Author Topic: Adobe Terms (Read 24455 times)

Pixart · « **on:** April 02, 2019, 15:11 »

Signing onto Adobe today and I'm asked to agree to terms. Anyone know if something has changed or is this something that wasn't agreed to with the Fotolia/Adobe merge?

Is 62. new? I thought I could pull the plug at any time and no waiting period.

62 Managing Your Work. You may remove any of your Work from the Website at any time, provided, however, that you do not remove more than 100 items of Work or 10% of your Work, whichever is greater, in any 90-day period without 90 days' prior written notice to Adobe. We may remove Work or terminate your account at our sole discretion without prior notice.

And 9.1. As a Canadian - has this always been the case? Does a Canadian Company pay me and how do I receive a T-5?

9.1. Relationship. If you reside in the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Systems Incorporated, a United States company. If you reside outside of the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Canada Services Corporation, a Canadian company.

wds · « **Reply #1 on:** April 02, 2019, 15:30 »

Got the message as well. It was odd in that the "new" terms were dated June 2018.

Jo Ann Snover · « **Reply #2 on:** April 02, 2019, 15:42 »

I just came here to see if I was seeing something odd - as you noted, it's bizarre that terms supposedly 10 months old are suddenly presented in a tiny box requesting our agreement. I intend to read it first - as an example I was not aware that there was a Dreamstime-like requirement to keep a portion of the work online until a 90-day notice had elapsed (edited to add that this isn't new - see below).

It doesn't look as if anyone really took care when writing these terms as paragraph 62 is probably intended to be 6.2 as a sub paragraph of section 6.

I will see if the internet archive can get us prior versions for comparison to see what might have changed.

Here is a July 2016 version of the terms and the 90 day restriction is there, so it's not new. Still looking to see what other versions I can locate

https://www.adobe.com/content/dam/acom/en/legal/servicetou/Adobe_Stock_Contributor_Agreement-en_US-20160721_1200.pdf

And here's a PDF of the new terms (easier to read than in that minuscule box presented when we try to access our account information)

https://wwwimages2.adobe.com/content/dam/acom/en/legal/servicetou/Adobe_Stock_Contributor_Agreement_Addl_Terms_en_US_20180605.pdf

I really think Mat needs to explain to us what the changes were from the prior version and why we're now being asked to acknowledge our agreement.

JoeClemson · « **Reply #3 on:** April 02, 2019, 15:53 »

My first thought is that it is a knee jerk reaction to Pond5 introducing exclusive accounts, which is leading a (significant?) number of contributors to request that all or part of their video portfolio on Adobe is suspended or deleted. Could be a coincidence, but it seems strange that this unannounced change should suddenly appear. I'm not going to accept the change until I see some feedback on here to clarify what is going on.

Sean Locke Photography · « **Reply #4 on:** April 02, 2019, 15:59 »

You always wonder if 10,000 words of terms would stand up in court.

jjneff · « **Reply #5 on:** April 02, 2019, 16:01 »

I can almost guarantee this is a reaction to Pond5. This is actually a positive step if they are noticing Pond5! Now everyone needs to pay 60%!

Jo Ann Snover · « **Reply #6 on:** April 02, 2019, 16:15 »

Quote from: jjneff on April 02, 2019, 16:01

I can almost guarantee this is a reaction to Pond5. This is actually a positive step if they are noticing Pond5! Now everyone needs to pay 60%!

Not likely as the 90 day notice has been in place since at least 2016

There is one sentence added to the 2018 version that wasn't in that Managing your Work paragraph in 2016:

"We may remove Work or terminate your account at our sole discretion without prior notice"

jjneff · « **Reply #7 on:** April 02, 2019, 16:45 »

No, I just had to renew it again now it says "62 Managing Your Work. You may remove any of your Work from the Website at any time, provided, however, that you do not remove more than 100 items of Work or 10% of your Work, whichever is greater, in any 90-day period without 90 days' prior written notice to Adobe. We may remove Work or terminate your account at our sole discretion without prior notice."

Definitely a Pond5 reaction!

Trippy · « **Reply #8 on:** April 02, 2019, 17:04 »

Quote from: jjneff on April 02, 2019, 16:45

No, I just had to renew it again now it says "62 Managing Your Work. You may remove any of your Work from the Website at any time, provided, however, that you do not remove more than 100 items of Work or 10% of your Work, whichever is greater, in any 90-day period without 90 days' prior written notice to Adobe. We may remove Work or terminate your account at our sole discretion without prior notice."

Definitely a Pond5 reaction!

How can it be a reaction to Pond5 if the 90 day policy has been in place since 2016?

marthamarks · « **Reply #9 on:** April 02, 2019, 17:53 »

My eyes repeatedly crossed this afternoon trying to make sense of this, especially while trying to determine what's "new" and what's "not new" in both the main text and the separate Adobe Stock Contributor section… which you first have to notice and then click to find before diving into your lovely reading experience.

Wouldn't it be nice if companies like Adobe would flag the major changes, so we at least know what to look for in the hard-to-read type on long pages of murky legalese?

jjneff · « **Reply #10 on:** April 02, 2019, 18:07 »

They are bringing attention to it now because video files are being taken off their site.

marthamarks · « **Reply #11 on:** April 02, 2019, 19:59 »

Quote from: jjneff on April 02, 2019, 18:07

They are bringing attention to it now because video files are being taken off their site.

Why??? How??? Which ones???

jjneff · « **Reply #12 on:** April 02, 2019, 20:04 »

I know of one artist who has deleted 4,000 files off of Adobe the past few days and I am sure there are others! They want the clips Exclusive on Pond5 so you have to if you are making them exclusive.

marthamarks · « **Reply #13 on:** April 02, 2019, 20:44 »

Quote from: jjneff on April 02, 2019, 20:04

I know of one artist who has deleted 4,000 files off of Adobe the past few days and I am sure there are others! They want the clips Exclusive on Pond5 so you have to if you are making them exclusive.

Okay, I appreciate that explanation. Thought you were implying that Adobe was removing contributors' videos, not the other way around. Now it makes sense, so thank you.

Danybot · « **Reply #14 on:** April 02, 2019, 20:51 »

Quote from: Pixart on April 02, 2019, 15:11

And 9.1. As a Canadian - has this always been the case? Does a Canadian Company pay me and how do I receive a T-5?

9.1. Relationship. If you reside in the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Systems Incorporated, a United States company. If you reside outside of the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Canada Services Corporation, a Canadian company.

Payment has been from Adobe Canada for the past couple of years. I'm registered for HST in Canada, and I suspect that I should be collecting HST from them. I wrote to them last year to ask about it, but they never responded.

SuperPhoto · « **Reply #15 on:** April 02, 2019, 21:26 »

Quote from: jjneff on April 02, 2019, 16:01

I can almost guarantee this is a reaction to Pond5. This is actually a positive step if they are noticing Pond5! Now everyone needs to pay 60%!

I'm surprised you have so much faith in one agency. Hopefully your relationship never sours, because otherwise you are s.o.l...

swisschocolate · « **Reply #16 on:** April 02, 2019, 23:49 »

Quote from: SuperPhoto on April 02, 2019, 21:26

Quote from: jjneff on April 02, 2019, 16:01
I can almost guarantee this is a reaction to Pond5. This is actually a positive step if they are noticing Pond5! Now everyone needs to pay 60%!

I'm surprised you have so much faith in one agency. Hopefully your relationship never sours, because otherwise you are s.o.l...

No, he doesn't delete his clips and also is ready to upload new ones everywhere in 1-2 years if it doesn't work. He just encourages others to delete theirs... $:-\$
(Sorry, John, with all respect, it just looks so.)

Quote from: Jo Ann Snover on April 02, 2019, 15:42

Here is a July 2016 version of the terms and the 90 day restriction is there, so it's not new. Still looking to see what other versions I can locate

https://www.adobe.com/content/dam/acom/en/legal/servicetou/Adobe_Stock_Contributor_Agreement-en_US-20160721_1200.pdf

And here's a PDF of the new terms (easier to read than in that minuscule box presented when we try to access our account information)

https://wwwimages2.adobe.com/content/dam/acom/en/legal/servicetou/Adobe_Stock_Contributor_Agreement_Addl_Terms_en_US_20180605.pdf

I really think Mat needs to explain to us what the changes were from the prior version and why we're now being asked to acknowledge our agreement.

Thanks for the pdf link! I wasn't able to find it there.
Yes, it would be great if Mat would explain it to us

georgep7 · « **Reply #17 on:** April 03, 2019, 00:52 »

Quote

Now everyone needs to pay 60%!

Nope.

Deletion perhaps can vary from delete first ask later for claimed as stolen files,
or
deletion of older fotolia media that never selled and have near zero views
or
deletion of files with metadata indicating a pirated Pr or Ps (ok, wild guess...)
or
misleading or error titles, or keywording or pure files that are reported from customers
or
just a generic term added by the legal team as in every agency
or
whatever.

I am of the few that went with P5 exclusive all the way but I disagree (with all respect)

EDIT: I can confirm 167 files deletion including previous weeks accepted uploads within an evening
and also email communication, indicating that I would like to leave with no problem or stall from AS.

alijaber · « **Reply #18 on:** April 03, 2019, 03:03 »

I'm also sure it's related to P5.. I've deleted most of my video port at AS and I wasn't aware of the terms

Lina · « **Reply #19 on:** April 03, 2019, 03:31 »

Quote from: Pixart on April 02, 2019, 15:11

And 9.1. As a Canadian - has this always been the case? Does a Canadian Company pay me and how do I receive a T-5?

9.1. Relationship. If you reside in the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Systems Incorporated, a United States company. If you reside outside of the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Canada Services Corporation, a Canadian company.

I think it was always Adobe Canada on my PayPal statement.

I have questions about that too. If non-US residents have relationship with Adobe Canada, why are they still taking tax withholding? Isn't that only for companies from USA?

dirkr · « **Reply #20 on:** April 03, 2019, 04:01 »

Quote from: jjneff on April 02, 2019, 20:04

I know of one artist who has deleted 4,000 files off of Adobe the past few days and I am sure there are others! They want the clips Exclusive on Pond5 so you have to if you are making them exclusive.

Meaning they don't enforce their policies?

"You may remove any of your Work from the Website at any time, provided, however, that you do not remove more than 100 items of Work or 10% of your Work, whichever is greater, in any 90-day period without 90 days' prior written notice to Adobe"

panicAttack · « **Reply #21 on:** April 03, 2019, 04:56 »

Quote from: Lina on April 03, 2019, 03:31

I have questions about that too. If non-US residents have relationship with Adobe Canada, why are they still taking tax withholding? Isn't that only for companies from USA?

finally someone notice real problem here. pond5 has nothing to do with this update.

Mat, after this update, as we non-us contributors are part of non-us based company, if we (non-us resident) still need to send w8-ben forms and get tax withheld (and we never got our 1042-s forms anyway), your superiors have to know there is huge possibility they are committing something.... bad?

jjneff · « **Reply #22 on:** April 03, 2019, 05:30 »

I love Adobe and they have been very fair! I want them to succeed and still curate for other artist on BB where there clips are sold on Adobe! I don't have faith in any agency! I am just hoping the exclusive program does well as I feel the market is good for that move.

trucic · « **Reply #23 on:** April 03, 2019, 06:02 »

9.1. Relationship. If you reside in the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Systems Incorporated, a United States company. If you reside outside of the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Canada Services Corporation, a Canadian company.
[/quote]

.. now this is interesting... if we got our royalties with deduction, will someone from Adobe explain exact meaning of this...

panicAttack · « **Reply #24 on:** April 03, 2019, 06:23 »

Quote from: trucic on April 03, 2019, 06:02

9.1. Relationship. If you reside in the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Systems Incorporated, a United States company. If you reside outside of the United States, your relationship is with Adobe Canada Services Corporation, a Canadian company.

[/i]

.. now this is interesting... if we got our royalties with deduction, will someone from Adobe explain exact meaning of this...
[/quote]

I can answer your because answer is pretty straightforward.

Did you ever get 1042-s forms?

No

Now read this (just first 8 words)

https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/who-must-file

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Author Topic: Adobe Terms (Read 24455 times)

Pixart

wds

Jo Ann Snover

JoeClemson

Sean Locke Photography

jjneff

Jo Ann Snover

jjneff

Trippy

marthamarks

jjneff

marthamarks

jjneff

marthamarks

Danybot

SuperPhoto

swisschocolate

georgep7

alijaber

Lina

dirkr

panicAttack

jjneff

trucic

panicAttack

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