true or not. Because if it will, you will be in trouble.

I agree with your statement that the tone of the article could be classified as a bit too strong, and I'm truly sorry if somebody's feelings were hurt in a way.

My feelings sure aren't hurt.  :)

I was just saying you used conjecture and hypothetical to make accusing claims and I didn't think that was fair or valid. And now you're asking if this will hold true. I'm not the one making the claims or attacking them. And I'm not going to defend a bad TOS that allows WS to hold images for months and months. I'm just saying, some assumptions are not based on facts, but personal opinions or what could happen or what might happen, and that's the bases of "Why you should never ever work with Wirestock"

I would have called it, Why I think people should take a close look at Wirestock and their terms ?

Some would say no, some have said YES, and I'm personally using the service to spread images to agencies that I'd never want to have an with, but I work the places I care about, on my own. We all have personal views, options and choices.

Yeah, what if they go out of business? Yup, what if an airplane should fall on my house...  ;)


 

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