Author Topic: OMG America!!! (Read 73084 times)

cascoly · « **Reply #200 on:** March 25, 2016, 13:32 »

Quote from: cidepix on March 24, 2016, 21:39

the only way to prove American people are not dumb is to elect Bernie..

he is once in a lifetime opportunity.. Hillary is worse than trump.. at least trump is not pretending to be a "democrat"

no, the US has only 2 parities - compared to Europe they are center-right and right wing - so Hillary is closer to the traditional democratic party in values & positions - remember in the USA the very label 'socialist' is enough to disqualify a candidate in most of the country. when we elected a city councilwoman from Seattle's socialist party here it made national news

one of the main benefits of Sanders' campaign is to pull Clinton to the left

sharpshot · « **Reply #201 on:** March 26, 2016, 08:44 »

Just watched the Piers Morgan interview with Trump. Piers Morgan obviously couldn't question him properly because Trump would of walked out, like he always does when he is asked a difficult question in an interview. It was a waste of time, Piers Morgan just let him say all the usual lies about the UK. Trump was trying to tone it down but his ego was still out of control. All it did was make me like Piers Morgan even less, I thought that wouldn't be possible.

goober · « **Reply #202 on:** March 28, 2016, 18:45 »

Bernie is a bait and switch.

He points to the 1% as the problem but if he gets elected he will tax the stuffing out of everyone but the 1%. Apparently he had his honeymoon in the communist soviet union. It's unbelievable!

The brain boxes will leave the USA.

stockastic · « **Reply #203 on:** March 28, 2016, 19:34 »

Quote from: sharpshot on March 26, 2016, 08:44

Just watched the Piers Morgan interview with Trump. Piers Morgan obviously couldn't question him properly because Trump would of walked out, like he always does when he is asked a difficult question in an interview. It was a waste of time, Piers Morgan just let him say all the usual lies about the UK. Trump was trying to tone it down but his ego was still out of control. All it did was make me like Piers Morgan even less, I thought that wouldn't be possible.

The media people are at a loss in trying to deal with Trump. He doesn't follow the pattern and they don't know how to handle him. The result is that they follow his script and end up looking foolish. But I think that's going to change. If Trump is going to try to make politics into the Jerry Springer show, the media people can play that game too. They'll adapt and find ways to structure the situation so he loses control and starts to find himself trapped in his own nonsense and contradictions. Basically, they'll learn how to play him.

He'll find out that there's just as much money to be made in bringing him down as there was in building him up.

Hongover · « **Reply #204 on:** March 28, 2016, 19:37 »

Quote from: goober on March 28, 2016, 18:45

Bernie is a bait and switch.

He points to the 1% as the problem but if he gets elected he will tax the stuffing out of everyone but the 1%. Apparently he had his honeymoon in the communist soviet union. It's unbelievable!

The brain boxes will leave the USA.

Bernie already admitted on Bill Maher that he's going to increase taxes for more than just the 1%. He'll likely increase taxes on the top 10% and people earning less. It's a slippery slope. Everyone is a socialist until they start earning a decent salary.

Carmen · « **Reply #205 on:** March 28, 2016, 20:48 »

Quote from: noodle on March 15, 2016, 20:00

If Trump ends up winning it'll be the biggest PUNK'D America has ever seen! LOL!

The only true that Trump has said so far is that if he wins, Mexicans will pay for a big wall. Of course they will, to stop Americans from entering Mexico running away from Trump's USA

Every country have the government their citizen's deserve. I hope Americans will never deserve to be governed by someone like Donald Clown.

goober · « **Reply #206 on:** March 28, 2016, 20:56 »

There is a podcast/audiobook I listened to a few years ago that was about first generation millionaires. In that audiobook they said that exRussians make the highest proportion of first generation millionaires. Why? I would propose that the brain boxes got out of there when possible and went to the free market.

The basic premise of the book is that if you have a high income and frugality you accumulate wealth over a lifetime. High earners who are high spenders have nothing to show towards then end of their lives. Their children generally live off the parents wealth. Frugal parents limit what they give their children.

The people that are going to 'feel the Bern' will be the high income frugal savers just underneath the 1%. They'll also be the ones who pick up and move elsewhere when it becomes advantageous.

cascoly · « **Reply #207 on:** March 29, 2016, 13:49 »

Quote from: Minscer on March 28, 2016, 19:37

Quote from: goober on March 28, 2016, 18:45
Bernie is a bait and switch.

He points to the 1% as the problem but if he gets elected he will tax the stuffing out of everyone but the 1%. Apparently he had his honeymoon in the communist soviet union. It's unbelievable!

The brain boxes will leave the USA.

Bernie already admitted on Bill Maher that he's going to increase taxes for more than just the 1%. He'll likely increase taxes on the top 10% and people earning less. It's a slippery slope. Everyone is a socialist until they start earning a decent salary.

top 10% account for > 80% of total income; no other industrial nation comes close to US income inequality

the bigger question is what we'd get for our taxes. current laws are skewed to reqard that top 10% without exacting their share of costs. new taxes could bring us into the 20th century in terms of universal health insurance, social safety net, job creation, etc, etc rather than rewarding the parasitical financial sector which produces NOTHING

that's the real socialism in the US -- corporations are bailed out when they fail, but keep all the profits when successful

cascoly · « **Reply #208 on:** March 29, 2016, 13:52 »

Quote from: goober on March 28, 2016, 20:56

....

The basic premise of the book is that if you have a high income and frugality you accumulate wealth over a lifetime. High earners who are high spenders have nothing to show towards then end of their lives. Their children generally live off the parents wealth. Frugal parents limit what they give their children.

The people that are going to 'feel the Bern' will be the high income frugal savers just underneath the 1%. They'll also be the ones who pick up and move elsewhere when it becomes advantageous.

first, a large proportion of that 10% is INHERITED wealth

but bigger factor is that any increased tax is on INCOME not total wealth -- so even doubling the current tax rate on this 10% would do little harm to their actual wealth or spending

Hongover · « **Reply #209 on:** March 29, 2016, 15:39 »

Quote from: cascoly on March 29, 2016, 13:52

Quote from: goober on March 28, 2016, 20:56

....

The basic premise of the book is that if you have a high income and frugality you accumulate wealth over a lifetime. High earners who are high spenders have nothing to show towards then end of their lives. Their children generally live off the parents wealth. Frugal parents limit what they give their children.

The people that are going to 'feel the Bern' will be the high income frugal savers just underneath the 1%. They'll also be the ones who pick up and move elsewhere when it becomes advantageous.

first, a large proportion of that 10% is INHERITED wealth

but bigger factor is that any increased tax is on INCOME not total wealth -- so even doubling the current tax rate on this 10% would do little harm to their actual wealth or spending

I think you mistaken the top 10% for the top 1%. Generalizations like yours is what's wrong with this whole debate. If you make over $110k, you are considered to be in the top 10%. And if you live in the San Francisco Bay Area, that money doesn't get you very far, after 1/3 going to taxes and 1/4 going to rent. And speaking of the Bay Area, a lot of the wealthy people didn't inherit anything here, they're self-made millionaires.

And socialism doesn't create jobs, unless it's in the public sector...because we'll need more people to distribute that extra money. Socialism discourages competition and reduces urgency for everyone. I don't like Corporations getting bailed out as much anyone, but it's just as bad to bail out the parasitic non-productive part of society that also happens to offer nothing other than leech off the productive.

Society need to stop hating on the rich, or you may end up hating yourself one day.

goober · « **Reply #210 on:** March 29, 2016, 20:46 »

Quote from: cascoly on March 29, 2016, 13:49

Quote from: Minscer on March 28, 2016, 19:37
Quote from: goober on March 28, 2016, 18:45
Bernie is a bait and switch.

He points to the 1% as the problem but if he gets elected he will tax the stuffing out of everyone but the 1%. Apparently he had his honeymoon in the communist soviet union. It's unbelievable!

The brain boxes will leave the USA.

Bernie already admitted on Bill Maher that he's going to increase taxes for more than just the 1%. He'll likely increase taxes on the top 10% and people earning less. It's a slippery slope. Everyone is a socialist until they start earning a decent salary.

top 10% account for > 80% of total income; no other industrial nation comes close to US income inequality

the bigger question is what we'd get for our taxes. current laws are skewed to reqard that top 10% without exacting their share of costs. new taxes could bring us into the 20th century in terms of universal health insurance, social safety net, job creation, etc, etc rather than rewarding the parasitical financial sector which produces NOTHING

that's the real socialism in the US -- corporations are bailed out when they fail, but keep all the profits when successful

There is corruption at the top level. I think we all realise this. Banks and Governments are in bed. Do you really think Bernie is going to remove the Reserves Banks fractional reserve money printing and give us sound money? Do you think he'll get all that bailout money back to the people? No. He wants communism or socialism (communism lite).

Socialism is like a compressor on the middle class. Every year that you apply the compressor you get slightly less productivity. For the first few decades society seems better off and more cohesive but eventually more people join the taking side of the ledger and then there's not enough taxes to pay for everyones entitlements.

Let everyone keep more of what they produce and you'll see more productivity.

goober · « **Reply #211 on:** March 29, 2016, 21:03 »

Quote from: cascoly on March 29, 2016, 13:52

Quote from: goober on March 28, 2016, 20:56

....

The basic premise of the book is that if you have a high income and frugality you accumulate wealth over a lifetime. High earners who are high spenders have nothing to show towards then end of their lives. Their children generally live off the parents wealth. Frugal parents limit what they give their children.

The people that are going to 'feel the Bern' will be the high income frugal savers just underneath the 1%. They'll also be the ones who pick up and move elsewhere when it becomes advantageous.

first, a large proportion of that 10% is INHERITED wealth

but bigger factor is that any increased tax is on INCOME not total wealth -- so even doubling the current tax rate on this 10% would do little harm to their actual wealth or spending

In this tax on INCOME scenario, the 10% who inherited wealth would be better off sitting on their wealth rather than risking it in the economy, trying to be productive, which means less taxes.

Sean Locke Photography · « **Reply #212 on:** March 29, 2016, 21:05 »

"The media people are at a loss in trying to deal with Trump. He doesn't follow the pattern and they don't know how to handle him. "

All they have to do is show him talking. Every time he speaks, I can't believe how stupid he sounds. Last night, I caught a clip, and as usual, everything was "tremendous". It's like a drinking game.

goober · « **Reply #213 on:** March 29, 2016, 21:16 »

Quote from: Sean Locke Photography on March 29, 2016, 21:05

"The media people are at a loss in trying to deal with Trump. He doesn't follow the pattern and they don't know how to handle him. "

All they have to do is show him talking. Every time he speaks, I can't believe how stupid he sounds. Last night, I caught a clip, and as usual, everything was "tremendous". It's like a drinking game.

I think GWBush was worse.

PixelBytes · « **Reply #214 on:** March 29, 2016, 21:18 »

Quote from: goober on March 29, 2016, 21:16

Quote from: Sean Locke Photography on March 29, 2016, 21:05
"The media people are at a loss in trying to deal with Trump. He doesn't follow the pattern and they don't know how to handle him. "

All they have to do is show him talking. Every time he speaks, I can't believe how stupid he sounds. Last night, I caught a clip, and as usual, everything was "tremendous". It's like a drinking game.

I think GWBush was worse.

Can we agree they're both idiots?

goober · « **Reply #215 on:** March 29, 2016, 21:54 »

Trump wants to make America great again. What made America great? Protestant Christianity, Calvinism in particular, gave rise to these ideas which were put into practice:

Private ownership of land and property rather than serfdom or slavery was preferable.
Doing right by your neighbour as you would have them do to you allows businesses to flourish.
Unjust scales and weights were an abomination. No fractional reserve money printing.
Charity was voluntary and nobody gives more than protestant Christians.
Husbands loving wives and wives respecting husbands, working together, statistically eliminates poverty.
Protestant work ethic produces prosperity.
Families and Churches take care of elders, widows and orphans - everyone else works.
Limited government and taxation needed due to people taking care of themselves and those around them.
Less sins like murder and theft means less destruction and cost to the community.
Not bearing false witness allows innocent people to live peacefully without fear of retribution.

PixelBytes · « **Reply #216 on:** March 30, 2016, 00:42 »

Quote from: goober on March 29, 2016, 21:54

Trump wants to make America great again. What made America great? Protestant Christianity, Calvinism in particular, gave rise to these ideas which were put into practice:

Private ownership of land and property rather than serfdom or slavery was preferable.
Doing right by your neighbour as you would have them do to you allows businesses to flourish.
Unjust scales and weights were an abomination. No fractional reserve money printing.
Charity was voluntary and nobody gives more than protestant Christians.
Husbands loving wives and wives respecting husbands, working together, statistically eliminates poverty.
Protestant work ethic produces prosperity.
Families and Churches take care of elders, widows and orphans - everyone else works.
Limited government and taxation needed due to people taking care of themselves and those around them.
Less sins like murder and theft means less destruction and cost to the community.
Not bearing false witness allows innocent people to live peacefully without fear of retribution.

You and I read different history books. The founders fled Europe because of religious persecution. That's why they included the clause in the Constitution prohibiting the establishment of a State religion, commonly referred to as separation of church and state. The pledge of allegiance did not include the words Under God until the 1950s. A protestant theocracy was the LAST thing US founders wanted.

Not to mention that most of the values you list and attribute to protestantism date back as far as Hammurabi's Code, The Ten Commandments, and Catholicism, all of which predated Martin Luther's Theses and the start of Protestantism by thousands of years.

If you want to live under a theocracy, may I suggest Iran?

goober · « **Reply #217 on:** March 30, 2016, 02:40 »

Quote from: PixelBytes on March 30, 2016, 00:42

Quote from: goober on March 29, 2016, 21:54
Trump wants to make America great again. What made America great? Protestant Christianity, Calvinism in particular, gave rise to these ideas which were put into practice:

Private ownership of land and property rather than serfdom or slavery was preferable.
Doing right by your neighbour as you would have them do to you allows businesses to flourish.
Unjust scales and weights were an abomination. No fractional reserve money printing.
Charity was voluntary and nobody gives more than protestant Christians.
Husbands loving wives and wives respecting husbands, working together, statistically eliminates poverty.
Protestant work ethic produces prosperity.
Families and Churches take care of elders, widows and orphans - everyone else works.
Limited government and taxation needed due to people taking care of themselves and those around them.
Less sins like murder and theft means less destruction and cost to the community.
Not bearing false witness allows innocent people to live peacefully without fear of retribution.

You and I read different history books. The founders fled Europe because of religious persecution. That's why they included the clause in the Constitution prohibiting the establishment of a State religion, commonly referred to as separation of church and state. The pledge of allegiance did not include the words Under God until the 1950s. A protestant theocracy was the LAST thing US founders wanted.

Not to mention that most of the values you list and attribute to protestantism date back as far as Hammurabi's Code, The Ten Commandments, and Catholicism, all of which predated Martin Luther's Theses and the start of Protestantism by thousands of years.

If you want to live under a theocracy, may I suggest Iran?

I don't want a theocracy. I want people to be salted by the influence and ideas of protestant Christianity. So instead of 'beggar thy neighbour' which is what we have now, we can have some of the values mentioned above.

I agree that the State and Religion should be separate entities or you end up with situations like Sharia Law or the Holy Roman Empire, both of which were terrible to live under.

I happened to listen to this today. It's not on the topic of the founders but it addresses foundations for culture.
http://rzim.org/let-my-people-think-broadcasts/if-the-foundations-be-destroyed-part-2-of-2

dpimborough · « **Reply #218 on:** March 30, 2016, 03:20 »

I think Donald Trump is great!

Just what the establishment needs a good kick up the pants to the vested interests

And he's actually more liberal than Cruz

Zero Talent · « **Reply #219 on:** March 30, 2016, 07:27 »

Quote from: goober on March 29, 2016, 21:54

Trump wants to make America great again. What made America great? Protestant Christianity, Calvinism in particular, gave rise to these ideas which were put into practice:

Private ownership of land and property rather than serfdom or slavery was preferable.
Doing right by your neighbour as you would have them do to you allows businesses to flourish.
Unjust scales and weights were an abomination. No fractional reserve money printing.
Charity was voluntary and nobody gives more than protestant Christians.
Husbands loving wives and wives respecting husbands, working together, statistically eliminates poverty.
Protestant work ethic produces prosperity.
Families and Churches take care of elders, widows and orphans - everyone else works.
Limited government and taxation needed due to people taking care of themselves and those around them.
Less sins like murder and theft means less destruction and cost to the community.
Not bearing false witness allows innocent people to live peacefully without fear of retribution.

These are fairy tales. Pixelbytes is right.

What made America great was a long period of true economical freedom (long gone now).
A period when private initiatives, entrepreneurship, new ideas could flourish unincombered by taxation, regulations and other bureaucratic government interventions.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

Nikovsk · « **Reply #220 on:** March 30, 2016, 09:24 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on March 30, 2016, 07:27

What made America great was a long period of true economical freedom (long gone now).
A period when private initiatives, entrepreneurship, new ideas could flourish unincombered by taxation, regulations and other bureaucratic government interventions.

Exactly and the closest candidate of this concept, although still far away, is Trump. Sanders would turn the US into Venezuela but at least he has excellent foreign policy. Cruz, Kasich and Clinton are basically the same as Bush/Obama, all bought and paid for by the establishment. With the exception that Clinton is a proven criminal that helped destroy Syria and Libya. Expect more wars, more debt and more government with those three. I'd rather try something new - Trump or even Sanders as a last resort.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #221 on:** March 30, 2016, 09:54 »

Quote from: Nikovsk on March 30, 2016, 09:24

Quote from: Zero Talent on March 30, 2016, 07:27
What made America great was a long period of true economical freedom (long gone now).
A period when private initiatives, entrepreneurship, new ideas could flourish unencumbered by taxation, regulations and other bureaucratic government interventions.

Exactly and the closest candidate of this concept, although still far away, is Trump.

What? No way, not even close (it only applies, if you are a white, US born, non-Muslim, male who likes Trump)
Maybe Cruz, with his flat tax, comes somewhat closer to that concept.
However, for both, their standing on social liberties is appalling and a danger, because social liberties are a precursor, a requirement and an enabler for economical freedom and prosperity.
What America needs is a new political breed, a combination between democrat social liberties and republican economical policies, with a brand new, non-interventionist, less costly, foreign policy.

Nikovsk · « **Reply #222 on:** March 30, 2016, 10:24 »

Cruz was pro-amnesty as a senator and now wants to build a wall. How can anyone believe him, especially being sponsored by Goldman Sachs? He's owned and will do what he's told to do, just like Bush and Obama. What's needed is a smart libertarian government. But we don't have many realistic options now have we?

Trump understands economy more than all the others combined, his 35% tax on foreign goods from specific countries would create millions of jobs for anybody who's willing to work. His crackdown on illegal immigration would benefit lower class citizens more than anyone else. Only the free-crap army won't like it.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #223 on:** March 30, 2016, 11:05 »

Quote from: Nikovsk on March 30, 2016, 10:24

Trump understands economy more than all the others combined, his 35% tax on foreign goods from specific countries would create millions of jobs for anybody who's willing to work. His crackdown on illegal immigration would benefit lower class citizens more than anyone else. Only the free-crap army won't like it.

These are far from being libertarian concepts!
Trump promotes protectionism and isolation, instead of free trade. Protectionism protects jobs in inefficient parts of the economy. This leads to less choices, lower quality products for higher prices. Consumers will end up subsidizing these "protected" labor intensive jobs.

Free trade creates jobs in the areas where US is strong and competitive and consumers benefit from it.

I said it before, when China gets US dollars for performing manufacturing jobs with with no qualification required, they must spend these dollars on something. They will spend these dollars on american goods and services, with a lot of embedded intelligence, creating high quality jobs, and stimulating american workers to continuously improve their qualifications.

Taxation of foreign goods will promote inefficiency instead of stimulating american competitiveness.

Free trade means progress, prosperity, peace.

So that "job creation" is a HUGE fallacy like all other HUGE things Trump promotes.
And BTW, Sanders is equally wrong on this topic.

Nikovsk · « **Reply #224 on:** March 30, 2016, 13:10 »

When did I say Trump was a libertarian? Of course he isn't. Now look at US data, there is a giant unemployment and vast majority of new jobs being created don't require qualification (waiters, bartenders) while new high paying jobs for qualificated people are minimal. You can't compare the free market US during the 1800's with a globalized world. Free market today is impossible because you cannot compete with chinese wages. US will never be competitive unless it becomes a third world country - it's well on it's way though.

And yes goods would cost more, but US currently has the cheapest electronics in the world. It's a small price to pay for more jobs in the economy and less people on food stamps. What we have today is not working for anybody except for the elite. Anyway, I don't think Trump could ever "make america great again" because it's broken beyond repair. I just don't want to see another war close to me... and while Sanders would be a disaster for the US he wouldn't force government change so I'd also vote for him anytime over the establishment.

MicrostockGroup Sponsors

Author Topic: OMG America!!! (Read 73084 times)

cascoly

sharpshot

goober

stockastic

Hongover

Carmen

goober

cascoly

cascoly

Hongover

goober

goober

Sean Locke Photography

goober

PixelBytes

goober

PixelBytes

goober

dpimborough

Zero Talent

Nikovsk

Zero Talent

Nikovsk

Zero Talent

Nikovsk

Related Topics

Sponsors

Microstock Poll Results

Sponsors