The only place for fashion on this forum is for fashion victims... 

Double post

I didn't say that I didn't vote for her.  I voted for her because I thought that she was very good and have seen other images of her in the SS forums, I just found it a bit offensive on her behalf that her deafness was being used like this.
I have a deaf friend who is also very upfront about her deafness and she also thought that this was a very tacky way of getting votes. I have seen and admire your work and think that you were probably just misguided in the way you went about this probably with all the best intentions in the world but it didn't come across like that.

Quote from: fotografer on July 05, 2008, 08:17

Quote from: photoshow on July 05, 2008, 00:01

Quote from: fotografer on July 04, 2008, 20:23
I'm afraid that is how it came across to me as well.  Using somebody Else's deafness to promote himself.  I hope that I'm wrong but that's the way it sounds.

Quote from: fotoKmyst on July 04, 2008, 19:33

Quote from: rjmiz on July 04, 2008, 16:31
You ought to ashamed at pimping your images.

Cranky MIZ
The voice of reason

from one who knows and works with deaf people,
i think this has less to do with stacey, than it is to do with bobby "pimping
his image" as MIZ puts it.

Oh Jeez this is ridiculous never mind she can win this without your help.  I have posted this in several communities and THIS is the only one to react with such vicious stupidity, what a bunch of children. This is really reading like a bunch of Jealously to me. I expect this kind of response from a personality like Miz but the rest of you should know better.

If I wanted to promote myself I would Promote myself with my work not with somebody Else's disability. When I promote ME I use MY Work as MY WORK SPEAKS FOR ITS SELF

You say she is good to work with and deaf that is why we should vote, if there is a better picture of a model that is not deaf and is a nightmare to work with why should we not vote for her?

If this model is so good then this thread should not be needed, and the fact that you are promoting her against other photographers models that may have just uploaded thier entry, compromises the whole concept of a competition.

You should upload and lets things take a natural course, not "pimp" your contribution over many forums and distort a fair and level playing field, all votes from members that registered after you print was uploaded should be voided.

The pimping does more damage than good to these competitions and the models, if she is "The One" then the image sould win on it's own merit, now if she finishes higher than the image merits then you may have given her the impression that she is better than she really is, I don't find the image special, and would not vote because you asked, this pimping is also the reason I do not bother with online competitions where people vote, these are meaningless when the winning image is not the best but the most pimped.

If she does well reflect on this "she will never know if she really did well, because the "pimped" photographers on shutterstock distorted the vote"

David    

Quote from: cdwheatley on July 05, 2008, 00:28
It just looks like classic "The boy who cried wolf"

If you pimp, people assume that you are pimping regardless of what your real intentions are.

No offense meant. Best of luck to your model.

Sorry but I don't come here and pimp my images

Quote from: Bateleur on July 05, 2008, 07:15

Quote from: photoshow on July 05, 2008, 00:01

Oh Jeez this is ridiculous never mind she can win this without your help.  I have posted this in several communities and THIS is the only one to react with such vicious stupidity, what a bunch of children.

No. Not children. People here are a bit more critical.

That's why this is such a valuable forum. You don't get the vomit-inducing, sycophantic "Hey! Wow! That's sooooooooo coooooooool!!!!!!!!!!!!!" reactions that you tend to get on other photographic forums (fora?)

Let's face it ... in your first post you highlighted the fact that she was deaf by using capital letters amongst other things. In other words, you were invoking a sympathy vote.

I am sorry that she is deaf. It's a serious handicap. But, let's face it, that has no relevance to the quality of the image.

And people on this forum spotted that.

I beg to differ with you. This is the third deaf model I have worked with and the first two were almost impossible to work with. If you can't communicate with a model it is unlikely you will be bookh makes it all the more amazing in myng models I have ever worked with whic able to produce a quality image. This model however communicates better then most fully heari

Quote from: Adeptris on July 05, 2008, 08:29
You say she is good to work with and deaf that is why we should vote, if there is a better picture of a model that is not deaf and is a nightmare to work with why should we not vote for her?

If this model is so good then this thread should not be needed, and the fact that you are promoting her against other photographers models that may have just uploaded thier entry, compromises the whole concept of a competition.

You should upload and lets things take a natural course, not "pimp" your contribution over many forums and distort a fair and level playing field, all votes from members that registered after you print was uploaded should be voided.

The pimping does more damage than good to these competitions and the models, if she is "The One" then the image sould win on it's own merit, now if she finishes higher than the image merits then you may have given her the impression that she is better than she really is, I don't find the image special, and would not vote because you asked, this pimping is also the reason I do not bother with online competitions where people vote, these are meaningless when the winning image is not the best but the most pimped.

If she does well reflect on this "she will never know if she really did well, because the "pimped" photographers on shutterstock distorted the vote"

David    

David these Cover Model Contests are just that they are contests and in the days of huge Myspace friensts lists and such they become popularity contests. If I and her and everyone else she and we know don't promote her entery she has no chance because the natural order has to compete with Myspace.

And for those who oppose the fact that I mentioned that she was deaf I assure you she won't have a problem with it nor will she have a problem playing the deaf card anywhere else if it will help her to overcome the hurdels that being deaf place in her life everyday and help her attain her goals

and if there is a better photo and better model then I agree it and she should win instead. All I am asking is that people look and make up their own minds

Quote from: photoshow on July 05, 2008, 08:51

Quote from: Bateleur on July 05, 2008, 07:15

Quote from: photoshow on July 05, 2008, 00:01

Oh Jeez this is ridiculous never mind she can win this without your help.  I have posted this in several communities and THIS is the only one to react with such vicious stupidity, what a bunch of children.

I am sorry that she is deaf. It's a serious handicap. But, let's face it, that has no relevance to the quality of the image.

I beg to differ with you. This is the third deaf model I have worked with and the first two were almost impossible to work with. If you can't communicate with a model it is unlikely you will be bookh makes it all the more amazing in myng models I have ever worked with whic able to produce a quality image. This model however communicates better then most fully heari

Sorry, I don't understand the last bit of that comment.

But as for the second sentence:

This is the third deaf model I have worked with and the first two were almost impossible to work with.

That just confirms that deafness has no connection with modelling ability.

So why did you highlight it so markedly in your first post if it wasn't to invoke the sympathy vote?

Who . are you to challenge my integrity?

The answer to your question is simple.

To Applaud her achievement.

The fact that the first two deaf woman that I tried to work with as models were unable to effectively model due to the communication issues that arose from them being deaf does to me indicate that it does have a bearing on modeling. The fact that Stacey has found a way to overcome the communication issues and be an effective model despite being deaf is worthy of applause.

So I am done defending it to you, I applaud this woman as a model, with or without disability she is simply one of the best models that I have ever worked with. The fact that she is challenged makes it even more amazing in my eyes so vote or don't vote I could care less.

Quote from: photoshow on July 05, 2008, 18:02

Who . are you to challenge my integrity?

The answer to your question is simple.

To Applaud her achievement.

I'm me.

And I wasn't challenging your integrity. Simply asking a question.

I, too, suffer from a hearing disability. But it has no bearing on my photography, writing, or public speaking (all of which I do).

Furthermore, I wouldn't want it announced as a preface to a presentation of any of my work ... not because I'm in any way shy about it, but simply because it's not relevant.

OK well that explains it a bit I suppose but unlike you, Stacey's hearing loss does effect her ability to verbally communicate. While your hearing loss might not effect your photography imagine for a moment what it would be like to be on the other end of the lens and not be able to verbally communicate to only read lips partially and be working as a model with a photographer who does not know sign.

As a photographer I have to able to communicate what I want from my model in order to achieve the poses from the model that bring the high fashion look to life. This is often difficult at best to accomplish with a model who has no hearing loss let alone with one with total hearing loss.

As a result of this models astonishing work ethic she has found was to overcome these communication hurdles and be an effective model that can be directed when in the studio. She actually reads very subtle body language and has an innate intuition as to what I want from her based on the simplest of gestures. This actually makes her easier to work with then many models I have worked with who could could hear me and still not understand typical direction. The previous models I have worked with who were hearing impaired I was unable to direct at all.

So again I will say I was NOT LOOKING FOR SYMPATHY for Stacey but was in fact APPLAUDING her achievement. If my applause of her somehow offended you I am sorry. She is not being taken advantage of here, she is not being abused, she is not in need of a defender and there is NOTHING in it for me if she wins the contest. All prizes go to the model, the photographer of the submitted image is not even credited. If she wins her actual cover would be created by a staff photographer for 944 magazine.

Personally I believe she deserves the recognition for having the strength, talent and fortitude it has taken for her to rise above the challenge in front of her. You can be sure I have noting but absolute respect and admiration for this girl.

photoshow

It's time to grow up and move on. I counted 11 posts of yours to this thread attempting to justify your modis operandi. 
That's totally uncalled for and unnecessary. There is no need to explain to anyone here in this forum what your intentions were
or what indeed your motive were.

If you are an artist thats enough. Everyone realizes that.
So STOP defending yourself, pick yourself up and move on!....everyone can go screw themselves

Geeeezzz

Cranky MIZ
The voice of reason

Miz mind your own * business. If I want your opinion I will fish it out of the toilet you have absolutely no credibility to me.

This is so ridiculous, what a bunch of sour grapes. 

This cover contest is not about Bobby as the photographer. It's about Stacy as the model.  SHE entered the contest and he is trying to promote HER.  Some of you speak for her as if you know her, I DO  know her well,  and I know that Stacey herself is pimping . out of this image as well.  All over her myspace, her email, friends and family and her website.  The Make-up Artist is promoting her in all the same avenues, as am I!!  When . did it become wrong to promote your artwork anyway?

Thats what these model search contests are all about.  Popularity Contests, If a magazine sees that a girl can drum up that much interest then they see that she will sell magazines.
If any of you disagree with that then you are misinformed. 

Also, if you don't think that Stacey herself will use her disability to drum up interest for her modeling career then your kidding your self.  She has true passion, she'll use whatever she can to get there (I know this from actual conversations w/ her)

Rjmiz, it's always Funny how you jump on the boat to attack anyone that is more successful than you.   

  I'm sure there will be a bunch more of you that will be calling Bobby out, thats how it is over here.  One person jumps on the bandwagon then the rest of the haters come in.   Luckily there are a ton of us out here that know his true character.  From all of his employees (and their families)  His Family, Stacy, the DEAF (omg!!) model that we have spent countless hours photographing & promoting. And many,many of our peers here on these forums.   

B.

Quote from: rjmiz on July 04, 2008, 16:31
You ought to ashamed at pimping your images.

Cranky MIZ
The voice of reason

You should be ashamed of pimping yourself.

Look at me!!!
I'm the new president of the 4000$ club!!!
Join my lame-ass forum, where I only talk about myself!!
Look how many people have me as their favorite!!!
Watch this crappy tutorial that I found in PS for Dummies!!
Look at me! look at me! look at me!

Get over yourself.

Quote from: photoshow on July 05, 2008, 19:54
Miz mind your own  business. If I want your opinion I will fish it out of the toilet you have absolutely no credibility to me.

Amen to that.  What a freaking idiot.

Tempers are flaring - step away, people.
This thread needs to be locked.

Quote from: Beckyabell on July 05, 2008, 20:52
I'm the new president of the 4000$ club!!!

It's the $5000 club Beckyabell....not the $4000

Cranky MIZ
The voice of reason

Robert the only think that is not called for here is for you to come into my thread and try to tell me what I can and can not or should or should not do.

Is this the thread to pimp my blog post about wedding photographers being nice and stock photographers in general being snippy little bizznitches? 



This thread is simple - vote for the model, or don't.  But if you read a thread called "Please vote for my model" don't come thinking that maybe it was about "tips on improving" or something - it's to solicit votes FOR A MODEL. 

(So she's deaf.  It happens.  I get the occasional deaf model because we live to close to NTID - some suck, some are great... the pic was worth voting for, so I did)

So miz, how about a tutorial detailing how to get banned from stock agencies and forums?

my goodness MIZ the worms are crawling out of your woodwork

that's ok, this is pimping, no matter how many supporters come to his rescue. look at how many visitors came but did not vote.
that must say something doesn't it?

Quote from: PaulieWalnuts on July 06, 2008, 03:36
So miz, how about a tutorial detailing how to get banned from stock agencies and forums?

He should write a book on that

Quote from: photoshow on July 06, 2008, 03:40

Quote from: PaulieWalnuts on July 06, 2008, 03:36
So miz, how about a tutorial detailing how to get banned from stock agencies and forums?

He should write a book on that

somehow i don't think MIZ an expert on pimping

 Out of curiosity I went and looked at the rest of the contestants. There is page after page of them....some pretty nice ones and some not so nice ones.... and some pretty sleazy looking ones. Turns out you can vote for more then one model. Reason I decided not to vote for Stacey is I don't like the photo with the 944 logo right over her face. Couldn't you have given her a photo with more copyspace at the top? The vast majority of them have the 944 logo plastered over there face so all those are bad photos to me .  Her being deaf plays no part into that decision for me. How hard of a worker she is or how good she is to work with also plays no role in it to me. If its a true model contest and not just a popularity contest then the decision on who to vote for should be based on how good the model and the photo looks.

If its just a popularity contest then its really just that and has no real meaning.

Take a look at Kyle Lardner,  shes on the first page along with Stacey. Beautiful model with a fantastic photo that shows her face without the 944 across it. She got my vote.