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Author Topic: No views, no sales  (Read 28046 times)

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« Reply #25 on: June 18, 2009, 06:57 »
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All new images that were approved after May 17 have had zero view and zero sales.

It looks like DT has changed their search engines.


« Reply #26 on: June 18, 2009, 09:29 »
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Maybe they should rename it the "hide" engine.

« Reply #27 on: June 18, 2009, 09:52 »
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All new images that were approved after May 17 have had zero view and zero sales.

That's not my experience. I've had 12 sales and over 200 views on images approved since 17th May.

« Reply #28 on: June 18, 2009, 14:15 »
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Hate to admit it but Dreamstime has been horrible on my newly approved images. I have a trinkle of downloads mostly subs, and all are of really old images.
Am now wondering if it's worth uploading any more new images if they are not getting any views.
Echoes of IS and StockXpert. Hmm, wonder if Getty has already bought over Dreamstime  ;)
maybe CONSTANTIN, CARMEN, and ACHILLES just forgot to announce it    ???
« Last Edit: June 18, 2009, 14:18 by Perseus »

« Reply #29 on: June 18, 2009, 16:01 »
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This business has been tossed into a blender.  Getty is busily bulldozing things, and the (remaining) independents are constantly fiddling with their search priorities.

At DT and SS is my new images stopped selling, starting a couple of weeks ago. I believe both sites have stated they reduced the boost for new images.

It's been pointed out more than once that views don't matter - just sales.  So if meaningless views are reduced but sales remain, fine.  

But - the question remnains - if an image gets no views while it's new, does it "die" for good, or can it still sell later?  I don't know yet, but so far, it does not look good.

As always, it certainly would be nice of the people running these sites would be a little more open and straightforward with contributors. They don't want the competition to know the inner workings of their search functions - I get that.  But how about something simple, like "yes, new images still have a chance - we want them" or "no, it's over, stop submitting unless you have something really hot and current".  

Why would they want to spend money reviewing new images that will never sell?



« Last Edit: June 18, 2009, 16:41 by stockastic »

« Reply #30 on: June 18, 2009, 18:18 »
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This business has been tossed into a blender.  Getty is busily bulldozing things, and the (remaining) independents are constantly fiddling with their search priorities.

At DT and SS is my new images stopped selling, starting a couple of weeks ago. I believe both sites have stated they reduced the boost for new images.

It's been pointed out more than once that views don't matter - just sales.  So if meaningless views are reduced but sales remain, fine. 

But - the question remnains - if an image gets no views while it's new, does it "die" for good, or can it still sell later?  I don't know yet, but so far, it does not look good.

As always, it certainly would be nice of the people running these sites would be a little more open and straightforward with contributors. They don't want the competition to know the inner workings of their search functions - I get that.  But how about something simple, like "yes, new images still have a chance - we want them" or "no, it's over, stop submitting unless you have something really hot and current". 

Why would they want to spend money reviewing new images that will never sell?

Good points all. I like to know too.
Further to what you said, DT has been approving majority of my new images. But if they push these new images away , why approve them. I assume they think they are good enough to sell.
Again, to echo you, But if they can't find them, how do you sell them?

I too like a little more transparency with Dreamstime and SS. If not a public announcement, at least an email to say, "Oi, we like your stuff but hang on to them and submit them later.Or if you like, let it sit in abeyance for review. we won't review them until we need these new stuff".
Or something like that.

Anyway, I will spend more time drinking my Guinness and stop uploading to these sites until they move their priorities back to boost the new images . Also, I will just upload to the one(s) that 's been selling my new stuff really fast.

Makes sense, no? 

« Reply #31 on: June 18, 2009, 18:43 »
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It's a weird one-sided sort of "partnership" isn't it? Where the answer to every significant contributor question is "guess".

I've stopped shooting and uploading for now.  I want to see if my last few images ever sell. If they don't, there's no point anymore.


« Reply #32 on: June 19, 2009, 02:40 »
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@ puravida
how funny is this opinion, you realy think anyone can have some thousends of images and will be prepared for any case.
Any time i need a picture i search again and mostly i didn't get what i'm searching ... meanwhile i have a big pool of images i sold but never ever i take someone twice.
Microstocks are overloaded with copys of copys from pictures what sells but if you search images you need, you can detect a lot of wholes in any agencys portfolio.
I have a long list of images that doesn't exist.
Sales go down this time because it's summer, again, like every year, how unestimated it seems like, it happens every year.



WarrenPrice

« Reply #34 on: June 19, 2009, 11:37 »
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Is there someway we can see which pictures are "better?"  Does it take time for them to be better?  If age is not a factor, maybe I can make mine "better" too. 

« Reply #35 on: June 19, 2009, 11:41 »
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For some reason, DT un-favors recent images. The most recent I sold is from end February. All the others are 1-3 years old. The "recent" sale was found without keywords. That means it's the result of a buyer wandering off in your port and reverting to visual search. The message is upload, and ... wait.

Well explained FlemishDreams. I was wondering how my trinkle of sales of recent images got found with no specific keyword used. Cheers for providing me with the answer.

June-Aug are very slow months, but strangely, it's not the case this year and overall the sales are UP.
I've been posting these on various forums, but here we are again. Yes, the engine algorithm got tweaked; it shows better images now from more users. It takes some time to qualify an image as "better" though I wouldn't call them old. And although you have a good point, we have plenty ways to identify the good images from the newly submitted ones.

Good to see you here Achilles with some explanation.
I loved to have my "better" images keep selling. However, I prefer that also my recently approved images get found and sell too. Or else, a year down the road, you will only be having a collection of "old" images from us, as you are scaring us away with no views, no sale, to our recently approved images. Which by then, would have all these unviewed unsold images be buried and not seeing the light of day.
If your algorithm keeps doing that, what is the point of us continuing to upload to Dreamstime?

« Reply #36 on: June 19, 2009, 11:46 »
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My interpretation of this is that in the past, new images got automatic exposure and buyers decided whether they were "good".  Now, new images do not get exposure unless DT,  using methods or criteria they do not disclose, decides they are "good".   As a result, some contributors who used to think their images were "good" (because they sold) now find out that DT does not agree.  So their new images no longer get exposure, or sales.


« Last Edit: June 19, 2009, 11:49 by stockastic »

« Reply #37 on: June 19, 2009, 12:53 »
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You can't forget that buyers do have a choice in their searches.  If they want the freshest they can search by most recent.  If they want the most popular they can search by most downloads.  They can reverse the orders if they want the most obscure.  When I buy photos I usually search other than by the site's default.

CCK

« Reply #38 on: June 19, 2009, 13:29 »
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My sales remain the same.

WarrenPrice

« Reply #39 on: June 19, 2009, 13:30 »
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You can't forget that buyers do have a choice in their searches.  If they want the freshest they can search by most recent.  If they want the most popular they can search by most downloads.  They can reverse the orders if they want the most obscure.  When I buy photos I usually search other than by the site's default.

So, Achilles' reference to "better" images is only applicable to the default search???



« Reply #41 on: June 19, 2009, 16:09 »
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Yes, it refers to the default search only.

I don't think we will have a collection of old images, although that is a very valid concern. We all want to avoid that.

The new ones still have their ways to make it to the top, just see how many of your images are downloaded based on visual search. Add to that buyers who sort by date.

It's true, things should be balanced and we will continue to keep an eye on them. In the past fresh images were much too favored. Not only that, but contributors uploading series were occupying lot of exposure. Buyers may have downloaded one image, but most often not more of them. So, we're giving that space to more users now.

Sometimes, those images were not the most relevant and certainly not the best (although don't get me wrong, many were very good). This is part of the reason why some members experience a dramatic decline while others see a sharp increase.

Sorry for being offtopic after all. This thread was about no views. I stress once again that not counting the views has no connection to this. The algorithm changed many weeks before that anyway.
Not seeing as many views as before, doesn't mean they are not seen (by both guests and members). I personally believe that the views counted this way will allow users to make more educated guesses about them. The views we count now are more targeted than ever.

Awesome, and thanks again Achilles.
What you mentioned is uplifting and good enough for me to continue as usual.
But the para. that sold me that you are aiming to be more fair to ALL contributors is this para you wrote:
Not only that, but contributors uploading series were occupying lot of exposure. Buyers may have downloaded one image, but most often not more of them. So, we're giving that space to more users now.

Yes, that is one of the most disturbing situation I am sure many contributors were unhappy about...
ie. giving one contributor with series dominating the search, flooding the pages with that one contributor's work, and burying the rest onto page 20, 30, even 100.

Look forward to see more change to give everyone a level playing field. Cheers Achilles.

« Reply #42 on: June 19, 2009, 17:18 »
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You can't forget that buyers do have a choice in their searches.  If they want the freshest they can search by most recent.  If they want the most popular they can search by most downloads.  They can reverse the orders if they want the most obscure.  When I buy photos I usually search other than by the site's default.

True, but I wonder how many buyers use anything other than defaults.

« Reply #43 on: June 19, 2009, 17:53 »
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You can't forget that buyers do have a choice in their searches.  If they want the freshest they can search by most recent.  If they want the most popular they can search by most downloads.  They can reverse the orders if they want the most obscure.  When I buy photos I usually search other than by the site's default.

True, but I wonder how many buyers use anything other than defaults.

Not many from my experience.

« Reply #44 on: June 20, 2009, 06:29 »
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You can't forget that buyers do have a choice in their searches.  If they want the freshest they can search by most recent.  If they want the most popular they can search by most downloads.  They can reverse the orders if they want the most obscure.  When I buy photos I usually search other than by the site's default.

True, but I wonder how many buyers use anything other than defaults.

Not many from my experience.

I occasionally buy images. Instinctively, I want to see what's new. If the search engine is not on new images as a default, It's so simple to change it. I'm sure other buyers have the time and the awareness to make that extra click.  
« Last Edit: June 20, 2009, 09:27 by Komar »

« Reply #45 on: June 20, 2009, 06:52 »
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On DT 17 of my last 20 sales were from the use of key words, 20 sales before that was 16 sales from key words. So if the search is by key words the buyers will  find your images ..... if you used the correct key words. ;D

As an ex buyer of images, I always used key words to find an image.

I'm new on DT and found the site to be user freindly and it took me exactly 4 months from day one to reach the payout. (yesterday)

-Larry
« Last Edit: June 20, 2009, 06:55 by Lcjtripod »

« Reply #46 on: June 20, 2009, 08:34 »
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visual search

Visual search is a very neglected concept in our thinking about how buyers buy our images. Keywords can describe an image only marginally. It's the visual "click" that makes a buyer buy.

DT facilitates visual search a lot by the side-image series "similar images" from other's portfolio, and "more images from your portfolio" or "more images with this model". Neither SS nor IS have that.
What's more, by the "buyer searched after" (keywords), one can get very valuable strategic info about keywording and what's found by visual search (n/a).

The most important factor that contributors are in control of is portfolio diversity. This will lure more buyers (with varying needs) into visually search of your portfolio. Nature, urban, people, industrial, business, transport, isolated, editorial... anything that drags a buyer into your port enhances the chance on a sale, sometimes of a totally different image the buyer searched for initially. One way of working your way to the front page is participating in the assignments. Even if the assignment image doesn't sell, you'll get exposure and a chance of trapping a buyer in your port.

In short, there are many ways to beat the blind search engine.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2009, 08:36 by FlemishDreams »

« Reply #47 on: June 20, 2009, 08:39 »
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As an ex buyer of images, I always used key words to find an image.

I like to wander off in portfolios too.

« Reply #48 on: June 20, 2009, 09:32 »
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One way of working your way to the front page is participating in the assignments. Even if the assignment image doesn't sell, you'll get exposure and a chance of trapping a buyer in your port.

but don't you have to make your assignment entries exclusive? this would restrict your images potential eearning elsewhere, IF they did not win?

puravida

  • diablo como vd
« Reply #49 on: June 20, 2009, 09:42 »
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On DT 17 of my last 20 sales were from the use of key words, 20 sales before that was 16 sales from key words. So if the search is by key words the buyers will  find your images ..... if you used the correct key words. ;D

As an ex buyer of images, I always used key words to find an image.

I'm new on DT and found the site to be user freindly and it took me exactly 4 months from day one to reach the payout. (yesterday)

-Larry

woa, excuz me if I misread something. But june 16 you said you were unhappy with DT and was contemplating concentrating on some other site, now you say DT is great.  how is it possible the in 4 days you went from unhappy to ecstatic? pls let me in on the secret ;)


 

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