Author Topic: GraphicStock.com? (Read 47804 times)

luissantos84 · « **Reply #50 on:** October 23, 2013, 19:00 »

sure but would we be any better without subs? impossible to know and nothing we can do at this moment beside adapting or quit

there is still one difference between 38 cents and 2 cents, pretty much I wouldn't join the party, anyway I don't think that any agency will pull that one

actually I have been working on a ton of pictures for nothing but it's all part of the process (I hope)

Grafix04 · « **Reply #51 on:** October 25, 2013, 07:06 »

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 23, 2013, 19:00

there is still one difference between 38 cents and 2 cents, pretty much I wouldn't join the party, anyway I don't think that any agency will pull that one

But they already have at this agency. Take fritz' offer of $2.14 per image for a lifetime's worth of unlimited subs downloads that includes EL usage. If they download one image of his 100 times, it's worth $0.02 per download, paid upfront. Shocking deal.

luissantos84 · « **Reply #52 on:** October 25, 2013, 07:28 »

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 25, 2013, 07:06

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 23, 2013, 19:00
there is still one difference between 38 cents and 2 cents, pretty much I wouldn't join the party, anyway I don't think that any agency will pull that one

But they already have at this agency. Take fritz' offer of $2.14 per image for a lifetime's worth of unlimited subs downloads that includes EL usage. If they download one image of his 100 times, it's worth $0.02 per download, paid upfront. Shocking deal.

let's focus here, what do they have to gain giving them away for 2 cents or less? don't you think they are looking after profit? if they paid 15k I don't think they are wanting to make 2 cents in the next years, they would need 750k downloads just to cover the investment, we don't know their strategy so its pretty hard to know if it is that shocking or not

luissantos84 · « **Reply #53 on:** October 25, 2013, 07:34 »

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 16, 2013, 20:50

One thing that concerns me the most is that the images are owned by Footage Firm. If GraphicStock shuts its doors then Footage Firm is still free to do whatever they like with your images - forever.

The other deal breaker is that their RF licensing agreement allows EL licensing terms in their subscription plan. Sure you can make a quick one time stash of $15K but how will that affect your your other income? If this takes on, buyers are likely to ditch the other micros and buy into a cheep unlimited subs plan instead which will hurt your other income. You'll not only be selling yourself short but possibly selling yourself out - for $2.14 per image.

Unlimited ELs for $69 a month. It's a great deal for buyers but far too risky for contributors.

you talk about buyers like you can open a magazine or newspaper and pick them, it's not that simple, do you really believe that GS will ever take SS clients away? not going to happen! you can sell pictures at one place for 10 cents and other for 10$, they won't even notice and won't leave and go to another stock agency that quick, if it was that easy they would be buying everything at fair agencies and obviously symbio

Grafix04 · « **Reply #54 on:** October 26, 2013, 00:19 »

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 25, 2013, 07:28

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 25, 2013, 07:06
Quote from: luissantos84 on October 23, 2013, 19:00
there is still one difference between 38 cents and 2 cents, pretty much I wouldn't join the party, anyway I don't think that any agency will pull that one

But they already have at this agency. Take fritz' offer of $2.14 per image for a lifetime's worth of unlimited subs downloads that includes EL usage. If they download one image of his 100 times, it's worth $0.02 per download, paid upfront. Shocking deal.

let's focus here, what do they have to gain giving them away for 2 cents or less? don't you think they are looking after profit? if they paid 15k I don't think they are wanting to make 2 cents in the next years, they would need 750k downloads just to cover the investment, we don't know their strategy so its pretty hard to know if it is that shocking or not

Lol, I think it's you that's lost focus here, Luis. The "difference between 38 cents and 2 cents" doesn't refer to what Shutterstock gives the images away for. It's what we give them away for – our sub commissions. Likewise, I wasn't saying that GraphicStock will give them away for 2 cents. I meant that fritz has effectively given them away for possible even less than that. If he has sold rights for $2.14 per image, after just 100 downloads, that's only 2 cents per download. Over a lifetime as downloads increase, the earnings per image will be less and less.

Grafix04 · « **Reply #55 on:** October 26, 2013, 00:33 »

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 25, 2013, 07:34

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 16, 2013, 20:50
One thing that concerns me the most is that the images are owned by Footage Firm. If GraphicStock shuts its doors then Footage Firm is still free to do whatever they like with your images - forever.

The other deal breaker is that their RF licensing agreement allows EL licensing terms in their subscription plan. Sure you can make a quick one time stash of $15K but how will that affect your your other income? If this takes on, buyers are likely to ditch the other micros and buy into a cheep unlimited subs plan instead which will hurt your other income. You'll not only be selling yourself short but possibly selling yourself out - for $2.14 per image.

Unlimited ELs for $69 a month. It's a great deal for buyers but far too risky for contributors.

you talk about buyers like you can open a magazine or newspaper and pick them, it's not that simple, do you really believe that GS will ever take SS clients away? not going to happen! you can sell pictures at one place for 10 cents and other for 10$, they won't even notice and won't leave and go to another stock agency that quick, if it was that easy they would be buying everything at fair agencies and obviously symbio

You believe that unlimited subs for $69 that includes EL usage isn't going to take off? How much does one EL cost? $50? $100?

Yes, if things remain constant, I believe buyers will run off from SS to GS. Why wouldn't they? Unlimited ELs for $69 per month versus one single EL for $100 or whatever the average price is these days. Once buyers get word of such a generous deal and start migrating over in decent numbers, how do you think SS and the other big players will respond? In the end all subs will be sold with unlimited downloads for a period of time and will include EL usage. Microstock, from the serious contributors' point of view has been dying a slow death for some time now but I believe this will finish it off. I've been slowly leaving all the micros but I still keep an eye on the market just to see it all unfold and to count my lucky stars that I've left before all my images are given away for less than peanuts. I've got a couple of small ones left that I'll drop when I get around to it.

It's a real shame what's happened to this industry but I'm afraid it was inevitable.

Grafix04 · « **Reply #56 on:** October 26, 2013, 00:42 »

Most people aren't thinking clearly here - they're too distracted by the $15,000 dollars.

If you think logically this is far worse than the Getty/Google deal. Fritz sold the rights to 7000 for $15K, netting him $2.14 per image. The Google deal netted effected contributors $14 per image and everyone went apesh!t.

cthoman · « **Reply #57 on:** October 26, 2013, 00:58 »

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 26, 2013, 00:42

Most people aren't thinking clearly here - they're too distracted by the $15,000 dollars.

If you think logically this is far worse than the Getty/Google deal. Fritz sold the rights to 7000 for $15K, netting him $2.14 per image. The Google deal netted effected contributors $14 per image and everyone went apesh!t.

I think the Google deal is still worse because it wasn't by choice.

Ron · « **Reply #58 on:** October 26, 2013, 01:20 »

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 26, 2013, 00:19

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 25, 2013, 07:28
Quote from: Grafix04 on October 25, 2013, 07:06
Quote from: luissantos84 on October 23, 2013, 19:00
there is still one difference between 38 cents and 2 cents, pretty much I wouldn't join the party, anyway I don't think that any agency will pull that one

But they already have at this agency. Take fritz' offer of $2.14 per image for a lifetime's worth of unlimited subs downloads that includes EL usage. If they download one image of his 100 times, it's worth $0.02 per download, paid upfront. Shocking deal.

let's focus here, what do they have to gain giving them away for 2 cents or less? don't you think they are looking after profit? if they paid 15k I don't think they are wanting to make 2 cents in the next years, they would need 750k downloads just to cover the investment, we don't know their strategy so its pretty hard to know if it is that shocking or not

Lol, I think it's you that's lost focus here, Luis. The "difference between 38 cents and 2 cents" doesn't refer to what Shutterstock gives the images away for. It's what we give them away for – our sub commissions. Likewise, I wasn't saying that GraphicStock will give them away for 2 cents. I meant that fritz has effectively given them away for possible even less than that. If he has sold rights for $2.14 per image, after just 100 downloads, that's only 2 cents per download. Over a lifetime as downloads increase, the earnings per image will be less and less.

You re assuming every image gets 1000 dls. Could be that 30% of his 7000 never sales. And only few hit 100 dls or more. 30% unsold images is realistic.

Grafix04 · « **Reply #59 on:** October 26, 2013, 01:52 »

Quote from: cthoman on October 26, 2013, 00:58

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 26, 2013, 00:42
Most people aren't thinking clearly here - they're too distracted by the $15,000 dollars.

If you think logically this is far worse than the Getty/Google deal. Fritz sold the rights to 7000 for $15K, netting him $2.14 per image. The Google deal netted effected contributors $14 per image and everyone went apesh!t.

I think the Google deal is still worse because it wasn't by choice.

Perhaps to the individuals who were directly involved, yes. However, think back how outraged people were in general. Even if they weren't directly effected, they were concerned about the potential damage it could do to the industry. The ones that were involved only had a few images being given away for free - forever - for $14 an image. Now we have contributors lining up in numbers asking for an offer and selling out for $2.14 voluntarily. The potential damage to the industry is likely to be far greater and far quicker.

Grafix04 · « **Reply #60 on:** October 26, 2013, 02:04 »

Quote from: Ron on October 26, 2013, 01:20

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 26, 2013, 00:19
Quote from: luissantos84 on October 25, 2013, 07:28
Quote from: Grafix04 on October 25, 2013, 07:06
Quote from: luissantos84 on October 23, 2013, 19:00
there is still one difference between 38 cents and 2 cents, pretty much I wouldn't join the party, anyway I don't think that any agency will pull that one

But they already have at this agency. Take fritz' offer of $2.14 per image for a lifetime's worth of unlimited subs downloads that includes EL usage. If they download one image of his 100 times, it's worth $0.02 per download, paid upfront. Shocking deal.

let's focus here, what do they have to gain giving them away for 2 cents or less? don't you think they are looking after profit? if they paid 15k I don't think they are wanting to make 2 cents in the next years, they would need 750k downloads just to cover the investment, we don't know their strategy so its pretty hard to know if it is that shocking or not

Lol, I think it's you that's lost focus here, Luis. The "difference between 38 cents and 2 cents" doesn't refer to what Shutterstock gives the images away for. It's what we give them away for – our sub commissions. Likewise, I wasn't saying that GraphicStock will give them away for 2 cents. I meant that fritz has effectively given them away for possible even less than that. If he has sold rights for $2.14 per image, after just 100 downloads, that's only 2 cents per download. Over a lifetime as downloads increase, the earnings per image will be less and less.
You re assuming every image gets 1000 dls. Could be that 30% of his 7000 never sales. And only few hit 100 dls or more. 30% unsold images is realistic.

Ron, I'm not assuming anything. There may be images that never sell and there may be images that sell in huge numbers over the course of a lifetime... or rather, forever. Think about it... it will only take GS to get about 1500 contributors like Fritz to reach a database of 10 million images. What happens if buyers start moving over to GS and they pick up speed? What if a threatened Shuttershock or a threatened iStock buy out GS's parent company? Now you can't even sell your own images yourself because they have the right to distribute them without giving you a cent. Any way you look at it, it's bad news.

sharpshot · « **Reply #61 on:** October 26, 2013, 03:01 »

There does seem to be a risk of killing the goose that lays the golden egg. The egg might not be that golden anymore but I still don't want that goose to die

Unfortunately, there's always going to be people that are overly influenced by a lump of cash. Hopefully this site will go nowhere. It doesn't look attractive to buyers at the moment, I hope it stays that way.

luissantos84 · « **Reply #62 on:** October 26, 2013, 07:45 »

he haven't sold the pictures rights but DISTRIBUTION rights

luissantos84 · « **Reply #63 on:** October 26, 2013, 07:50 »

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 26, 2013, 00:33

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 25, 2013, 07:34
Quote from: Grafix04 on October 16, 2013, 20:50
One thing that concerns me the most is that the images are owned by Footage Firm. If GraphicStock shuts its doors then Footage Firm is still free to do whatever they like with your images - forever.

The other deal breaker is that their RF licensing agreement allows EL licensing terms in their subscription plan. Sure you can make a quick one time stash of $15K but how will that affect your your other income? If this takes on, buyers are likely to ditch the other micros and buy into a cheep unlimited subs plan instead which will hurt your other income. You'll not only be selling yourself short but possibly selling yourself out - for $2.14 per image.

Unlimited ELs for $69 a month. It's a great deal for buyers but far too risky for contributors.

you talk about buyers like you can open a magazine or newspaper and pick them, it's not that simple, do you really believe that GS will ever take SS clients away? not going to happen! you can sell pictures at one place for 10 cents and other for 10$, they won't even notice and won't leave and go to another stock agency that quick, if it was that easy they would be buying everything at fair agencies and obviously symbio

You believe that unlimited subs for $69 that includes EL usage isn't going to take off? How much does one EL cost? $50? $100?

Yes, if things remain constant, I believe buyers will run off from SS to GS. Why wouldn't they? Unlimited ELs for $69 per month versus one single EL for $100 or whatever the average price is these days. Once buyers get word of such a generous deal and start migrating over in decent numbers, how do you think SS and the other big players will respond? In the end all subs will be sold with unlimited downloads for a period of time and will include EL usage. Microstock, from the serious contributors' point of view has been dying a slow death for some time now but I believe this will finish it off. I've been slowly leaving all the micros but I still keep an eye on the market just to see it all unfold and to count my lucky stars that I've left before all my images are given away for less than peanuts. I've got a couple of small ones left that I'll drop when I get around to it.

It's a real shame what's happened to this industry but I'm afraid it was inevitable.

they won't, buyers don't seem to care about our royalties or even the price they pay for a picture, I sold yesterday at Alamy a picture for 10$ (0.2MP) when it can be purchased for less than 1$ somewhere else

iStock used to have the highest pricing and that haven't put buyers away, they sold quite well during many years for a big number of contributors, some still do

you are thinking way too much like we always do but its not the reality, buyers don't just leave because other agency has cheaper prices, there are a ton more variables

Grafix04 · « **Reply #64 on:** October 26, 2013, 08:25 »

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 26, 2013, 07:45

he haven't sold the pictures rights but DISTRIBUTION rights

Lol, same thing really. Currently you have full rights to your images meaning you may distribute them or sell the rights. After you share the right to distribute your images with GS, that's all you have the right to do too. If you give them distribution rights, you won't even be able to sell the rights to your images anymore because GS will be distributing your images forever.

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 26, 2013, 07:50

they won't, buyers don't seem to care about our royalties or even the price they pay for a picture, I sold yesterday at Alamy a picture for 10$ (0.2MP) when it can be purchased for less than 1$ somewhere else

iStock used to have the highest pricing and that haven't put buyers away, they sold quite well during many years for a big number of contributors, some still do

you are thinking way too much like we always do but its not the reality, buyers don't just leave because other agency has cheaper prices, there are a ton more variables

No disrespect buddy, but that is possibly the most ludicrous thing I've ever heard from a photographer who sells at micro prices. If buyer's didn't care about prices, they would have continued buying macro from Jupitor /Getty and Corbis. Even the shift to micro wasn't satisfying enough for them and four years later most shifted from iStock to Shutterstock, lured by the subs deal. Buyers clearly care about price and they will not pass on an opportunity to download unlimited ELs for just $69 a month. Hell, I don't even think I can pass on that opportunity. You sell your soul to the devil, Luis and I'll sit there for a month and download every one of your images (and others) for a bargain price of $69 and then I'll upload them onto every product available on cafe press – which is allowed. How do you feel about that?

luissantos84 · « **Reply #65 on:** October 26, 2013, 08:31 »

I will ask just 1 thing, are you at Cafepress?

Grafix04 · « **Reply #66 on:** October 26, 2013, 08:33 »

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 26, 2013, 08:31

I will ask just 1 thing, are you at Cafepress?

Not yet

luissantos84 · « **Reply #67 on:** October 26, 2013, 08:36 »

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 26, 2013, 08:33

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 26, 2013, 08:31
I will ask just 1 thing, are you at Cafepress?

Not yet

like I expected, you are just full of talk, cafepress doesn't mean anything, in the long run you might be right but we will be here to see if GS will go anywhere, how many very cheap agencies we know that are doing well? yep big fat zero!

Grafix04 · « **Reply #68 on:** October 26, 2013, 08:47 »

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 26, 2013, 08:36

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 26, 2013, 08:33
Quote from: luissantos84 on October 26, 2013, 08:31
I will ask just 1 thing, are you at Cafepress?

Not yet

like I expected, you are just full of talk, cafepress doesn't mean anything, in the long run you might be right but we will be here to see if GS will go anywhere, how many very cheap agencies we know that are doing well? yep big fat zero!

No. I'm not full of talk. I'm seriously considering it. I won't put my images on CP but I'll happily put yours and anyone else's. Your flags will probably do okay as prints. I'll also sell on Fineartamerica.

Why do you believe I'm all talk? I've already left micro and have some time to fill doing other things. For just $69 a month I could download a heap of images and we've already been given the green light to sell on POD. The only thing I'm waiting for is for more suckers like Fritz to sell out so that I'll have a better collection to choose from. I don't believe it will be long. Although $15K is not even close to a year's income, there'll be a heap of you willing to part with DISTRIBUTION rights.

luissantos84 · « **Reply #69 on:** October 26, 2013, 09:09 »

not that you deserve after calling "sucker" to a member of this community who was brave enough to say he accepted the deal, how many have and shut their mouth? same goes with uploading to IS, we all love to talk but we take ZERO action

I can tell you that CP sucks, I have over 400 designs there since August and made 10$ so go ahead and try it yourself, no IPTC import and 1 file at a time

fritz · « **Reply #70 on:** October 26, 2013, 09:19 »

The only thing I'm waiting for is for more suckers like Fritz to sell out so that I'll have a better collection to choose from.
[/quote]

Leaf,

I didn't join MSG to someone insult me simply because I have a different opinion than others.
Lets be civilized, otherwise I'm off.

Best,

"Sucker" Fritz

Grafix04 · « **Reply #71 on:** October 26, 2013, 10:30 »

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 26, 2013, 09:09

not that you deserve after calling "sucker" to a member of this community who was brave enough to say he accepted the deal, how many have and shut their mouth? same goes with uploading to IS, we all love to talk but we take ZERO action

I can tell you that CP sucks, I have over 400 designs there since August and made 10$ so go ahead and try it yourself, no IPTC import and 1 file at a time

Lol $10? Well I won't be asking you for any tips. I know a few who make a decent living from various PODs so you must be doing something wrong.

Yep "Suckers". Call it what you want but they are technically getting sucked into the deal are they not? I don't have a problem with it anymore. I want more people to hand over their 'distribution' rights since microstock is basically finished for me anyway.

If anyone's offended over being called a sucker for getting sucked into a deal that has probably ended their future in microstock and has been the final nail in the coffin of my future in microstock, it's their problem. They can get over it as I have.

If anyone should be insulted it should be me... and the rest of contributors still trying to earn a living from micro.

luissantos84 · « **Reply #72 on:** October 26, 2013, 11:25 »

the wrong thing I am doing is wasting my time with a troll like you

if it is finished for you why all the fuss? just leave us here doing dumb decisions because you are somewhere else doing a ton better sucker

Grafix04 · « **Reply #73 on:** October 26, 2013, 11:36 »

Quote from: luissantos84 on October 26, 2013, 11:25

the wrong thing I am doing is wasting my time with a troll like you

if it is finished for you why all the fuss? just leave us here doing dumb decisions because you are somewhere else doing a ton better sucker

LOL, I'm trolling and you're wasting your time with me? I didn't invite you to quote and respond to me, you did that and I responded to you. Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they're trolling.

I'm finished with microstock agencies since they insist on screwing us over. On top of them screws ing us over, now we have other contributors doing it to us and I'm supposed to be apologizing for feeling bitter about it? Well I got over it and found a positive from them screwing me over. If they're willing to dip into my earnings, I'll return the favor - gladly.

And I'm not finished selling RM and RF directly, just micro agents.

I've been around long enough to know you're posts aren't anything to write home about so please, feel free so stop wasting your time replying to my posts - that weren't directed at you in the first place

luissantos84 · « **Reply #74 on:** October 26, 2013, 11:44 »

Quote from: Grafix04 on October 26, 2013, 11:36

I've been around long enough to know you're posts aren't anything to write home about so please, feel free so stop wasting your time replying to my posts - that weren't directed at you in the first place

typical troll speech

haven't you registered 10 days ago? how do you know me? my family knows me nobody else does sucker

is this your 47th nickname here? of course you aren't a troll

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Author Topic: GraphicStock.com? (Read 47804 times)

luissantos84

Grafix04

luissantos84

luissantos84

Grafix04

Grafix04

Grafix04

cthoman

Ron

Grafix04

Grafix04

sharpshot

luissantos84

luissantos84

Grafix04

luissantos84

Grafix04

luissantos84

Grafix04

luissantos84

fritz

Grafix04

luissantos84

Grafix04

luissantos84

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