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Author Topic: 10 dead 20 wounded in school shooting  (Read 20877 times)

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« Reply #50 on: October 03, 2015, 12:37 »
+1
Oh dear there is nothing metaphorical about what you said. It is totally irrelevant whether I am 18 or 80.

In the UK there is a huge amount of concern about knife crime but I guess you haven't noticed it in your bubble (metaphor)



yes, yes, now move on.
I guess you don't need to look up condescending on google.


« Reply #51 on: October 03, 2015, 12:59 »
0
Funny this conversation as it carries on. Here is a nutter shooting people and the main issue seems to be his gun??  right now in Europe there are tens of thousands of refugees, innocent women and children and around, 70 people a day are dying and that without any guns, knifes, crossbows, canons, bombs. They are just dying because countries don't wish to help, politics, political murder without a gun.------------------------------------------not a single word about that....some contrast isn't it.

The refugee crisis is awful. But more than 80 people are killed per day in the U.S. every year, year after year, by guns. More than 30,000 people per year...more than a quarter million over the last decade. It's a daily crisis here and has been for a long time.

Funny this conversation as it carries on. Here is a nutter shooting people and the main issue seems to be his gun??  right now in Europe there are tens of thousands of refugees, innocent women and children and around, 70 people a day are dying and that without any guns, knifes, crossbows, canons, bombs. They are just dying because countries don't wish to help, politics, political murder without a gun.------------------------------------------not a single word about that....some contrast isn't it.

The refugee crisis is awful. But more than 80 people are killed per day in the U.S. every year, year after year, by guns. More than 30,000 people per year...more than a quarter million over the last decade. It's a daily crisis here and has been for a long time.

yeah but we are talking between 70-100 people PER/DAY here!  children starving, decease, infections, viruses, stress. My brother is down there right now as a physician, he calls it murder by torture.

All this and we are still talking about the vehicle of death instead of the political, social & health issues which contribute to both situations. I think collectively we are in the  process of waking up. If we want things to change for the better - instead of pointing fingers the world needs to ask themselves some difficult questions; define the root issues which contribute to our increasing social issues and then allocate adequate resources needed to solve those problems and heal our communities.

In the mean time those who would use a gun to harm others can access them easily and they have the means to kill more people in a set period of time than they do by most other means. 

One life lost because of our apathy is too many! We are all culpable because of our passivity; one life lost by gun, knife, bowling ball, tire iron, fire place poker, a mans fist or in the horrors born in the expansive refugee crisis is too many!

« Last Edit: October 03, 2015, 13:25 by gbalex »

« Reply #52 on: October 06, 2015, 01:09 »
+2
« Last Edit: October 06, 2015, 05:21 by marthamarks »

Shelma1

« Reply #53 on: October 06, 2015, 05:37 »
+1
Unfortunately, stories like this just keep happening.

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/tennessee-boy-11-charged-killing-girl-after-argument-over-puppy-n439061


There are so many mass shootings in the U.S. most are ignored, like this one, which happened on the same day as the Oregon shooting. http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-34428946?ocid=socialflow_facebook

« Reply #54 on: October 06, 2015, 05:45 »
0
Think its partly numbers and partly cos the more random shootings seem more scary - sad really. In the UK there does seem something of a "trend" for people to wipe out their close family.

« Reply #55 on: October 06, 2015, 06:14 »
+1
Perhaps the only way to defeat the gun lobby is to let them have their way in a few of the more conservative states?  Tourists and more sensible US citizens could stay away until they realise that arming almost everyone is just going to make it even worse.  It baffles me why people would want to give guns to more lunatics but the only way to defeat the argument might be to let them see what will happen.  How else can this endless argument about guns in the US be resolved.

Shelma1

« Reply #56 on: October 06, 2015, 06:19 »
+4
They already have their way in the southern states, and we already see what happens. Gun deaths are on the rise, set to surpass car deaths this year. Mass shootings happen so often they're commonplace. But the pro-gun people insist the answer is yet more guns. So they learn nothing.

« Reply #57 on: October 06, 2015, 08:06 »
0
It goes much deeper than that. The gun is part of the American culture. Sam Colts famous singl action, the gun that " won " the west and all that, then followed up with the famous 1911 sem-auto, etc, etc. Big part of the American history. The western frontier made it even bigger.
How do you change that? How do you change the motto, " every American have the rights to defend themselves". Down in Texas, huge state, its about 99% for and 1% against.

This is so deep rooted its an impossibillity.

ShadySue

« Reply #58 on: October 06, 2015, 08:22 »
+1
It goes much deeper than that. The gun is part of the American culture. Sam Colts famous singl action, the gun that " won " the west and all that, then followed up with the famous 1911 sem-auto, etc, etc. Big part of the American history. The western frontier made it even bigger.
How do you change that? How do you change the motto, " every American have the rights to defend themselves". Down in Texas, huge state, its about 99% for and 1% against.

This is so deep rooted its an impossibillity.


It's a good thing MLK didn't think that way.

Anyone have authoritative figures on Texan support for guns?
I could only find this:
http://texaspolitics.utexas.edu/archive/html/poll/features/gun_control_feature/slide1.html

« Reply #59 on: October 06, 2015, 08:24 »
0

« Reply #60 on: October 06, 2015, 08:40 »
0
Sure, more-strict yes. That doesn't mean a ban. Just more strict, i.e. controled licens, FAC, etc. Far cry from a ban.


Pauws99!  are you sure you were not a gunfighting town Marshall or a gun slinging outlaw like Billy the Pauws99 or something ;D ;D ;D

« Reply #61 on: October 06, 2015, 08:53 »
+1
I like to see my bullets as those of the truth puncturing the balloons of errors of those who are incapable of checking their facts on google before  filling up discussion threads with false assertions.

« Reply #62 on: October 06, 2015, 09:01 »
+1
Yesterday's Daily Show with Trevor Noah was very funny and very to the point in addressing this huge american hypocrisy:

Enjoy this clip, in case you didn't see the whole show:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/daily-show-guns-abortion-trevor-noah_561380b9e4b0368a1a60e477

« Reply #63 on: October 06, 2015, 09:16 »
0
Yesterday's Daily Show with Trevor Noah was very funny and very to the point in addressing this huge american hypocrisy:

Enjoy this clip, in case you didn't see the whole show:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/daily-show-guns-abortion-trevor-noah_561380b9e4b0368a1a60e477


I know. Good post, read it this morning. Mind you about hypocricy. Show me one single country whose politicians isn't.

« Reply #64 on: October 06, 2015, 09:23 »
0
Yesterday's Daily Show with Trevor Noah was very funny and very to the point in addressing this huge american hypocrisy:

Enjoy this clip, in case you didn't see the whole show:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/daily-show-guns-abortion-trevor-noah_561380b9e4b0368a1a60e477


I know. Good post, read it this morning. Mind you about hypocricy. Show me one single country whose politicians isn't.


At last something to agree on.....note to self do not get distracted while keywording  :-X

« Reply #65 on: October 06, 2015, 09:38 »
+3
Yesterday's Daily Show with Trevor Noah was very funny and very to the point in addressing this huge american hypocrisy:

Enjoy this clip, in case you didn't see the whole show:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/daily-show-guns-abortion-trevor-noah_561380b9e4b0368a1a60e477


I know. Good post, read it this morning. Mind you about hypocricy. Show me one single country whose politicians isn't.


It may be so, but this is no reason to turn a blind eye to their double-standards and especially no reason to vote for such hypocrites.

Their pro-life rhetoric "begins at conception and ends at birth".
This is a good one :)

On the same topic, here is an attachment from viral post I came across.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2015, 10:14 by Zero Talent »

« Reply #66 on: October 06, 2015, 10:11 »
+1
Dig down deep enough, it all boils down to capitalism and corporate interests in the states. Politics is pretty much controlled by capitalism and corporate interests in both parties but it seems to me that its little more obvious on the republican side. The gun lobby has a lot of power.
The real painful issue in our lifetime is that the human population is multiplying unchecked and we all want that great way of life which is certainly not good for the planet as we see the real effect w climate change. Our generation will probably be responsible for the mass extinction many species. It would be sad if our grand children live in a world where there is no rhinos or gorillas, elephants etc...

« Reply #67 on: October 06, 2015, 10:32 »
+1
Yesterday's Daily Show with Trevor Noah was very funny and very to the point in addressing this huge american hypocrisy:

Enjoy this clip, in case you didn't see the whole show:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/daily-show-guns-abortion-trevor-noah_561380b9e4b0368a1a60e477


I know. Good post, read it this morning. Mind you about hypocricy. Show me one single country whose politicians isn't.


It may be so, but this is no reason to turn a blind eye to their double-standards and especially no reason to vote for such hypocrites.

Their pro-life rhetoric "begins at conception and ends at birth".
This is a good one :)

On the same topic, here is an attachment from viral post I came across.


Intresting! no youre right one shouldnt turn a blind eye. Thats bad. Just so little if anything one can do. Unfortunately! I wish it was more. Its a frustrating issue indeed. :)

Shelma1

« Reply #68 on: October 06, 2015, 10:32 »
0
It goes much deeper than that. The gun is part of the American culture. Sam Colts famous singl action, the gun that " won " the west and all that, then followed up with the famous 1911 sem-auto, etc, etc. Big part of the American history. The western frontier made it even bigger.
How do you change that? How do you change the motto, " every American have the rights to defend themselves". Down in Texas, huge state, its about 99% for and 1% against.

This is so deep rooted its an impossibillity.


"A great majority of Texans 85 percent support requiring background checks on all gun sales. Texas Republicans favored the checks by 79 percent and NRA members by 65 percent in a poll conducted in April 2014.
The commissioners court in Travis County, TX. voted in February, 2014 to require that background checks be conducted on all gun sales in shows in its county facility.  The gun show operator did not accept the condition and no longer has shows in the county exposition center, located in Austin.
Sources:  http://americansforresponsiblesolutions.org/2014/06/01/new-research-shows-texans-support-stronger-laws-prevent-gun-violence"
 

« Reply #69 on: October 06, 2015, 10:47 »
0
It goes much deeper than that. The gun is part of the American culture. Sam Colts famous singl action, the gun that " won " the west and all that, then followed up with the famous 1911 sem-auto, etc, etc. Big part of the American history. The western frontier made it even bigger.
How do you change that? How do you change the motto, " every American have the rights to defend themselves". Down in Texas, huge state, its about 99% for and 1% against.

This is so deep rooted its an impossibillity.


"A great majority of Texans 85 percent support requiring background checks on all gun sales. Texas Republicans favored the checks by 79 percent and NRA members by 65 percent in a poll conducted in April 2014.
The commissioners court in Travis County, TX. voted in February, 2014 to require that background checks be conducted on all gun sales in shows in its county facility.  The gun show operator did not accept the condition and no longer has shows in the county exposition center, located in Austin.
Sources:  http://americansforresponsiblesolutions.org/2014/06/01/new-research-shows-texans-support-stronger-laws-prevent-gun-violence"
 


I know I am actually quite familiar with Texas, have some family over there. What I meant was, more strict control don't mean a ban of weapons or whatever. I'm afraid in most countries only a ban would be effective. Zero tolerance.

« Reply #70 on: October 08, 2015, 04:33 »
0
Restricting medication would probably be more effective than gun control.

Lawmaker Calls For Study On Links Between Pharmaceuticals And Mass Killers
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-10-07/lawmaker-calls-study-links-between-pharmaceuticals-and-mass-killers

« Reply #71 on: October 08, 2015, 04:36 »
+9
Yes and in many European countries, when a burglar comes through the window waving a gun,  you are supposed to use harsh language against his gun. God forbid if you should hit him over the head with something. He can then sue YOU for grevious bodily harm.

No matter how one twist and turn this question in the end nobody wins.

This is, of course, nonsense. You are allowed to use reasonable force in such a situation .

« Reply #72 on: October 08, 2015, 10:11 »
0
error---
« Last Edit: October 08, 2015, 10:14 by bpepz »

« Reply #73 on: October 08, 2015, 10:16 »
0
I can understand the argument that people should have the freedom to bear arms for whatever principled reason but the idea that it wouldn't prevent shootings to ban people having guns is absolutely rediculous. There is so much evidence from all over the world that more stringent gun laws equals massively  less shooting deaths. There's  even a nice parallel in austrailia where they had liberal (small l) gun laws and tightened them up after shootings with the result of massively less gun deaths. Sadly it has become a tribal political issue in the US and can never be anything else with the massive arms industry involved.


The highest mass shooting ever committed in recent times was by that Breivik guy in Norway which has very strict gun laws. Also you had the Charlie Hebdo massacre in France, very strict gun laws there too. What people fail to remember sometimes is that the US is a fairly large place with a huge population, so of course stuff like this will happen more often. If you considered europe a "country" their share of shooting is not too much better.

What really worries me is why do these shooting keep happening in schools? Why not other places? Surely there are plenty of other areas where people congregate? This makes me think there is something dysfunctional going on with the social dynamics of the schools that could be leading to this. Ever hear the phrase "going postal"?  It came about after a series of killings/shootings in the post office system by employees who were driven nuts by abusive management and a toxic workplace. I wonder if something similar is going on here. In case I am giving the impression that I am considering the shooters victims, I am not. I just think it would be good to look at the environment they were in the could of caused them to do this.

Shelma1

« Reply #74 on: October 08, 2015, 10:31 »
+2
Wrong-o. Mass shooting and gun ownership statistics are figured out by the number of shootings per 100,000 people, so adding all of Europe together wouldn't change a thing. America has more shootings per person because it has more guns per person. Really simple. The mass shootings you use as examples are exceptions to the rule.


 

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