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Messages - cascoly

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801

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What it's really bad at is named locations. It doesn't seem to be able to produce decent realistic images of Big Ben or Mt Everest or the Taj Mahal because those images require a single viewpoint and you can't combine images without it looking very odd.

these folk are likely screwed as well - just not as quickly as your other examples.  when i asked for images of crowds and the yeni camii near the golden horn, the results showed several different angles

only images got the minarets correct, but it's just a matter of time before that''s improved

3 of the 4 'sherpas on everest' pictures had a reasonable image of everest with a recognizable west ridge & summit pyramid

Probably not the best example to use... for fiction it maybe ok depending on the audience but certainly no good for anyone in the world of mountaineering.

You can't use an image that is similar to a mountain when you need the image to highlight a specific route up it. A lot of the books I have for different mountains in the Alps an the Andes were bought as a reference guide so we knew what to expect before we got to the climb. No point having something that looks similar as it could be very dangerous once you're at 4-8000 metres up.

The climbing community as a whole would pickup on it in a flash, they are very protective of tradition. Just try and bolt a route up a mountain in the Lake District, they would hunt you down.  Any images that weren't accurate would be ridiculed by the community. Even in the Lake District or Scottish Highlands they need to be accurate. Editors don't even like it when an image is captioned a little wrong as they could use the image incorrectly that could lead to climbers and hikers getting into difficulty on the mountain.

As a photo on the wall, a real photo of Everest and climbers hanging on the wall is like wow, amazing achievement and place. You think of the effort it took to get there, the dangers, the blood sweat and tears etc of each of those captured in the image... there is an emotional connection. An AI rendition is just an empty vessel in comparison. No value at all because it's not real. But I guess that's just the way I see it from a climbers perspective.

Maybe in the future that's what we'll see. People hunting out real imagery over AI as they don't want something that is fake. They want something that is real, something that can connect them to the earth we live in... something that does exist and was seem by a fellow human

I was an active mountaineer & backcountry skier - reaching 21K in Himalaya & many climbs in Alps, Andes,  & Rockies and winter climbs in the Cascades & Canada (retired now). I was a committee chair in the Seattle Mountaineers club and climb & ski mountaineering leader. I recently received my 50 yr pin from the Mazamas mountaineering club. I also designed an Everest climbing game in the90s.  So i agree with your comment on the climbing community.

But the image was never aimed at that group! Anyone thinking it was intended as a route map would not have a long career!  it was aimed at the microstock  market for those looking for generic moutain or climbing image or an impressionist view of the Himalaya.  My comment on the 'accuracy' of the result was about the quality of the AI

802
General Stock Discussion / Re: No sales on Shutterstock lately
« on: October 19, 2022, 12:41 »
daily sales, down 10% from normal

still amazed (not really)about the conclusion from activity on 1 site means the entire system is broken

803
ok, this one i can't figure out -  they searched:

"antarctica national costume"

guess they were looking for tuxedos

805
Adobe Stock / Re: Adobe Stock Free Collection: Video Nominations
« on: October 15, 2022, 12:59 »
My experience with some stock sites is that giving away a portion of a video for free leads to a portfolio of buyers who need others like it. And the more buyers buy something, the higher the portfolio rating. Therefore, I am always for the free distribution of part of the video as advertising. Moreover, the experience of the same subscription stocks says that a fixed monthly price for unlimited downloads leads to an increase in income and stability.

basic logical fallacy -  correlation is not causation


806
General - Top Sites / Re: Dall e 2 will make us all redundant?
« on: October 13, 2022, 18:04 »
And this is how its going to be rolled out to the masses:

https://techcrunch.com/2022/10/12/microsoft-brings-dall-e-2-to-the-masses-with-designer-and-image-creator/

the approach is aimed at lower end uses, for which DALL E is already good - not replacing microstock (yet)

Seeking to bring OpenAIs tech to an even wider audience, Microsoft is launching Designer, a Canva-like web app that can generate designs for presentations, posters, digital postcards, invitations, graphics and more to share on social media and other channels. Designer whose announcement leaked repeatedly this spring and summer leverages user-created content and DALL-E 2 to ideate designs, with drop-downs and text boxes for further customization and personalization.

Within Designer, users can choose from various templates to get started on specific, defined-dimensions designs for platforms like Instagram, LinkedIn Facebook ads and Instagram Stories. Prebuilt templates are available from the web, as are shapes, photos, icons and headings that can be added to projects.


Interesting to see how deep pockets MS deals with the copyright training issue

807
Canva / Re: Canva earnings are continuing to go down
« on: October 13, 2022, 17:57 »
no real change - my sub earnings vary by 10% either direction and usually beat AS by a wide margin

808
Adobe Stock / Re: Adobe Stock Free Collection: Video Nominations
« on: October 12, 2022, 12:36 »
derby, I'm in the stock business more than you, for sure. No need to send me to where you yourself have not been.
As for prices and subscriptions, you dont understand what a modern subscription is at all. Compare prices here
https://stock.adobe.com/plans
and here
https://elements.envato.com/pricing

your claim to competence would be stronger if you posted a portfolio link, rather than jumping into conversations you haven't bothered to read

809
General - Top Sites / Re: Dall e 2 will make us all redundant?
« on: October 12, 2022, 12:33 »
cascoly

Did you submit those Dale-E 2 images as photos or illustrations?

Thanks

as illustrations and that's what i asked for - i don't think the present version is ready for prime time. with illustrations there's much more tolerance (esp'ly on SS) for what would be perceived as noise if submitted as a photo

810
General - Top Sites / Re: Dall e 2 will make us all redundant?
« on: October 12, 2022, 12:26 »
DALL-E has an annoying tendency to crop - and doesnt understand 'no cropping' etc in the input phrase
Yes, I noticed that too and sometimes the crops are really ridiculous, like cutting off the whole head of a person. I tried all kinds of phrases to avoid this, like "no crop, not cropped, person fully visible in picture, head not cut off". I have not been able to figure out any kind of instruction that DALL-E uderstands.
But, to be honest, even though I was searching for images for work and could have used some good results, I was still glad to see such flaws. The more flaws I find with DALL-E's performance the less I am worried that I will be completely replaceble as a photographer, at least in the near future.

yes, i've tried many such phrases and also emailed DALL-E w no reply.

and yes, i see little competition in the near future

811
pancaketom, Maybe. But in this topic, it seems that they suggested somehow ranking the tags in order to somehow adapt to the search algorithms on stocks. And this seems to me a bad idea, because. algorithms may well already work on the basis of artificial intelligence.

please explain how AI can identify images without desc & tags

812
Adobe Stock / Re: Adobe Stock Free Collection: Video Nominations
« on: October 11, 2022, 17:33 »
cascoly, what rules are you talking about? I'm just trying to figure out why adobe does not take a lot of videos into the free collection, and why the selection is so weak in content.

it really helps to start at the first post!

Hi Everyone,

Heads up! Videos will be eligible for nomination into the Adobe Stock Free collection starting tomorrow (Tuesday, October 11). An email with detailed information will be sent to those of you with eligible content, tomorrow morning (PDT). Check your inbox then, and let me know if you have any questions after you read it.

Thank you,

Mat Hayward

813
Adobe Stock / Re: Adobe Stock Free Collection: Video Nominations
« on: October 11, 2022, 15:56 »
Only my thoughts: I'm not a "company", but I know that sometimes it's hard for a company to understand some little human reasoning :-)
I dont understand at all how they choose videos from the authors portfolio, on what basis. ....  I personally would like all my videos to be featured in the free collection if I get paid to do so. I don't care if it's $8 or more. Okay, they say they only take what hasn't sold in a year, great, let them take it. But they do not take, but choose very few videos.
sure, many of us would like AS to take all our work, but that's not how it works

you're new here, but once again you should read the rules before you post - the process is explained, and it never said they'd take anything you want

814
Quote from: stoker2014
AI can't recognize photos LOCATIONS was the point, and we will still need metadata. That is the issue.
I disagree with your generalization that tags won't be needed.
...
Google easily found your photos on the Internet and it says where they were taken too. In any case, the stocks will switch to intellect, because. it will serve buyers better than tags, many of which are either spam or don't match the image.

no evidence Google use ML or other AI - rather it likely used TAGS to identify the location

815
General - Top Sites / Re: Dall e 2 will make us all redundant?
« on: October 11, 2022, 15:18 »
Repent! the end is near!

had 1st sales of DALL-E art from AS & SS today - the dimes are pouring in!

816
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Slavery was abolished by  a Christian / religious movement?

no one's saying all christians are evil

while quakers & other abolitionists raised consciousness of slavery, slavery was not abolished by a religious movement - it was abolished by the 13th amendment, after a bloody civil war to defeat the proponents of slavery - the 13-15th amendments assured that could never happen again (or so we thought)

817

not sure how much applies to your life changes, but it's amazing (sort of) how 'christians' can cherry pick what proves their 'belief' while ignoring evolution, climate change, slavery, human rights, and most recently the freedom of women to make their own choice about their bodies


If it was only that, there a new groups that showed up recently that also want to control and force the control on all people about the choices on their own body limiting their human rights if they refuse which puts them in same category with religious fanatics but they will just close their eyes and try to justify that with almost the same stupid arguments religious fanatics use.

yes, that's why we need to call them out when they post, even if it's off topic

818
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I probably have one that is considered more laughable but will mention here anyway.

Over 32 years ago I went from atheist to Christian almost overnight. One of the reasons for this was the following verse in the book of Revelation that outlines a number of events leading up to the second arrival of JC:

"And he causes all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: And that no man might BUY or SELL, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name" (Revelation 13:16-17).

This is clearly coming into reality today, given rapidly developing and evolving digital currencies, electronic payments, microchip implants, QR Codes, social credit score systems and surveillance among other technologies enabling cashless, contactless and fully traceable transactions.

not sure how much applies to your life changes, but it's amazing (sort of) how 'christians' can cherry pick what proves their 'belief' while ignoring evolution, climate change, slavery, human rights, and most recently the freedom of women to make their own choice about their bodies

like nostrdamus & the Sibylline oracle, revelation is particularly ripe for abuse, with apocalyptic but egregiously vague pronouncements (used over 2 millennia to confirm the advent of the last days & assorted other calamities)- sorta like the economists who have foretold 9 of the last 4 recessions! (eg  the beast hast been used to identify medieval emperors, popes, kaiser Wilhelm, Lenin, Hitler et all)

I've been reading R Crumbs wonderfully illustrated genesis - complete, word for word, no interpretations, and still amazed by the slavery, incest, murder, theft, deceit & other crimes blithely accepted because they were 'in service of the lord'.  an amusing illustration is the faces of the men hearing (at least twice) the lord's commandment requiring circumcision - worried, startled, bemused,... - basically "what - why this to define ourselves"?!?


819
We are working for the future. So the future belongs to artificial intelligence, and it does not need our tags.

guess you don't care about an income UNTIL AI takes over?
Income will now be with any tags. Therefore, it is better to direct your energy towards creating new content than adding optimal tags to existing content. As soon as stocks start using 100% artificial intelligence, tags will not be taken into account at all.
It's like before the start of mass production of cars, you could spend money on buying horses and carriages, or you could wait 1-3 years and buy cars.

how is AI going to know what city or country of the image? where a market is located?  tags will still assist AI in making an accurate assessment
Artificial intelligence for that and intelligence :). And where enough is filmed and the title is in the title. I'm not talking about the fact that all the places on the planet have already been filmed a million times, and artificial intelligence can determine this even without a name.

that's my point - it doesn't take AI to read metadata. so tags continue to be important -- but, as you say it is npossible for AI that recognizes Notre Dame even if it's not in the metadata

820
We are working for the future. So the future belongs to artificial intelligence, and it does not need our tags.

guess you don't care about an income UNTIL AI takes over?
Income will now be with any tags. Therefore, it is better to direct your energy towards creating new content than adding optimal tags to existing content. As soon as stocks start using 100% artificial intelligence, tags will not be taken into account at all.
It's like before the start of mass production of cars, you could spend money on buying horses and carriages, or you could wait 1-3 years and buy cars.

how is AI going to know what city or country of the image? where a market is located?  tags will still assist AI in making an accurate assessment

821
I'm suspecting strongly that some stupid incompetent  AI program is being employed on stockphoto sites to
accept/reject pics.
For example I submitted one video that was rejected because they didn't accept identifiable business logos or icons.
Fine with that except that my video was an animated abstract work that did not have any such thing at all.
I resubmitted it just to see if I would get the same reaction or reason for rejection.
This time it got accepted without any problems. Go figure. I can't.
I've had pics submitted on various sites only to be rejected.
Then I would submit them later on the same sites and have them accepted. Again go figure.
Once I submitted an image showing clearly a doll to one website to have it rejected.
Reason for this? No pic of identifiable person accepted without a model release form.
Since when does a Barbie doll need that in order to have it accepted?
Or does the AI have a problem discriminating the difference between doll and real person?
These type of rejections would be laughable or comical if it wasn't so annoying.
Anybody else have issues like this? I know it can't be just me.
If they are employing real humans instead then I don't know what to say.
Other than such people either have cerebral issues or vision problems.  :(

why this knee-jerk assumption of an evil AI that we keep seeing here? if it were an AI you'd get the same results each time

on SS i sometimes get the whole  batch rejected for some reason like noise or 'rasterization' - more likely a lazy reviewer - on resubmit they get accepted

822
Therefore, you can not spend any time on tags, their analysis, you can load without tags at all.

It would be extremely interesting if you are willing to do this experiment: always add a minimum amount of keywords (7) to your artworks and report you sales (or the absence of those) in a year.

and the keywords should have nothing to do with the image, otherwise results would be contaminated
...
I'm enjoying this. I should really play that game and add some inappropriate keywords to some new images and check after a period of time, only images that have downloads and see if any of those words, ever make a sale. That would surly change my mind about spamming keywords or adding words that normally no one else would use. So my racing images should always include, climate change, diversity and naked?
 
 ...
you may already have "extreme sports", danger

and, perhaps jokingly "environmental hazard/damage/etc", "gas guzzler" (965 images), "fossil fuels"
 

823
We are working for the future. So the future belongs to artificial intelligence, and it does not need our tags.

guess you don't care about an income UNTIL AI takes over?

824

 ...

SS interesting and useful as I have found what words people used to download the image. This one I found amusing. It has many downloads by the way.

    amelia
    52.6%
    earhart
    42.1%
    aviatrix
    5.3%
...

something we haven't considered is how the buyer found the image - did they go to SS directly? or did they find the image thru google?

for the latter, something is lost - searching for "amelia earhart aviatrix" and clicking on the SS image google found, the link google sent to SS is "https://www.shutterstock.com/search/aviatrix", losing the other words the user entered. (in this case the majority of images happened to be of AE, with a scattering of generic illustrations )

825
General - Top Sites / Re: Dall e 2 will make us all redundant?
« on: October 07, 2022, 13:41 »
...
The MTB cyclist was another good example, it doesn't know the wheel is an element on it's own so it included a sample of background from an images that didn't match the rest of the BG it created. It's like using content aware when filling in gaps in Photoshop, sometimes it samples (grabs) the wrong part of the image to fill in the gap but sometimes it grabs a section from the wrong part ands stands out like a sore thumb. The AI is grabbing multiple bits from thousands of images to create a new one. I'd imagine that's why the perspective at times looks off with the images they produce as the samples taken don't all have the same perspective and they have a wobbly look to them. If it had truly learnt how to draw a bike or skyscraper, the perspective would be consistent through the image rather than the Pablo Picasso look where the angles don't quite add up and it would not add a random bit of background to a wheel.

yes - and if you look at the rider there are many weird pieces - pasture or mtns on his back (the mtn actually can be mistaken for a daypack); the face is random bits

at present to make the DALLE bugs into features,  I REQUEST a Picasso effect

new raw set of MTB  (DALL-E has an annoying tendency to crop - and doesnt understand 'no cropping' etc in the input phrase


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