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Microstock Photography Forum - General => Off Topic => Topic started by: Microstockphoto on November 13, 2015, 19:49

Title: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 13, 2015, 19:49
It will never end, will it?

truly shocking, prayers for the people in Paris
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 100 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 13, 2015, 19:52
Dreadful.
Seems like it's over 100 from the Bataclan music venue alone, with more deaths at other locations.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 100 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 13, 2015, 19:57
140 dead reported already, 7 attacks all over Paris, apparently also attack at the stadium where there was a soccer match between france and germany. first curfew since 1944 in france
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cathyslife on November 13, 2015, 20:09
Oh no. I hadnt heard. I will go catch up.  :(
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cobalt on November 13, 2015, 20:21
It is horrible. The downside of globalization is that all kinds of local conflicts are now being carried across the globe.

This is exactly the kind of horror the people in Syria, Africa and many,many other places are running away from.

You canīt live a normal life if horrible people enjoy seeing you in pain and making you suffer.

How can we stand up to this and use intelligence instead of blind rage or falling into despair?

It is also directed against the refugees and anyone who wants to help them. They want to let them know they are never safe, that Europe canīt protect them.

They also know there will be a backlash against all muslims and the refugees and they welcome that because it can help them to recruit new people.

Normal people have to stay united against extremists.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: fritz on November 13, 2015, 20:21
Retweeted WikiLeaks (@wikileaks):
Over 140 killed in Paris attacks tonight by Islamic terrorism. Over 250,000 Syrians, Iraqis & Libyans killed. Not funny then. Not funny now.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 13, 2015, 20:21
More than 150 dead (RIP), borders closed, a national state of emergency in place. :(
I hope all Parisian members of MSG are ok and safe.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Digital66 on November 13, 2015, 20:58
Shocking... 

:(
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: marthamarks on November 13, 2015, 21:00
Prayers for all in Paris. Hope none of our MSG group was involved.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ACS on November 13, 2015, 21:03
It is horrible. The downside of globalization is that all kinds of local conflicts are now being carried across the globe.

This is exactly the kind of horror the people in Syria, Africa and many,many other places are running away from.

You canīt live a normal life if horrible people enjoy seeing you in pain and making you suffer.

How can we stand up to this and use intelligence instead of blind rage or falling into despair?

It is also directed against the refugees and anyone who wants to help them. They want to let them know they are never safe, that Europe canīt protect them.

They also know there will be a backlash against all muslims and the refugees and they welcome that because it can help them to recruit new people.

Normal people have to stay united against extremists.

.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 14, 2015, 04:29
It's a tragedy to see european people paying such a high price for the anti-european policies of their leaders. Unfortunately I can't say I'm surprised, it will only get worse until people wake up and bring down the traitors. Stop the boats and deport muslims. Stop meddling in other countries' business uninvited and stop teaching cultural marxism to our children. People like to live in a plastic bubble - but war is coming to Europe unless EU breaks apart.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cobalt on November 14, 2015, 04:47
It's a tragedy to see european people paying such a high price for the anti-european policies of their leaders. Unfortunately I can't say I'm surprised, it will only get worse until people wake up and bring down the traitors. Stop the boats and deport muslims.

...

If the refugess all mass convert to christianity, judaism and buddhism, would you then let them in??

Donīt worry, ISIS hates all normal muslims much more than the Europeans or the West. The Muslims are their first target because they see them all as heretics.

The attacks in Beirut and Europe are happening because they are really losing a lot of ground in Syria and Irak. The Russians have made a real difference with their attacks.

Many ISIs fighters are deserting, the most brutal gang in the world is no longer "cool" if you are losing. They are very worried about their public image, that is why they actually have professional film makers involved when they arrange the murdering of hostages and make it as cruel as possible for maximum shock effect.

Attacking soft targets like in Paris or Beirut is a huge PR campaign they can sell as a great success to their own fighters and also get the money machine growing again and they will take in millions from crazy people across the globe.

Nothing is so useful to generate money as religion and war. Oldest business in the world.

An attack like this is an attack on all human values. And it is done to make money. War is a much bigger business than drugs.


They are criminals with professional international networks and have to be hunted and targeted like the drug gangs. We have to stand together and become more united, not allow them to divide us.

Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Zero Talent on November 14, 2015, 05:36


.... and deport muslims.

And while you are at it,  why not deporting Jews and Gipsies.
Oooh wait, Hitler already tried it before you.



Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: alijaber on November 14, 2015, 05:48

Donīt worry, ISIS hates all normal muslims much more than the Europeans or the West. The Muslims are their first target because they see them all as heretics.

The attacks in Beirut and Europe are happening because they are really losing a lot of ground in Syria and Irak. The Russians have made a real difference with their attacks.


Completely true. I'm in Beirut by the way and I witnessed many suicide attacks last 2 years.
It was European leaders fault to let Gulf states and Turkey gather and fund all those terrorists from all around the world in Syria to took down the Regime there..
It's not a refugee danger only, hundreds of French men (thousands from other European countries) fought in Syria and get back to France. They are there and well trained, sadly: these attacks can be repeated at any time, anywhere..
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 14, 2015, 06:06
Secret Pentagon Report Reveals US "Created" ISIS As A "Tool" To Overthrow Syria's President Assad
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-05-23/secret-pentagon-report-reveals-us-created-isis-tool-overthrow-syrias-president-assad (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-05-23/secret-pentagon-report-reveals-us-created-isis-tool-overthrow-syrias-president-assad)

Ex-US Intelligence Officials Confirm: Secret Pentagon Report Proves US Complicity In Creation Of ISIS
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-06-08/ex-us-intelligence-officials-confirm-secret-pentagon-report-proves-us-complicity-cre (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-06-08/ex-us-intelligence-officials-confirm-secret-pentagon-report-proves-us-complicity-cre)

Officials Admit ISIS, Like Al-Qaeda, Was A Creation Of US Foreign Policy
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-08-17/officials-admit-isis-al-qaeda-was-creation-us-foreign-policy (http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-08-17/officials-admit-isis-al-qaeda-was-creation-us-foreign-policy)


It's no secret that US, Israel, Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar funded the "moderate terrorists" who became ISIS.

Answering your question, no I wouldn't take them anyway. If you consider all the costs involved in housing, food, benefits, education, healthcare and also the inevitable symptoms like crime wave, housing bubble, ethnic and religious tension, you realize it's unsustainable even for the wealthiest country. The least european leaders should do is to consult their people with national referendums if they agree on taking immigrants permanently. Aren't we supposed to live in a democracy?

If you want to help, fund asylum camps for real refugees in Turkey, Jordan and Lebanon. Stop bombing non-aligned countries would be more effective though and we wouldn't even have a crisis if Saddam, Gaddaffi and Assad were left alone. In a way, europeans are also responsible for electing the same mainstream parties over and over again.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 14, 2015, 13:49
The latest:
"The Paris prosecutor says that 129 people were killed and 352 people were injured, with at least 99 still in critical condition. Seven terrorists have died following their actions."
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Noedelhap on November 14, 2015, 14:08
Such a sad night and day.

I was in Paris last summer and I absolutely loved the city. Even though the Charlie Hebdo attacks took place there (including a prevented attack on a Thalys train headed to Paris) earlier this year, we decided to go anyway, knowing that it could happen again at any time. Despite that feeling in the back of our heads, we had a wonderful vacation.

And now it did happen again after all. To see hundreds of Parisians falling victim to a bunch of crazy religious fanatics is beyond tragic.
I can only hope that IS won't strike elsewhere, but our leaders should now take action immediately to destroy IS once and for all.

It turns out that one of the perpetrators of last night's attacks was a 'refugee' who came into Europe via Greece. It's our worst nightmare come true.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Firewall on November 14, 2015, 16:22
I'm very sorry this happened but it is hardly surprising, it was bound to happen sooner or later. With the influx of Syrian migrants it is no surprise there are terrorists amongst them, despite reassurances from the European politicians. It seems 2 of the terrorists in Paris came in through Greece.
There is a reason why the Gulf countries refuse to open their countries for Syrians.
I spent some days at a Syrian refugee camp in Jordan, before I really thought it was great we can help them and I truly am sorry to say that I left disillusioned to say the least.
For instance, they receive good quality UNHCR tents, after a while they receive housing from the Jordanian government, and these people sell, yes they sell their tents to poor Jordanians instead of giving it it to people in need. You should also see what they buy in supermarkets, top quality products, they won't settle for less. You see the same pattern in Europe where these people complain about not having a tv or good housing or break into a house just to watch tv for instance and they don't ask, they demand things. You should also see the footage from the Hungarian police where migrants throw away food and water that was given to them. They really give migrants a bad name.
Let me just say that Syrians are not very popular in Jordan, and there are 2 million of them there.
The attacks in Paris, Beirut and the downing of the Metrojet flight has nothing to do with religion, they are the work of terrorists under the name of a religion.
Sadly Paris won't be the last...
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 14, 2015, 16:34
They were in no way related to refugees.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 14, 2015, 16:49
Solidarity with Paris and no chance for terrorism and racism!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Firewall on November 14, 2015, 16:52
They were in no way related to refugees.
2 of them were registered as such
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 14, 2015, 17:00
They were in no way related to refugees.
2 of them were registered as such

Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Firewall on November 14, 2015, 17:06
They were in no way related to refugees.
2 of them were registered as such

Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.
I'd suggest you read my earlier post and that's the last I'll post about this.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 14, 2015, 17:08
They were in no way related to refugees.
2 of them were registered as such

Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.
that's the last I'll post about this.

Thx!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 14, 2015, 17:16
They were no more refugees - or Muslims - than I'm a fish if I swim in the sea.

So-called IS may have seen the easy way to panic receiving countries by having false refugees staging attacks, to make it more difficult for people to escape from their strongholds.

What I would like to know (but I wouldn't like endless speculation and theories) is where all their money is coming from, and indeed from where they get their weapons. Many of our countries have dirty hands in the arms trade.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: PixelBytes on November 14, 2015, 17:38
I don't know what is the truth of all the politics involve, but this tragidy makes me very sad, and my thoughts and prayers go to the French people for the terrible losses they are suffering.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Noedelhap on November 14, 2015, 17:57
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such


Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97 (http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 14, 2015, 18:05
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such


Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


gee, so IS has gone out of microstock and into this sort of business, huh?

seriously, i don't think it is even worth discussing this, as that is what these sorts thrive on...
the more publicity they get, the most it perpetuates their "control".
other than like pbytes say, condolence to the french public affected,
the rest is just plain blatant politics.
it's just one sect using another sect as a scapegoat to push the arms deal further ahead.
no one wins except those who supply the arms. and you can bet, as history taught us,
the same people who supply the arms are the same people who claim to come out to save the world.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 14, 2015, 18:05
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such


Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.




You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


And one from them was from france. So what?
Its no refugee issue its an terrorism issue.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Sean Locke Photography on November 14, 2015, 18:29
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such

Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


And one from them was from france. So what?
Its no refugee issue its an terrorism issue.


You seem to be missing the point that they are hiding as refugees in the crowd.  Denying in wont make it true.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Noedelhap on November 14, 2015, 18:50
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such


Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.




You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


And one from them was from france. So what?
Its no refugee issue its an terrorism issue.


I'm just stating a fact. You said someone was talking nonsense, I'm backing him up. I don't want to discuss the refugee crisis in detail, but there's nothing wrong with giving some background information.

However, I think facts like these becomes relevant when it turns out the protection of our European borders is insufficient. Especially when ISIS is apparently using the crisis as a means to infiltrate into Europe and carry out attacks on European soil.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ACS on November 14, 2015, 18:54

Quote
Its no refugee issue its an terrorism issue.

.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 14, 2015, 18:55
The perpetrators of 9/11 didn't need a refugee crisis, nor did the Lockerbie bomber/s, nor have many other terrorists over the years.
They will get in any which way; if that fails they'll will radicalise a country's own citizens.
Hitler showed us how easy it is to indoctrinate and mobilise previously very reasonable people, by a potent mixture of persuasion and coercion.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: fritz on November 14, 2015, 20:04
Yesterday US president had speech about France and this must be the most hypocritical speech ever heard! After all, recently, the United States has attacked or invaded six countries -- Iraq, Afghanistan, and Libya using ground troops or manned aircraft and Pakistan, Yemen, and Somalia using unpiloted drone aircraft dropping bombs. ...  Sadly Eu countries are just US satellites trying to please the Obama administration which is turning hypocrisy and double standards into an art form!
 I'm not anti-american, I'm just talking about hypocritical is soft word for US foreign policy which is the ROOT of most problems in the world.
 I don't like politics, at the end its all a matter of money(American money).

(https://scontent-vie1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/12240060_999228356836885_7158890443897227293_n.jpg?oh=f34b5100867c2375f055ab2f20dfa43c&oe=56BF4A62)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: YadaYadaYada on November 14, 2015, 21:19
Nice photo fritz who are those people? When were they in power? Who's been in the White House for the last two terms? Who ran the country for the 8 years before that, 1993 - 2001? 9/11 was 2001 remember, when Clin-toon was in power.? Doesn't Obama count or is he just a puppet until the next election?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 14, 2015, 22:05
9/11 was 2001 remember, when Clin-toon was in power.?

POI: GWBush was US president at the time of 9/11.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: PeterChigmaroff on November 15, 2015, 00:21
The refugee crisis is just a vehicle. It's a bus for these callous murderers. You can stop the buses from running, but it isn't the only transport to get into whichever country they want. It's convenient.  But don't think for second that if you cut off all immigration that there are no other means of access.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: DallasP on November 15, 2015, 00:48
They were no more refugees - or Muslims - than I'm a fish if I swim in the sea.

So-called IS has seen the easy way to panic receiving countries by having false refugees staging attacks, to make it more difficult for people to escape from their strongholds.

What I would like to know (but I wouldn't like endless speculation and theories) is where all their money is coming from, and indeed from where they get their weapons. Many of our countries have dirty hands in the arms trade.

Dirty hands indeed.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 15, 2015, 02:43
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such

Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


And one from them was from france. So what?
Its no refugee issue its an terrorism issue.


You seem to be missing the point that they are hiding as refugees in the crowd.  Denying in wont make it true.


I not denying that fact. But do you thinking when we close the border for refugees the terrorists dont come in?
We can stop all immigration and the terror will find another way. We have to make better politics or to keep them homelands save. Thats kills terror. We have to fight the cause not the symptomes.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: topol on November 15, 2015, 04:15
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such

Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


And one from them was from france. So what?
Its no refugee issue its an terrorism issue.


You seem to be missing the point that they are hiding as refugees in the crowd.  Denying in wont make it true.


I not denying that fact. But do you thinking when we close the border for refugees the terrorists dont come in?
We can stop all immigration and the terror will find another way. We have to make better politics or to keep them homelands save. Thats kills terror. We have to fight the cause not the symptomes.


Yes, there always was a terrorist threat looming... and your solution seems to be making the entry for as many terrorists as possible, as easy possible by letting  huge crowds people march through country borders basically unchecked. Bravoooo...
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: topol on November 15, 2015, 04:29

 The downside of globalization is that all kinds of local conflicts are now being carried across the globe.


aaahh... c'mon, that's nonsense. Europe or any other developed area could easily close itself down and only let trade / people in who are thoroughly checked / screened. It wouldn't even halt tourism that much if done properly. The only reason we are such an easy target is because the leadership is severely corrupt, easily bought & payed to do things that wrecks the average person's life, if it won't mess theirs up. Merkel's completely undemocratic, tyrannical forcing of 100's of thousands of migrants on the German people is the prime example right now. It's complete brainless nonsense, it's against the interest of the country and Europe except for a very few selected people.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 15, 2015, 04:47
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such

Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


And one from them was from france. So what?
Its no refugee issue its an terrorism issue.


You seem to be missing the point that they are hiding as refugees in the crowd.  Denying in wont make it true.


I not denying that fact. But do you thinking when we close the border for refugees the terrorists dont come in?
We can stop all immigration and the terror will find another way. We have to make better politics or to keep them homelands save. Thats kills terror. We have to fight the cause not the symptomes.


Yes, there always was a terrorist threat looming... and your solution seems to be making the entry for as many terrorists as possible, as easy possible by letting  huge crowds people march through country borders basically unchecked. Bravoooo...


The two are registred and does it helped?
What do you want to do with terrorists that have a france passport closing borders ? ;D
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: topol on November 15, 2015, 05:10
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such

Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


And one from them was from france. So what?
Its no refugee issue its an terrorism issue.


You seem to be missing the point that they are hiding as refugees in the crowd.  Denying in wont make it true.


I not denying that fact. But do you thinking when we close the border for refugees the terrorists dont come in?
We can stop all immigration and the terror will find another way. We have to make better politics or to keep them homelands save. Thats kills terror. We have to fight the cause not the symptomes.


Yes, there always was a terrorist threat looming... and your solution seems to be making the entry for as many terrorists as possible, as easy possible by letting  huge crowds people march through country borders basically unchecked. Bravoooo...


The two are registred and does it helped?
What do you want to do with terrorists that have a france passport closing borders ? ;D


I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cobalt on November 15, 2015, 05:27
The polarization is also drawing out aggressive right wing extremists. In my city our new mayor was stabbed one day before her election. It will be weeks before she can get to work. His justification: he wanted to protect the children of Cologne from Syrian refugees.

He is a german citizen, unemployed, never showed up on the police radar before, although he joined a neonazi group when he was younger.

He just followed the news and decided to take a kitchen knife and attack a politician and several people around her at an open food market not far from me.

I live in one of the most tolerant cities of Germany, it was completly unexpected.

How do you prevent attacks like this?

And then you have terrorist organization who have become very good at radicalising local people over the internet and encourage people to just attack. Lone wolf attacks without being part of an official organisation.

How do they convince young women to leave their families and go to Syria to become "wives" for the soldiers?

Or all the others leaving Europe to go and die and commit horrible murders like jihadi john.

However, sects that brainwash people are nothing new. What is new is how professionally this is organized and how far this can reach via the internet and global travel.

I believe in following the money trail. All that oil money from the oil fields in irak, money from drugs in Afghanistan and putting extreme pressure, or boycotts on Saudi Arabia until they stamp out the radicals in their country. I absolutely donīt understand why such an extreme dictatorship is being considered an "ally".

But most of all, we cannot just go back to living and worrying only about our own countries, globalisation and the internet networks mean we are truly one single planet, borders and countries are becoming irrelevant.

We need to embrace the global reality, we canīt turn the time back.

Conflicts, climate change etc...are no longer local, they affect us everywhere.

Eta: I read a lot of comments on the New YorkTimes and social networks demanding a quick military solution. "Bomb them back into the stone age / use nuclear bombs"

However this will kill thousands of civilians and among the survivors you create thousands of new terrorists. While the masterminds will just slip away like water and move on to the next country. There is no simple, quick solution.

We also have to engage in nation building and bringing jobs to far away places, just to protect ourselves, even if this is crazy. Bringing education and knowledge to far away places, via the internet,student exchange etc...it is a very slow process.

The world needs good thinkers and very clever diplomacy, not more war machine. People who can envision peace for generations, not short drama for their reelection campaign. Logic instead of emotions.

Tactical military strikes to take out military stromgholds, but not mass bombardement or indiscriminate sanctions that withold medication etc...all those children that died in irak because of extreme sanctions and Madeleine Albright then saying on TV "they died for a good cause".
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 06:48

I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.

Let's not jump with conclusions, 2 passports could be stolen too....who knows...
Maybe those 2 were not terrorists at the time they entered Greece so additional screening would be pointless (not to mention impossible, as Lesbos island for sure doesn't have capacity for it!!!). But, once treated how they were treated they became an easy targets for ISIS. Without hope and money, vulnerable and weak in every sense, many disappointed in life, Europe and there we go... offered money to blown themselves up and they just did it.

Refugees are escaping the same (actually much worse) that we just saw in Paris.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cobalt on November 15, 2015, 07:34
In Norway Brevik was a lonely crazy young man who used right wing extremists fake reasons to kill students.

Mostly it is lonely young men that can be radicalised and either out of themselves or with a few friends commit horrible things. For me this includes the school shootings etc...

Frustrated, lonely, disconnected from the world around them. Societies with high unemployment and low propspects for a good future have in proportion many more than countries with good quality life. But we still have enough frustrated young men that can be radicalised by extremists radical ideologies or religions.

So how do you reach out to them before they kill?

Most of the attackers in France where known to the French authorities and it was clear they had the potential to kill. But you cannot simply lock them up...just in case...there are too many people and in a democratic country you can't do this.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 08:20
...
Most of the attackers in France where known to the French authorities and it was clear they had the potential to kill. But you cannot simply lock them up...just in case...there are too many people and in a democratic country you can't do this.

French intelligence service FAILED badly!

Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Firewall on November 15, 2015, 10:26
So nobody cares about the bombings in Beirut 1 day earlier huh?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 15, 2015, 11:08
This thread taught me that radical islam fundamentalists who are lonely and sad men as well risked their lives in the Mediterranean sea just so they can throw it away in Paris for money offered that they will never see anyway.
Sounds right.
If thats the manner in which we deal with these things as westerners then to hell with Europe
and to hell with the west.
Which are the only certainties in our present.
And not because of Islam...
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cobalt on November 15, 2015, 11:12
Of course, but attacks in Beirut, Damascus or Bagdad are not unexpected. The whole region is an unstable civil war zone.

Paris,London and New York are not known to be at war, an attack there is something new.

Moreover these are truly global cities probably visited by over a billion people have once in their life visited them, studied or worked there.

They are places millions of people around the world dream to move to, places we believe you can live safely and in peace.

More people around the world have some kind of emotional connection to Paris, than to Damascus or large cities in Africa that also have many attacks and violence.

The terrorists know this, an attack there will get them more attention and a lot more money from their supporters than an attack in Beirut.

If we do get monthly attacks in France, it wonīt be front page news anymore. That is just the way media works.

Even in the Middle East many people are more shocked about attacks in Paris or London than at home. Especially, if they have sent their children to school or to study there, hoping they have sent them to a safe place.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: topol on November 15, 2015, 11:51

I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.

Let's not jump with conclusions, 2 passports could be stolen too....who knows...
Maybe those 2 were not terrorists at the time they entered Greece so additional screening would be pointless (not to mention impossible, as Lesbos island for sure doesn't have capacity for it!!!). But, once treated how they were treated they became an easy targets for ISIS. Without hope and money, vulnerable and weak in every sense, many disappointed in life, Europe and there we go... offered money to blown themselves up and they just did it.

Refugees are escaping the same (actually much worse) that we just saw in Paris.

That's not up for debate anymore, 3 of these terrorists came in with recent migrant surge, fingerprints were identified.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 12:12

I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.

Let's not jump with conclusions, 2 passports could be stolen too....who knows...
Maybe those 2 were not terrorists at the time they entered Greece so additional screening would be pointless (not to mention impossible, as Lesbos island for sure doesn't have capacity for it!!!). But, once treated how they were treated they became an easy targets for ISIS. Without hope and money, vulnerable and weak in every sense, many disappointed in life, Europe and there we go... offered money to blown themselves up and they just did it.

Refugees are escaping the same (actually much worse) that we just saw in Paris.

That's not up for debate anymore, 3 of these terrorists came in with recent migrant surge, fingerprints were identified.

I have no idea where do you get your news. But what you just said HAS NOT being said anywhere in media. Only one suicide bomber might be a "refugee".
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: topol on November 15, 2015, 12:31

I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.

Let's not jump with conclusions, 2 passports could be stolen too....who knows...
Maybe those 2 were not terrorists at the time they entered Greece so additional screening would be pointless (not to mention impossible, as Lesbos island for sure doesn't have capacity for it!!!). But, once treated how they were treated they became an easy targets for ISIS. Without hope and money, vulnerable and weak in every sense, many disappointed in life, Europe and there we go... offered money to blown themselves up and they just did it.

Refugees are escaping the same (actually much worse) that we just saw in Paris.

That's not up for debate anymore, 3 of these terrorists came in with recent migrant surge, fingerprints were identified.

I have no idea where do you get your news. But what you just said HAS NOT being said anywhere in media. Only one suicide bomber might be a "refugee".

Clueless? Cnn, afp, resuters - many. Three fake recent turkish passports, ferry ticket from greece... btw, even one would be too many.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 12:36

I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.

Let's not jump with conclusions, 2 passports could be stolen too....who knows...
Maybe those 2 were not terrorists at the time they entered Greece so additional screening would be pointless (not to mention impossible, as Lesbos island for sure doesn't have capacity for it!!!). But, once treated how they were treated they became an easy targets for ISIS. Without hope and money, vulnerable and weak in every sense, many disappointed in life, Europe and there we go... offered money to blown themselves up and they just did it.

Refugees are escaping the same (actually much worse) that we just saw in Paris.

That's not up for debate anymore, 3 of these terrorists came in with recent migrant surge, fingerprints were identified.

I have no idea where do you get your news. But what you just said HAS NOT being said anywhere in media. Only one suicide bomber might be a "refugee".

Clueless? Cnn, afp, resuters - many. Three fake recent turkish passports, ferry ticket from greece... btw, even one would be too many.

Could you please copy and paste a link (CNN, AFP...)  where anyone said 3 of 8 terrorists were refugees?

Let's not jump into conclusions and called refugees terrorists here, please!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 15, 2015, 12:40
In this moment the german home secretary is talking in german tv. He said there is only one syrian passport found.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: topol on November 15, 2015, 13:03

I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.


Let's not jump with conclusions, 2 passports could be stolen too....who knows...
Maybe those 2 were not terrorists at the time they entered Greece so additional screening would be pointless (not to mention impossible, as Lesbos island for sure doesn't have capacity for it!!!). But, once treated how they were treated they became an easy targets for ISIS. Without hope and money, vulnerable and weak in every sense, many disappointed in life, Europe and there we go... offered money to blown themselves up and they just did it.

Refugees are escaping the same (actually much worse) that we just saw in Paris.


That's not up for debate anymore, 3 of these terrorists came in with recent migrant surge, fingerprints were identified.


I have no idea where do you get your news. But what you just said HAS NOT being said anywhere in media. Only one suicide bomber might be a "refugee".


Clueless? Cnn, afp, resuters - many. Three fake recent turkish passports, ferry ticket from greece... btw, even one would be too many.


Could you please copy and paste a link (CNN, AFP...)  where anyone said 3 of 8 terrorists were refugees?

Let's not jump into conclusions and called refugees terrorists here, please!


http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/15/world/paris-attacks/index.html (http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/15/world/paris-attacks/index.html)

Don't put words into my mouth (ever) I didn't call any refugees terrorists, I said they hide among them. I actually never even wrote refugees, since they are migrants, coming from turkey  - where there is no war.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 13:25

I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.


Let's not jump with conclusions, 2 passports could be stolen too....who knows...
Maybe those 2 were not terrorists at the time they entered Greece so additional screening would be pointless (not to mention impossible, as Lesbos island for sure doesn't have capacity for it!!!). But, once treated how they were treated they became an easy targets for ISIS. Without hope and money, vulnerable and weak in every sense, many disappointed in life, Europe and there we go... offered money to blown themselves up and they just did it.

Refugees are escaping the same (actually much worse) that we just saw in Paris.


That's not up for debate anymore, 3 of these terrorists came in with recent migrant surge, fingerprints were identified.


I have no idea where do you get your news. But what you just said HAS NOT being said anywhere in media. Only one suicide bomber might be a "refugee".


Clueless? Cnn, afp, resuters - many. Three fake recent turkish passports, ferry ticket from greece... btw, even one would be too many.


Could you please copy and paste a link (CNN, AFP...)  where anyone said 3 of 8 terrorists were refugees?

Let's not jump into conclusions and called refugees terrorists here, please!


[url]http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/15/world/paris-attacks/index.html[/url] ([url]http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/15/world/paris-attacks/index.html[/url])

Don't put words into my mouth (ever) I didn't call any refugees terrorists, I said they hide among them. I actually never even wrote refugees, since they are migrants, coming from turkey  - where there is no war.


Ok you didn't directly call refugees terrorist, but you did previously say that 3 out of 8 entered EU as refugees, which is NOT true!!!

This link you provided is also talking about only ONE terrorist ...

"...One of three bombers who detonated themselves at the Stade de France late Friday arrived on the Greek island of Leros on October 3 among numerous Syrian refugees, Amanpour reported, citing an unnamed French senator who was briefed by the Ministry of the Interior."


Let the investigation finish their job and get those criminals involved punish!


Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cobalt on November 15, 2015, 13:43
The terrorists have enough people with european or us passports and enough money to take a plane to go wherever they like. Isis is taking in over 1 million dollars a day just from selling syrian oil.

Their people donīt need to treck across europe in sandals with babies.

Much easier to go the legal route.

Ask yourself, why Greece hasnīt had extremist attacks although they have been flooded for years with refugees.

Besides, they donīt want the people to leave Syria or Irak. They want them to stay so they can rule over them. Many refugees also risk having their families killed if they flee. They really are sitting between all fires.


But increasing the fear of muslims and refugees is exactly what they want. More discrimination against muslims, more money and fighters from frustrated people for them.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: PeterChigmaroff on November 15, 2015, 13:50
The terrorists have enough people with european or us passports and enough money to take a plane to go wherever they like. Isis is taking in over 1 million dollars a day just from selling syrian oil.

Their people donīt need to treck across europe in sandals with babies.

Much easier to go the legal route.

Ask yourself, why Greece hasnīt had extremist attacks although they have been flooded for years with refugees.
I totally agree, the refugees hide terrorists argument is perfect for those opposed to immigration. Just like Donald Trump standing on his high horse bellowing out the need to arm the entire population of the world with guns. MORE GUNS, that would fix this problem.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 15, 2015, 13:55
The terrorists have enough people with european or us passports and enough money to take a plane to go wherever they like. Isis is taking in over 1 million dollars a day just from selling syrian oil.

Their people donīt need to treck across europe in sandals with babies.

Much easier to go the legal route.

Ask yourself, why Greece hasnīt had extremist attacks although they have been flooded for years with refugees.
I totally agree, the refugees hide terrorists argument is perfect for those opposed to immigration. Just like Donald Trump standing on his high horse bellowing out the need to arm the entire population of the world with guns. MORE GUNS, that would fix this problem.

Totaly agree thank you cobalt and zeus!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 13:56
The terrorists have enough people with european or us passports and enough money to take a plane to go wherever they like. Isis is taking in over 1 million dollars a day just from selling syrian oil.

Their people donīt need to treck across europe in sandals with babies.

Much easier to go the legal route.

Ask yourself, why Greece hasnīt had extremist attacks although they have been flooded for years with refugees.
I totally agree, the refugees hide terrorists argument is perfect for those opposed to immigration. Just like Donald Trump standing on his high horse bellowing out the need to arm the entire population of the world with guns. MORE GUNS, that would fix this problem.

Thank you both, well said!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: topol on November 15, 2015, 15:27
The terrorists have enough people with european or us passports and enough money to take a plane to go wherever they like. Isis is taking in over 1 million dollars a day just from selling syrian oil.

Their people donīt need to treck across europe in sandals with babies.

Much easier to go the legal route.

Ask yourself, why Greece hasnīt had extremist attacks although they have been flooded for years with refugees.

Besides, they donīt want the people to leave Syria or Irak. They want them to stay so they can rule over them. Many refugees also risk having their families killed if they flee. They really are sitting between all fires.


But increasing the fear of muslims and refugees is exactly what they want. More discrimination against muslims, more money and fighters from frustrated people for them.

Yes, and those people are suspect to be tracked by intel agencies already, so the opportunity for getting more fresh ones in with the unmanageable torrent of migrants is just about perfect.

..and anyway the fact that there are people around, who seem to be hell bent on denying that the migrant torrent from terrorist prone areas is a huge security threat, is just mindblowing... it's just one of thsoe WTH moments.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: topol on November 15, 2015, 15:30

I'm sorry, what are talking about? That "registration" wasn't even a quarter of a measure, it was sad joke. The doors to Europe were kicked open from the inside in the most extreme way possible. Actually it was so extreme they were rushing to transport people in before there was time screen them. Just complete lunacy.


Let's not jump with conclusions, 2 passports could be stolen too....who knows...
Maybe those 2 were not terrorists at the time they entered Greece so additional screening would be pointless (not to mention impossible, as Lesbos island for sure doesn't have capacity for it!!!). But, once treated how they were treated they became an easy targets for ISIS. Without hope and money, vulnerable and weak in every sense, many disappointed in life, Europe and there we go... offered money to blown themselves up and they just did it.

Refugees are escaping the same (actually much worse) that we just saw in Paris.


That's not up for debate anymore, 3 of these terrorists came in with recent migrant surge, fingerprints were identified.


I have no idea where do you get your news. But what you just said HAS NOT being said anywhere in media. Only one suicide bomber might be a "refugee".


Clueless? Cnn, afp, resuters - many. Three fake recent turkish passports, ferry ticket from greece... btw, even one would be too many.


Could you please copy and paste a link (CNN, AFP...)  where anyone said 3 of 8 terrorists were refugees?

Let's not jump into conclusions and called refugees terrorists here, please!


[url]http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/15/world/paris-attacks/index.html[/url] ([url]http://edition.cnn.com/2015/11/15/world/paris-attacks/index.html[/url])

Don't put words into my mouth (ever) I didn't call any refugees terrorists, I said they hide among them. I actually never even wrote refugees, since they are migrants, coming from turkey  - where there is no war.


Ok you didn't directly call refugees terrorist, but you did previously say that 3 out of 8 entered EU as refugees, which is NOT true!!!

This link you provided is also talking about only ONE terrorist ...

"...One of three bombers who detonated themselves at the Stade de France late Friday arrived on the Greek island of Leros on October 3 among numerous Syrian refugees, Amanpour reported, citing an unnamed French senator who was briefed by the Ministry of the Interior."


Let the investigation finish their job and get those criminals involved punish!


if you have been following the migrant crisis for more than 5 minutes you may know that (fake) syrian / (fake) turkish passports pretty much equals migrants, but since that's not 100% scientific proof, they don't want to say it loud.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gbalex on November 15, 2015, 15:35
However, sects that brainwash people are nothing new. What is new is how professionally this is organized and how far this can reach via the internet and global travel.

I believe in following the money trail. All that oil money from the oil fields in irak, money from drugs in Afghanistan and putting extreme pressure, or boycotts on Saudi Arabia until they stamp out the radicals in their country. I absolutely donīt understand why such an extreme dictatorship is being considered an "ally".

But most of all, we cannot just go back to living and worrying only about our own countries, globalisation and the internet networks mean we are truly one single planet, borders and countries are becoming irrelevant.

We need to embrace the global reality, we canīt turn the time back.

Conflicts, climate change etc...are no longer local, they affect us everywhere.

Eta: I read a lot of comments on the New YorkTimes and social networks demanding a quick military solution. "Bomb them back into the stone age / use nuclear bombs"

However this will kill thousands of civilians and among the survivors you create thousands of new terrorists. While the masterminds will just slip away like water and move on to the next country. There is no simple, quick solution.

We also have to engage in nation building and bringing jobs to far away places, just to protect ourselves, even if this is crazy. Bringing education and knowledge to far away places, via the internet,student exchange etc...it is a very slow process.

The world needs good thinkers and very clever diplomacy, not more war machine. People who can envision peace for generations, not short drama for their reelection campaign. Logic instead of emotions.

Tactical military strikes to take out military stromgholds, but not mass bombardement or indiscriminate sanctions that withold medication etc...all those children that died in irak because of extreme sanctions and Madeleine Albright then saying on TV "they died for a good cause".

You made some very good points in this post and others and I agree. The war machine makes it easy to radicalize those who have been ravaged by war.

The terrorist struck two blows with recent attacks, they are actively seeking division by means of stigmatizing & vilifying refugees who could later become new recruits. Hitler and friends would approve.

Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: stuttershock on November 15, 2015, 15:47
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such


Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


while these details may or may not be true, quoting Reuters, OF ALL "SOURCES", to kind-a "prove" something to be a fact is a very bad idea: Reuters is an integral -- as in very central! -- part of that group of global companies that those "suppliers of arms" (quoted elsewhere in this thread) belong to.

Just saying...
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 17:02
They were in no way related to refugees.

2 of them were registered as such


Syriens that escaped from IS do attacks in the name of IS?
Please stop talking nonsense.


You don't seem to understand. At least two of the perpetrators were posing as refugees in order to gain access to Europe, but they were in fact IS fighters. It's a fact. They came in by boat via Greece and were actually registered there as refugee.

[url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url] ([url]http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/11/14/us-france-shooting-greece-idUSKCN0T312W20151114#ZWXWb3Yt8sAkXiqm.97[/url])


while these details may or may not be true, quoting Reuters, OF ALL "SOURCES", to kind-a "prove" something to be a fact is a very bad idea: Reuters is an integral -- as in very central! -- part of that group of global companies that those "suppliers of arms" (quoted elsewhere in this thread) belong to.

Just saying...


Amen!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 15, 2015, 17:07
Even if 99,99% of freebie seekers are not terrorists, they certainly commit a hell lot of crime especially rape, sexual harassment and robbery. They will never show this on the mainstream media obviously, but there are tons of data available.

Germany: Leaked police report reveal that 38,000 Muslim “asylum seekers” committed 100 crimes per day in 2014
Imagine what's like in 2015 with 400% more illegals. When you take Germany away from the germans, the natural reaction is nationalism. It's a matter of survival, either you fight back or you're conquered. Common sense is coming back to Europe though, Poland and Latvia already said they won't take muslims anymore. Eurosceptic anti immigration parties will gain strength across Europe because people are tired of EU failure.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 15, 2015, 17:30
Even if 99,99% of freebie seekers are not terrorists, they certainly commit a hell lot of crime especially rape, sexual harassment and robbery. They will never show this on the mainstream media obviously, but there are tons of data available.

Germany: Leaked police report reveal that 38,000 Muslim “asylum seekers” committed 100 crimes per day in 2014
Imagine what's like in 2015 with 400% more illegals. When you take Germany away from the germans, the natural reaction is nationalism. It's a matter of survival, either you fight back or you're conquered. Common sense is coming back to Europe though, Poland and Latvia already said they won't take muslims anymore. Eurosceptic anti immigration parties will gain strength across Europe because people are tired of EU failure.
But Latvia and Poland take the money from the EU. In my view they should get no penny from the EU if they dont want to take refugees.

And what is this mysterious leaked police report?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 15, 2015, 17:34
I hope EU stop funding them too, so they'll have another reason to leave this mess.

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave (http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: dirkr on November 15, 2015, 17:45
I hope EU stop funding them too, so they'll have another reason to leave this mess.

[url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url] ([url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url])


Look at the source of that "information".
And then tell me what you believe.
Has nothing to do with reality in Germany.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 15, 2015, 17:59
Even if 99,99% of freebie seekers are not terrorists, they certainly commit a hell lot of crime especially rape, sexual harassment and robbery. They will never show this on the mainstream media obviously, but there are tons of data available.

Germany: Leaked police report reveal that 38,000 Muslim “asylum seekers” committed 100 crimes per day in 2014
Imagine what's like in 2015 with 400% more illegals. When you take Germany away from the germans, the natural reaction is nationalism. It's a matter of survival, either you fight back or you're conquered. Common sense is coming back to Europe though, Poland and Latvia already said they won't take muslims anymore. Eurosceptic anti immigration parties will gain strength across Europe because people are tired of EU failure.


I can only find a few online examples of that 'leaked police report', apparently emanating from the Gatestone Institute.
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave (http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave)
According to a Wikipedia article, whose impartiality is under question, the Gatestone Institute "describes itself as a "non-partisan, not-for-profit international policy council and think tank is dedicated to educating the public about what the mainstream media fails to report." The organization believes that traditional news outlets conduct insufficient and, as a result, misleading reporting on critical issues, and thus it distributes its own information about events in the Middle East and Muslim populations in other parts of the world."

I have never heard of it, however RightWeb, an arm of the Institute for Policy Studies (allegedly 'left wing' but I know nothing about it either)
"The Gatestone Institute is a New York-based advocacy organization that is tied to neoconservative and other right-wing networks in the United States and Europe.[1] Chaired by John Bolton, a former Bush administration diplomat and a conservative foreign policy hardliner, Gatestone is a clearinghouse for right-wing commentaries on national security, the Middle East, and Islam, as well as a convener of high-dollar events on security and energy issues. It is an offshoot of the neoconservative Hudson Institute."
...
The institute was founded in 2011 by Nina Rosenwald, an heiress of the Sears Roebuck empire who has been a key philanthropic backer of anti-Muslim groups and individuals in the United States. Describing Gatestone's origins, journalist Max Blumenthal writes: "Through her affiliation with the Washington-based Hudson Institute, where Norman Podhoretz is an adjunct fellow, Rosenwald established a branch of the think tank in New York City. Operating under the Hudson banner, Rosenwald brought [the controversial anti-Islam Dutch politician Geert Wilders] to town in 2008 to warn against the Muslim plot to 'rule the world by the sword.' Wilders's tirade during that visit against the prophet Muhammad, whom he described as 'a warlord, a mass murderer, a pedophile,' was strident even by the standards of the hawkish Hudson Institute. By 2011 … Rosenwald separated Hudson New York City from Hudson's national branch, changing her organization's name to the Gatestone Institute."
http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/gatestone_institute (http://rightweb.irc-online.org/profile/gatestone_institute)

I have no idea of the veracity of the alleged 'police report leak', but we have to ask ourselves: if the problem in Germany had been anything like as great as that article suggests, why would Germany have been foremost in accepting more Syrian asylum-seekers?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 15, 2015, 18:00
I hope EU stop funding them too, so they'll have another reason to leave this mess.

[url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url] ([url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url])


If you ever quit micro, you'll easily find a home at the Daily Mail.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 15, 2015, 18:01
I hope EU stop funding them too, so they'll have another reason to leave this mess.

[url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url] ([url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url])


Im born in the Ruhrpott near Duisburg and i can assure you can stop your car everywhere without having trouble! ;D
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cobalt on November 15, 2015, 18:02
Many Germans here live next door to refugees. Our school gymnasiums, any hostel, empty office buildings are being filled up with them.

The only crime wave that has drastically gone up is by neonazis burning down buildings, attacking refugees and people that look like refugees and even attacked a pregnant somali woman. And in my city the new mayor was stabbed and he also knifed down other Germans at a local food market.

So crimes by "real germans" have gone up several hundred percent. But the police and also many stores donīt report rising crime through refugees. Shopkeepers put up posters in front of their stores and on social media that they are not seeing a rise in crimes.

We do get people who ride bicycles on the highway (not allowed here), a lot more oriental music and satellite dishes.

Most of all, muslims are nothing new for us. Maybe for some small east german villages, but The majority lives in cities. We donīt care where people come from. My hometown has the largest mosque in Germany, so I guess we should suffer first...but things are fine.

But the rise in rightwing extremists, is a real concern. There are some really brutal and violent white power gangs raising their ugly heads.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 15, 2015, 18:08
Many Germans here live next door to refugees. Our school gymnasiums, any hostel, empty office buildings are being filled up with them.

The only crime wave that has drastically gone up is by neonazis burning down buildings, attacking refugees and people that look like refugees and even attacked a pregnant somali woman. And in my city the new mayor was stabbed and he also knifed down other Germans at a local food market.

So crimes by "real germans" have gone up several hundred percent. But the police and also many stores donīt report rising crime through refugees. Shopkeepers put up posters in front of their stores and on social media that they are not seeing a rise in crimes.

We do get people who ride bicycles on the highway (not allowed here), a lot more oriental music and satellite dishes.

Most of all, muslims are nothing new for us. Maybe for some small east german villages, but The majority lives in cities. We donīt care where people come from.

But the rise in rightwing extremists, is a real concern. There are some really brutal and violent white power gangs raising their ugly heads.


That's what I'm reading here in the UK.
In fact, when I looked up 'Germany leaked police report about refugees' this is the story which came up again and again:
e.g.
"Police uncover far-Right plot to attack refugee shelters in Germany
The discovery comes as a leaked police report suggests far-Right nationalists could attack refugees as well as political leaders supportive of them"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11948175/Far-Right-extremists-could-attack-refugees-with-acid-or-wooden-clubs-says-German-police.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/11948175/Far-Right-extremists-could-attack-refugees-with-acid-or-wooden-clubs-says-German-police.html)
(NB, the Telegraph has a right wing/Conservative Party editorial stance)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 15, 2015, 18:16
I kind of like some people here (no need for them to know who they are) and just because i can't stand their drivel i decided to post what -in my opinion- i consider maybe the 3 best articles posted on the the western media regarding isis and  their motives, and the western world's role in all this including a bonus insight (not that it's difficult to figure out anyway) regarding usa's role in the whole affair.

https://medium.com/insurge-intelligence/how-the-west-created-the-islamic-state-dbfa6f83bc1f (https://medium.com/insurge-intelligence/how-the-west-created-the-islamic-state-dbfa6f83bc1f)
http://www.juancole.com/2014/09/defensive-rhetoric-offense.html (http://www.juancole.com/2014/09/defensive-rhetoric-offense.html)
http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/ (http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/)

Long read.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 18:39
I hope EU stop funding them too, so they'll have another reason to leave this mess.

[url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url] ([url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url])


If you ever quit micro, you'll easily find a home at the Daily Mail.


ha ha...good point!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 15, 2015, 18:41
I kind of like some people here (no need for them to know who they are) and just because i can't stand their drivel i decided to post what -in my opinion- i consider maybe the 3 best articles posted on the the western media regarding isis and  their motives, and the western world's role in all this including a bonus insight (not that it's difficult to figure out anyway) regarding usa's role in the whole affair.

[url]https://medium.com/insurge-intelligence/how-the-west-created-the-islamic-state-dbfa6f83bc1f[/url] ([url]https://medium.com/insurge-intelligence/how-the-west-created-the-islamic-state-dbfa6f83bc1f[/url])
[url]http://www.juancole.com/2014/09/defensive-rhetoric-offense.html[/url] ([url]http://www.juancole.com/2014/09/defensive-rhetoric-offense.html[/url])
[url]http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/[/url] ([url]http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/[/url])

Long read.


Great links, gcrook! Especially TheAtlantic, worth a read!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 15, 2015, 18:49
There are dozens of links from german news right there in front of your eyes, but you choose not to see.

I'm sure everything is fine in Germany, as long as it's not you or your family being raped.

If you dare, watch this 19min video. WARNING - it was edited for dramatic effect and it's not a pretty video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44vzMNG2fZc&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44vzMNG2fZc&feature=youtu.be)

You may not agree with the opinions in it, but you can't deny the self-evident scenes.

Anyway, sooner or later the truth will come out. Back to shooting.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Zero Talent on November 15, 2015, 18:51
Even if 99,99% of freebie seekers are not terrorists, they certainly commit a hell lot of crime especially rape, sexual harassment and robbery. They will never show this on the mainstream media obviously, but there are tons of data available.

Germany: Leaked police report reveal that 38,000 Muslim “asylum seekers” committed 100 crimes per day in 2014
Imagine what's like in 2015 with 400% more illegals. When you take Germany away from the germans, the natural reaction is nationalism. It's a matter of survival, either you fight back or you're conquered. Common sense is coming back to Europe though, Poland and Latvia already said they won't take muslims anymore. Eurosceptic anti immigration parties will gain strength across Europe because people are tired of EU failure.

For you, Muslims are rapists, for Trump, Mexicans are. Be careful, for some other extremists, East Europeans like you are no different.

This is fascism by definition.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 15, 2015, 19:09
Even if 99,99% of freebie seekers are not terrorists, they certainly commit a hell lot of crime especially rape, sexual harassment and robbery. They will never show this on the mainstream media obviously, but there are tons of data available.

Germany: Leaked police report reveal that 38,000 Muslim “asylum seekers” committed 100 crimes per day in 2014
Imagine what's like in 2015 with 400% more illegals. When you take Germany away from the germans, the natural reaction is nationalism. It's a matter of survival, either you fight back or you're conquered. Common sense is coming back to Europe though, Poland and Latvia already said they won't take muslims anymore. Eurosceptic anti immigration parties will gain strength across Europe because people are tired of EU failure.

For you, Muslims are rapists, for Trump, Mexicans are. Be careful, for some other extremists, East Europeans like you are no different.

This is fascism by definition.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

Don't put words in my mouth. People from certain countries statistically commit more crimes than european average, it's a fact even if you don't like it. Notice how Saudi Arabia wants to remain arab, Japan wants to remain japanese, China wants to remain chinese and african nations want to remain african. That's perfectly understandable and it does not make them extremists in any way. Why europeans are not allowed to have a country of their own? You think you're progressive and tolerant, but you're just anti-white. Go push for diversity in Saudi Arabia and leave my country alone.

* Anathaya - don't try to "white guilt" me. Was that supposed to be funny? Full of racist jokes.
If it were a white person making fun of immigrants, he would be in prison.

* R2d2 - I know many germans who will disagree with you, but suit yourself.
Just don't come begging to us when Germany turns into a failed state and you become the refugee.

* Zero Talent - you seem to have missed history class. Hitler invaded my country and killed us by the millions.
We don't want it to happen again. Thanks and goodbye.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Zero Talent on November 15, 2015, 19:16
Even if 99,99% of freebie seekers are not terrorists, they certainly commit a hell lot of crime especially rape, sexual harassment and robbery. They will never show this on the mainstream media obviously, but there are tons of data available.

Germany: Leaked police report reveal that 38,000 Muslim “asylum seekers” committed 100 crimes per day in 2014
Imagine what's like in 2015 with 400% more illegals. When you take Germany away from the germans, the natural reaction is nationalism. It's a matter of survival, either you fight back or you're conquered. Common sense is coming back to Europe though, Poland and Latvia already said they won't take muslims anymore. Eurosceptic anti immigration parties will gain strength across Europe because people are tired of EU failure.

For you, Muslims are rapists, for Trump, Mexicans are. Be careful, for some other extremists, East Europeans like you are no different.

This is fascism by definition.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

Don't put words in my mouth. People from certain countries statistically commit more crimes than european average, it's a fact even if you don't like it. Notice how Saudi Arabia wants to remain arab, Japan wants to remain japanese, China wants to remain chinese and african nations want to remain african. That's perfectly understandable and it does not make them extremists in any way. Why europeans are not allowed to have a country of their own? You think you're progressive and tolerant, but you're just anti-white. Go push for diversity in Saudi Arabia and leave my country alone. Thanks and goodbye.

OMG! Anti-white? One more time: this is exactly what Hitler said about Jews and Gypsies, when he tried to build his pure Aryan nation.

Jews and "negros" were the criminals and the rapists, in the 40s.

"Moreover the Jew has in his veins a large element of Negro blood; his frizzy hair, his wolf lips, the colour of his eyeballs proves this as effectually as the insatiable sexual greed which hesitates at no crime and finds its supremest triumph in the brutal defilement of women of another race. This bestial lust obsesses even a barely mature Jew boy"

You would make a great SS officer.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 16, 2015, 00:00
Why europeans are not allowed to have a country of their own?


Why Europeans, together with Americans, want to put finger into matters of every other countries?

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x306wiw (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x306wiw)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 16, 2015, 03:19
Even if 99,99% of freebie seekers are not terrorists, they certainly commit a hell lot of crime especially rape, sexual harassment and robbery. They will never show this on the mainstream media obviously, but there are tons of data available.

Germany: Leaked police report reveal that 38,000 Muslim “asylum seekers” committed 100 crimes per day in 2014
Imagine what's like in 2015 with 400% more illegals. When you take Germany away from the germans, the natural reaction is nationalism. It's a matter of survival, either you fight back or you're conquered. Common sense is coming back to Europe though, Poland and Latvia already said they won't take muslims anymore. Eurosceptic anti immigration parties will gain strength across Europe because people are tired of EU failure.

For you, Muslims are rapists, for Trump, Mexicans are. Be careful, for some other extremists, East Europeans like you are no different.

This is fascism by definition.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

Don't put words in my mouth. People from certain countries statistically commit more crimes than european average, it's a fact even if you don't like it. Notice how Saudi Arabia wants to remain arab, Japan wants to remain japanese, China wants to remain chinese and african nations want to remain african. That's perfectly understandable and it does not make them extremists in any way. Why europeans are not allowed to have a country of their own? You think you're progressive and tolerant, but you're just anti-white. Go push for diversity in Saudi Arabia and leave my country alone.

* You seem to have missed history class - Hitler invaded my country and killed us by the millions.
We don't want it to happen again. Thanks and goodbye.
Please do not speak for the whole EU!
Speak for you. And dont tell me how it is in my land (Germany).
I am proud of our freedom, liberty and democracy. :-*
I will not let destroy that by terrorists and also not by right-wing minorities. :)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ferdinand on November 16, 2015, 07:21
I hope EU stop funding them too, so they'll have another reason to leave this mess.

[url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url] ([url]http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave[/url])


 
...East European Slavic countries will leave this mess called EU - very soon... no future in EU...
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: John W. on November 16, 2015, 07:49
And as always: From the execution of innocent people by Islamic terrorists to Godwins and the Colonial past of the West. Why?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 16, 2015, 14:25
In Norway Brevik was a lonely crazy young man who used right wing extremists fake reasons to kill students.

Mostly it is lonely young men that can be radicalised and either out of themselves or with a few friends commit horrible things. For me this includes the school shootings etc...

Frustrated, lonely, disconnected from the world around them. Societies with high unemployment and low propspects for a good future have in proportion many more than countries with good quality life. But we still have enough frustrated young men that can be radicalised by extremists radical ideologies or religions.

So how do you reach out to them before they kill?

Most of the attackers in France where known to the French authorities and it was clear they had the potential to kill. But you cannot simply lock them up...just in case...there are too many people and in a democratic country you can't do this.


 "His family needed the money, and this was the only opportunity to provide for them."

 “Recruitment [of ISIS] plays upon desires of adventure, activism, romance, power, belonging, along with spiritual fulfillment.”

 “The Americans came,” he said. “They took away Saddam, but they also took away our security. I didn’t like Saddam, we were starving then, but at least we didn’t have war. When you came here, the civil war started.”

http://www.thenation.com/article/what-i-discovered-from-interviewing-isis-prisoners/ (http://www.thenation.com/article/what-i-discovered-from-interviewing-isis-prisoners/)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Noedelhap on November 16, 2015, 16:51
There are dozens of links from german news right there in front of your eyes, but you choose not to see.

I'm sure everything is fine in Germany, as long as it's not you or your family being raped.

If you dare, watch this 19min video. WARNING - it was edited for dramatic effect and it's not a pretty video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44vzMNG2fZc&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44vzMNG2fZc&feature=youtu.be)

You may not agree with the opinions in it, but you can't deny the self-evident scenes.

Anyway, sooner or later the truth will come out. Back to shooting.

The creator of this video is a hypocrite a-hole, because he infringed on copyright by using music without the composer's permission. Then he apparently tried to avert the takedown notice by muting parts of the audio and putting a link to the video in the description. Now who is the evil one here?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 16, 2015, 17:28
What an astonishingly vulgar and propagandistic film.Who cares about formalities about copyrighted music etc after this hideous display of "journalism"?
This propagandistic film reminded me of a video that had gone viral a few years back about an allegedly evil African warlord (a mythical figure-literally as we learned-) who went by the name of Koni.
Altough these 2 films seemingly have nothing in common they share the same properties.

They are overly dramatized and edited with the sole purpose to provoke raw, thoughtless, emotion like the cheapest media reportage we see everyday that try to promote an agenda.No information is shared,only images,no objectivity, and no political message whatsoever.
Everything is out of context, juxtaposition everywhere.* Hitler would be proud of today's editing.

I consider this the careful work of a nationalist (there is nothing random in the way it's being handled) and the only thing that makes me feel somewhat better after watching it is that nationalism
is thankfully a concept out of place in todays world,although we are being told that it's recurring.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: sharpshot on November 16, 2015, 18:07
I feel for the people of Paris and all the other people that have been killed or injured in terrorist attacks but I also feel for the people in middle east countries that are killed almost every day.  I used to not like the song "Imagine" but maybe no countries and no religion are the only way to stop these conflicts.  Not so sure about no possessions, I need my camera.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 19:32
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army. They aren't going away unless we make them, and flying over them isn't going to be enough.

How many deaths will it take? A thousand? Ten thousand? It's not going to end unless we stand up to these people and end it. It's going to take a worldwide effort just like World War II. We're going to have to devote our whole nations to the task.

But  I guess that's why my grandfather's generation was the "Greatest Generation" and mine is just a bunch of spoiled whiners and beggars.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 16, 2015, 19:37
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 19:47
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

It doesn't really matter. What matters is stopping them.

And for a fact, the U.S. did not arm them. We armed other rebels opposed to the Syrian regime, and ISIS took their weapons. Then they took land, and recruited a greater force with money from stolen oil.

In the end, they are evil. There's no shade of gray here. If you support doing nothing about them, you are complicit in their evil.

I supposed it's easy for some to stand by while they kidnap young Yazidi girls and sell them as sex slaves while launching attacks on Paris that kill dozens with more to come.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: fritz on November 16, 2015, 19:47
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 16, 2015, 19:51
And for a fact, the U.S. did not arm them. We armed other rebels opposed to the Syrian regime, and ISIS took their weapons.
So, albeit indirectly, the US (and other countries) DID, in fact, arm them.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 19:51
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 19:53
And for a fact, the U.S. did not arm them. We armed other rebels opposed to the Syrian regime, and ISIS took their weapons.
So, albeit indirectly, the US (and other countries) DID, in fact, arm them.

So what? It has nothing to do with anything. Should we arrest Obama for arming Syrian rebels and then later have those arms captured by ISIS? Or do we take on the people who are the real problem?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 16, 2015, 19:57
And for a fact, the U.S. did not arm them. We armed other rebels opposed to the Syrian regime, and ISIS took their weapons.
So, albeit indirectly, the US (and other countries) DID, in fact, arm them.

So what? It has nothing to do with anything. Should we arrest Obama for arming Syrian rebels and then later have those arms captured by ISIS? Or do we take on the people who are the real problem?
For better or worse, I'd be considered far too geriatric to be considered for such an endeavour. I have no personal mandate to send my younger compatriots.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 16, 2015, 19:59
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 16, 2015, 20:02
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.
You are seriously equating all Communists and Socialists with so-called IS?
OK, that gives me your intellectual measure.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 20:04
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.
You are seriously equating all Communists and Socialists with so-called IS?
OK, that gives me your intellectual measure.

My intellectual measure includes reading some history. You should try it. Its about extremists who try to control the way people think and live. Mao and Stalin killed millions. These Islamists aren't much different.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 20:05
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.

ISIS is the cause. The murders in Paris are the result.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 16, 2015, 20:05
Quote

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

I'd love if you would continue for a bit with the social and political groups instead of posting "etc".
Im sure that if you continued, a bit further down the line,pretty much everyone (except you apparently) , would find themselves fitting in the description of what you call evil.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: fritz on November 16, 2015, 20:06
And for a fact, the U.S. did not arm them. We armed other rebels opposed to the Syrian regime, and ISIS took their weapons.
So, albeit indirectly, the US (and other countries) DID, in fact, arm them.

So what? It has nothing to do with anything. Should we arrest Obama for arming Syrian rebels and then later have those arms captured by ISIS? Or do we take on the people who are the real problem?

The real problem is US foreign policy which is the ROOT of most problems in the world!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 16, 2015, 20:10
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

 >:( Shame on you for putting communists and socialists in the same basket as ISIS!!! (vomit)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 16, 2015, 20:11
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.
You are seriously equating all Communists and Socialists with so-called IS?
OK, that gives me your intellectual measure.

My intellectual measure includes reading some history. You should try it. Its about extremists who try to control the way people think and live. Mao and Stalin killed millions. These Islamists aren't much different.
You know nothing of my education, so make no assumptions.
My comment was on you implicitly equating all Communists and Socialists with so-called IS.
History also teaches that extreme Right-wing dictators have killed, and continue to kill their opponents. Hitler and the Ayatollahs, for example.
Because there is little difference in the way extreme Left, extreme Left and many other extremes, operate.

See also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_authoritarian_regimes_supported_by_the_United_States (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_authoritarian_regimes_supported_by_the_United_States)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 16, 2015, 20:13
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.

ISIS is the cause. The murders in Paris are the result.

Your little brain... People like you have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *******
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 20:13
I had Na_zis in there but it got autocorrected.

I agree with you. Extremist governments that put the state above individual rights like freedom of speech and freedom of religion are bad whether they are left or right.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 20:15
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.

ISIS is the cause. The murders in Paris are the result.

Your little brain... People like you have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *******

Typical. Leftwing people always bring out the insults when they disagree with people. Did I insult you? No. I just have a different point of view. You should go join ISIS. You would fit in.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 16, 2015, 20:18
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.

ISIS is the cause. The murders in Paris are the result.

Your little brain... People like you have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *******

Typical. Leftwing people always bring out the insults when they disagree with people. Did I insult you? No. I just have a different point of view. You should go join ISIS. You would fit in.

No one here like or support ISIS. But some people did, and keep doing....
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 16, 2015, 20:19
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.

ISIS is the cause. The murders in Paris are the result.

Your little brain... People like you have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *******

Typical. Leftwing people always bring out the insults when they disagree with people. Did I insult you? No. I just have a different point of view. You should go join ISIS. You would fit in.

I am calling Leaf on this one.... isn't this an insult?
Shame on you, senior MSG member!
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 20:21
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.

ISIS is the cause. The murders in Paris are the result.

Your little brain... People like you have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *******

Typical. Leftwing people always bring out the insults when they disagree with people. Did I insult you? No. I just have a different point of view. You should go join ISIS. You would fit in.

No one here like or support ISIS. But some people did, and keep doing....

Yes. You're supporting them by supporting inaction.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 20:22
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.

ISIS is the cause. The murders in Paris are the result.

Your little brain... People like you have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *******

Typical. Leftwing people always bring out the insults when they disagree with people. Did I insult you? No. I just have a different point of view. You should go join ISIS. You would fit in.

I am calling Leaf on this one.... isn't this an insult!
Shame on you, senior MSG member!

Go ahead. If you can't win an argument, cry about it and try to shut up people who disagree.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 16, 2015, 20:25
Yes. You're supporting them by supporting inaction.
.

My point is we have to stop not only ISIS, but also possible such group that can appear in future. If you cannot understand what I say, I don't want to argue with you. I know how bad terrorism is as many people in my country seriously affected by that. World can be a better place if we can stop terrorism completely, not temporarily.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 16, 2015, 20:31
Leftwing people always bring out the insults when they disagree with people.
You were the one who insulted socialists and communists by equating them with so-called IS.
I live in a country with a very proud democratic Socialist history during the last hundred years or so, and not a dictator in sight.
Therefore I feel your ignorant comment as a insult to my nationality.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 20:32
Yes. You're supporting them by supporting inaction.
.

My point is we have to stop not only ISIS, but also possible such group that can appear in future. If you cannot understand what I say, I don't want to argue with you. I know how bad terrorism is as many people in my country seriously affected by that. World can be a better place if we can stop terrorism completely, not temporarily.

I'd be happy if we could stop all terrorism forever. I don't know how.

Until then, we have to do everything we can to root out ISIS and other terrorist groups that we can get our hands on. It has to be a worldwide effort. The U.S., Russia, China, Europe, "moderate" countries in the Middle East, we all have to come together to repudiate ISIS and those who support it.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 16, 2015, 20:36
Leftwing people always bring out the insults when they disagree with people.
You were the one who insulted socialists and communists by equating them with so-called IS.
I live in a country with a very proud democratic Socialist history during the last hundred years or so, and not a dictator in sight.
Therefore I feel your ignorant comment as a insult to my nationality.

I don't see how since I have no idea what your nationality is nor did I attack you personally, at least not until after you attacked me personally. Criticizing socialists isn't a personal attack on you anymore than you beating on the U.S. is a personal attack on me. That would be ridiculous.

I personally don't see much difference between socialism and islamist philosophy. They both seek to control people, and both have a history of using extreme violence to do it.

If you're from Sweden or Denmark or something, those countries aren't really socialist. They're market economies with larger welfare states. I don't consider them socialist.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 16, 2015, 23:53
Have we all missed the fact here that this attack like the Charlie Hebdo attack was orchestrated and executed by people who were born and lived in France?
Yes i think we have.
It's not like we dont know at this point (but choose to ignore it) how a young Algerian-french black mueslim has it in the ghettos,just like a black young mueslim living in London and how these experiences form him and push him towards islam
Makes you see from a different perspective the quote "we will bring the war back to you".
Once again public dialogue as orchestrated by the media has (deliberately) failed in addressing the situation.
All this crap in the media agenda about refugees and passports and bombing Syria is nothing but blowing dust to the eyes.

Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ferdinand on November 17, 2015, 00:35
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?


Who create them?


Who buys cheap oil from Isis?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Firewall on November 17, 2015, 01:43
Of course, but attacks in Beirut, Damascus or Bagdad are not unexpected. The whole region is an unstable civil war zone.

Paris,London and New York are not known to be at war, an attack there is something new.

Moreover these are truly global cities probably visited by over a billion people have once in their life visited them, studied or worked there.

They are places millions of people around the world dream to move to, places we believe you can live safely and in peace.

More people around the world have some kind of emotional connection to Paris, than to Damascus or large cities in Africa that also have many attacks and violence.

The terrorists know this, an attack there will get them more attention and a lot more money from their supporters than an attack in Beirut.

If we do get monthly attacks in France, it wonīt be front page news anymore. That is just the way media works.

Even in the Middle East many people are more shocked about attacks in Paris or London than at home. Especially, if they have sent their children to school or to study there, hoping they have sent them to a safe place.
That's just too bad, but not uncommon for people to consider Middle East and Africa as dangerous and unstable places. Ask yourself, how many attacks were there in Beirut this year and how many in Paris?
There are safer places in the Middle East and Africa than in France. There are no terrorist attacks in let's say Lilongwe or Amman or Muscat or Kigali.

Speaking to people in the field, whether they are Egyptians, Palestinians, Syrians, Lebanese, Jordanians, Israeli or bedouins, all say the same thing, the West doesn't care about our lives. Even Facebook has a double standard here. Sad.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 17, 2015, 02:23
I think we shouldn't discuss topics unrelated to micro at all. It just creates conflict and weaken our position as contributors. There are many political blogs where you will find people who share the same views, it's more productive and less stressful for all. I will start by myself, hope you guys join in.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 17, 2015, 08:35
Well i dont know about you or anyone else here ,but im not feeling stressed at all,actually a bit refreshed, which is the side effect of honestly expressing your opinion in public whether people like it or not.
I remain productive and i dont think im losing face as contributor or weaking my resolve or my determination for anything really.

Of course if i were of the same mindset as you are i would propably post this in the same scope as you posted, which implies that either this is a bootcamp where we are all in unity and internal struggle lowers out strength and mind (a bit fascist in its philosophy) ,or that you are nothing more than a hypocrite who was booed and stepped back and decided to do a tactical retreat for the sake of us all.
Oh the humanity....
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 17, 2015, 09:07
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?


Who create them?


Who buys cheap oil from Isis?

No idea. I know the U.S. doesn't. We don't get oil from the Middle East anymore. Most of it is either homegrown or from Canada.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 17, 2015, 09:10
I think we shouldn't discuss topics unrelated to micro at all. It just creates conflict and weaken our position as contributors. There are many political blogs where you will find people who share the same views, it's more productive and less stressful for all. I will start by myself, hope you guys join in.

Why would I want to post on a blog with people who share my views? You learn nothing by listening to your own echo.

This is what ISIS wants: A world where everything thinks and acts the same. I pity people who live in places where they can be put in jail or worse for criticizing their government. I don't understand how they don't have an immediate revolution when that happens, even if their fellow citizens have different beliefs.

Society is strengthened, not weakened, by having a diversity of opinions
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 17, 2015, 10:52
Ok, after reading this...I got to say. It's a mess!  :(

"For just $250, one smuggler based in Sulaymaniyah promises to deliver a fake Syrian passport, ID card or birth certificate within 10 days. A second forger in Duhok says he can procure a passport, allegedly with the help of a Syrian embassy official, within four days – for a premium price of $2,500."

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/17/how-easy-is-it-to-buy-fake-syrian-passport (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/17/how-easy-is-it-to-buy-fake-syrian-passport)

“We have people to interview migrants and the purpose of this interview is to establish nationality,” said Ewa Moncure, a Frontex spokeswoman. “They may say no, this person’s accent is not from Syria – and if they have any doubt they will ask follow-up questions”, to test a migrant’s knowledge of life in Syria. But Moncure admitted that not all Greek islands were staffed with specialists who can examine the authenticity of passports. “You can’t say that wherever there is Frontex activity, there is a document expert.”

Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Firewall on November 17, 2015, 11:20
I think we shouldn't discuss topics unrelated to micro at all. It just creates conflict and weaken our position as contributors. There are many political blogs where you will find people who share the same views, it's more productive and less stressful for all. I will start by myself, hope you guys join in.
In a good discussion everybody should respect each other's opinions and views without the insults and name calling, that's lacking here
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Zero Talent on November 17, 2015, 11:39

Why would I want to post on a blog with people who share my views? You learn nothing by listening to your own echo.

True.

Personally, I find interesting to see how some are convinced, beyond doubt, that fascism is the answer to terrorism.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 17, 2015, 12:03
This is a very low level discussion. I haven't learned anything in the last 5 pages, other than photographers have very little understanding in history, economy and politics. Therefore it was a big waste of time for me. When I read independent news outlets like ZeroHedge, the general level of understanding is much higher, people also disagree but you can learn quite a lot - that's the difference.

MSG is great when it comes to micro agencies and photography, and that's about it.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Zero Talent on November 17, 2015, 12:28
... photographers have very little understanding in history, economy and politics.

What a condescending attitude!

Besides, there are not just photographers here. There are economists, engineers, teachers, etc. Have you considered, that, maybe, just maybe, you are the one with an odd understanding of economics, politics and history?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: cobalt on November 17, 2015, 12:38
Of course, but attacks in Beirut, Damascus or Bagdad are not unexpected. The whole region is an unstable civil war zone.

Paris,London and New York are not known to be at war, an attack there is something new.

Moreover these are truly global cities probably visited by over a billion people have once in their life visited them, studied or worked there.

They are places millions of people around the world dream to move to, places we believe you can live safely and in peace.

More people around the world have some kind of emotional connection to Paris, than to Damascus or large cities in Africa that also have many attacks and violence.

The terrorists know this, an attack there will get them more attention and a lot more money from their supporters than an attack in Beirut.

If we do get monthly attacks in France, it wonīt be front page news anymore. That is just the way media works.

Even in the Middle East many people are more shocked about attacks in Paris or London than at home. Especially, if they have sent their children to school or to study there, hoping they have sent them to a safe place.
That's just too bad, but not uncommon for people to consider Middle East and Africa as dangerous and unstable places. Ask yourself, how many attacks were there in Beirut this year and how many in Paris?
There are safer places in the Middle East and Africa than in France. There are no terrorist attacks in let's say Lilongwe or Amman or Muscat or Kigali.

Speaking to people in the field, whether they are Egyptians, Palestinians, Syrians, Lebanese, Jordanians, Israeli or bedouins, all say the same thing, the West doesn't care about our lives. Even Facebook has a double standard here. Sad.

I have family in Amman and Beirut, so for me personally there is an emotional connection if something happens there. But for most people around me there isnīt. It doesnīt mean that only french lives matter. It is just not the same emotional connection.

Imagine you go to attend the funeral of a very dear friend and while you stand by the grave and mourn, somebody walks up to you and complains that you are not showing any emotion to the other person who died and whoīse funeral is being held two rows down.

Just because you are grieving for your friend doesnīt mean you have no empathy for other people. But you will feel a deeper loss to someone you are connected to than the rest of the world.

Attacks happen every single day somewhere across the globe. If there was an attack in my town of Cologne, the Sydney opera house would not be lit up in the colours of my city. Nor would I expect it or go on the internet to complain. There is no competition in grief.

If something happens in Asia, Sri Lanka, or Ukraine, it doesnīt affect me as much as London, Paris, Amman, New York or Athens. wherever my family and friends live will have the strongest pull on me. And I donīt see why I should feel guilty for it, I donīt expect the whole world to follow my life in Cologne, either.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: JPSDK on November 17, 2015, 14:43
Posted from a Danish member of the board. Putin has some points.
I support him and France.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2jA88RlQ2c (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2jA88RlQ2c)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 17, 2015, 15:30
Posted from a Danish member of the board. Putin has some points.
I support him and France.
[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2jA88RlQ2c[/url] ([url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2jA88RlQ2c[/url])


As much as i loathe and despise that idiot one thing i take from his speech.That the American elite is of such a low level (intellectually and strategically) that has managed to create chaos from which no one can benefit,not even them (USA for example has no control of the oil).
It's after all the American doctrine of scorched earth.USA can't win a war nowadays (winning means seizing control not bombing with planes) so they have decided to create an array of failed states using allies (good Al Quaeda-bad Al-Quaeda,...anyone remember?).Obama himself has said it (if you can deconstruct his speech) .
Again this article straight from the horse's mouth http://www.juancole.com/2014/09/defensive-rhetoric-offense.html (http://www.juancole.com/2014/09/defensive-rhetoric-offense.html)

After all Victoria Nuland's leaked comment on the devastating Ukraine civil war (sorry i meant the just struggle for liberation against the tyranny of Russia) was plain and simple "F*** Europe"
Thanks for letting me contribute my low level of writing to this discussion as someone earlier -who has no idea that immigration is a historical fact long before him meaning that his ancestors were a bunch of "apes" according to the natives-
eloquently put.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gbalex on November 17, 2015, 15:58
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

It doesn't really matter. What matters is stopping them.

And for a fact, the U.S. did not arm them. We armed other rebels opposed to the Syrian regime, and ISIS took their weapons. Then they took land, and recruited a greater force with money from stolen oil.

In the end, they are evil. There's no shade of gray here. If you support doing nothing about them, you are complicit in their evil.

I supposed it's easy for some to stand by while they kidnap young Yazidi girls and sell them as sex slaves while launching attacks on Paris that kill dozens with more to come.

You will be signing up then, to fight ISIS on the ground yourself!

Or do you expect young men all over the world to do the dirty work for you?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 17, 2015, 16:04
Ok,. I wasnt expecting this kind of discussion when I posted about 140 innocent dead people, feel sorry it has turned ugly
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: r2d2 on November 17, 2015, 16:31
... photographers have very little understanding in history, economy and politics.

What a condescending attitude!

Besides, there are not just photographers here. There are economists, engineers, teachers, etc. Have you considered, that, maybe, just maybe, you are the one with an odd understanding of economics, politics and history?

He is Mr. Know it all! He reads independent media like gatestoneinstitute.com with this help he analysed my homecountry now he knows germany better than i. ;D

But the best of the best is that he is scared that we germans come to his homeland because (he thinks) we have so massive problems with refugees here that we germans leave germany.  ;D ;D ;D

He is my new right-wing hero!

PS: Just for the record Nikovsk, whats your homecountry?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 17, 2015, 17:58
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

It doesn't really matter. What matters is stopping them.

And for a fact, the U.S. did not arm them. We armed other rebels opposed to the Syrian regime, and ISIS took their weapons. Then they took land, and recruited a greater force with money from stolen oil.

In the end, they are evil. There's no shade of gray here. If you support doing nothing about them, you are complicit in their evil.

I supposed it's easy for some to stand by while they kidnap young Yazidi girls and sell them as sex slaves while launching attacks on Paris that kill dozens with more to come.

You will be signing up then, to fight ISIS on the ground yourself!

Or do you expect young men all over the world to do the dirty work for you?

I served my time in the military during Desert Storm. I'm too old now. I'd go if they would take me.

But my sons might be required to serve.

Have you served your nation during war? Until you do, I don't think you can put that criticism on me.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: sharpshot on November 17, 2015, 18:20
This is a very low level discussion. I haven't learned anything in the last 5 pages, other than photographers have very little understanding in history, economy and politics. Therefore it was a big waste of time for me. When I read independent news outlets like ZeroHedge, the general level of understanding is much higher, people also disagree but you can learn quite a lot - that's the difference.

MSG is great when it comes to micro agencies and photography, and that's about it.
If you think photographers no nothing about war, you need to do more research.  Try here for a start
https://youtu.be/6mSEjxfXBsg
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Zero Talent on November 17, 2015, 21:20

PS: Just for the record Nikovsk, whats your homecountry?

* Hitler invaded my country and killed us by the millions.

Which countries, invaded by Hitler, had millions of casualties in WWII?

1. Soviet Union ~ 20M
2. Poland ~ 5.8M
3. Yugoslavia ~1.7M

Yugoslavia is no more, so it can only be Russia or Poland.
I don't believe he is from Poland. Corroborating his anti-EU, "divide et impera" rhetoric, my "vote" goes for Russia.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ferdinand on November 18, 2015, 01:47
Posted from a Danish member of the board. Putin has some points.
I support him and France.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2jA88RlQ2c (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2jA88RlQ2c)

... Putin is the only statesman (historical figure) in the 21st century politics ... he will find solution for Isis...
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Nikovsk on November 18, 2015, 03:15

But the best of the best is that he is scared that we germans come to his homeland because (he thinks) we have so massive problems with refugees here that we germans leave germany.  ;D ;D ;D


I'm a big fan of Germany, most beautiful towns I've ever seen and I traveled quite a bit. Germans are probably the most productive people in the world. Wherever they go, they make the best out of the situation (Early US, South Brazil, Romania before WWII). We will gladly take them, except the cultural marxists. Immigration is great when it comes to civilized, hard-working people who are self reliant. We don't need illegals shopping for the best welfare deals.

The Guardian just called, they want Zero Talent in their team. Work starts tomorrow.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ferdinand on November 18, 2015, 03:54
 
[/quote]

Which countries, invaded by Hitler, had millions of casualties in WWII?

1. Soviet Union ~ 20M
2. Poland ~ 5.8M
3. Yugoslavia ~1.7M


[/quote]


..."nice" statistics - 27.50 M people killed for no reason at all... Be more careful with these  numbers - those are innocent people, women, children... mostly Slavs and Jews...
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 18, 2015, 03:57
Which countries, invaded by Hitler, had millions of casualties in WWII?

1. Soviet Union ~ 20M
2. Poland ~ 5.8M
3. Yugoslavia ~1.7M

..."nice" statistics - 27.20 M people killed for no reason at all... Be more careful with this numbers - those are innocent people, women, children... mostly Slavs and Jews...

27.20 M - only in those three countries. Total numbers are much larger ~73M.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Zero Talent on November 18, 2015, 06:49


Which countries, invaded by Hitler, had millions of casualties in WWII?

1. Soviet Union ~ 20M
2. Poland ~ 5.8M
3. Yugoslavia ~1.7M


[/quote]


..."nice" statistics - 27.50 M people killed for no reason at all... Be more careful with these  numbers - those are innocent people, women, children... mostly Slavs and Jews...
[/quote]


....And the forgotten gypsy genocide, very few know or talk about.

These deaths originate from those aryan/white-supremacist, xenophobic and fascist policies our friend Nikovsk is a big fan of.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 18, 2015, 09:11
Talking of ...The fallen of the WW2 -

18 min should get your full attention!

https://vimeo.com/128373915
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: JPSDK on November 18, 2015, 13:57
Talking of ...The fallen of the WW2 -

18 min should get your full attention!

https://vimeo.com/128373915
Brings perspective, doesnt it?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 18, 2015, 15:57
This is a very low level discussion. I haven't learned anything in the last 5 pages, other than photographers have very little understanding in history, economy and politics. Therefore it was a big waste of time for me. When I read independent news outlets like ZeroHedge, the general level of understanding is much higher, people also disagree but you can learn quite a lot - that's the difference.

MSG is great when it comes to micro agencies and photography, and that's about it.

you were right on the spot in your one before comment when you say this is not the place to
discuss politics,
then you come back a 100% turnaround to continue to say msg forum ppl
is only great in their head with photography and agencies.

you are right first time, and second time,.. but only partly-right on the latter comment.

this is not a place we care to discuss politics, there are forum where you can discuss that
or spread your political patroitism or beliefs ,
but really, most of us are not interested in discussing politics here.

as leaf titled this forum... MSG , it is not about discussing mono sodium glutamate
and even more, it is not about discussing mass suicide genocide or what other MSG means
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 18, 2015, 20:05
as leaf titled this forum... MSG , it is not about discussing mono sodium glutamate
and even more, it is not about discussing mass suicide genocide or what other MSG means

This thread is posted in "Off Topic" section.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 18, 2015, 20:37
as leaf titled this forum... MSG , it is not about discussing mono sodium glutamate
and even more, it is not about discussing mass suicide genocide or what other MSG means


This thread is posted in "Off Topic" section.


doesn't matter. there are forums where you can talk about terrorism until the cows come home or till your ying yang whatever falls out.
if you come here to preach some anti this or pro that, you came to the wrong place.

ss forum etc also has offtopics but it just means something else other than micro stock..
but terrorism or pointing a finger at certain sections of our society
is not really the place on msg. sorry !!!

here's one for the true terrorist forum, why not go where there is a common thread , no pun intended
http://www.topix.com/forum/news/terrorism (http://www.topix.com/forum/news/terrorism)
or just go to any newspaper site, they all have a page for "your opinion" on terrist attack in paris
unless you prefer to discuss a topic here where we are more "know only about"  taking photos.. 8)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 18, 2015, 20:55
i don't know about the rest, but i for one , hate to see leaf's forum turned into having the top 5 issues as off topics instead of what he wanted this forum to be ... microstock photography..

off topic like reddit or pickup gurus,, or just plain way off topic rather than closely related photography topics other than microstock.

we have this site as the only forum worth reading and sharing about views on microstock..
why try to replace it with talks on incontinence, PQQ and mitocondria biogenesis, what i can do with wet sock and body odour,etc.. whatever...???
i hope you see where i am going???

it's like someone going into a camera club or golfer's club to pickup on terrorism or
crochet or wife-swopping, etc etc etc
it's just not the place... esp when the web has tons of each appropriate topic forums

also, as shadysue pointed out, there are lurkers who have not commented at all ...
so let's keep this forum out of harm's way  ;)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 18, 2015, 22:15
off topic like reddit or pickup gurus,, or just plain way off topic rather than closely related photography topics other than microstock.


Shouldn't they go in the massage board for "General Photography Discussion"?
http://www.microstockgroup.com/general-photography-discussion/ (http://www.microstockgroup.com/general-photography-discussion/)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 18, 2015, 22:21
off topic like reddit or pickup gurus,, or just plain way off topic rather than closely related photography topics other than microstock.


Shouldn't they go in the massage board for "General Photography Discussion"?
[url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/general-photography-discussion/[/url] ([url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/general-photography-discussion/[/url])


ya, if a massage is what they really want  ;)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: anathaya on November 18, 2015, 22:26
Normally, I don't involve in a discussion if it's out of my interests. Sometimes I leave after halfway through if I lose my interest. Then I don't worry what others discuss about. Probably you can try the same. No one is forced to involve in each and every thread. Just a suggestion.  :)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 18, 2015, 22:33
Normally, I don't involve in a discussion if it's out of my interests. Sometimes I leave after halfway through if I lose my interest. Then I don't worry what others discuss about. Probably you can try the same. No one is forced to involve in each and every thread. Just a suggestion.  :)

while we're OT, can anyone recommend the best diaper for incontinence :-X
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: wordplanet on November 18, 2015, 23:03
Normally, I don't involve in a discussion if it's out of my interests. Sometimes I leave after halfway through if I lose my interest. Then I don't worry what others discuss about. Probably you can try the same. No one is forced to involve in each and every thread. Just a suggestion.  :)

while we're OT, can anyone recommend the best diaper for incontinence :-X

Really, over 100 innocent people died and you're making jokes like this?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 19, 2015, 04:56
i don't know about the rest, but i for one , hate to see leaf's forum turned into having the top 5 issues as off topics instead of what he wanted this forum to be ... microstock photography..
I checked,  and on my system,  this is the only off-topic thread on the first page.
Given that the Paris bombing is being talked about everywhere this week, and that this discussion can be on several levels, it's not surprising that it's discussed here.
Leaf chose to include an off-topic thread, and has so far chosen not to lock this one, so don't presume to speak for him.
Also, don't forget that you can put the off-topic thread on ignore if you wish.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 19, 2015, 07:58
Normally, I don't involve in a discussion if it's out of my interests. Sometimes I leave after halfway through if I lose my interest. Then I don't worry what others discuss about. Probably you can try the same. No one is forced to involve in each and every thread. Just a suggestion.  :)

while we're OT, can anyone recommend the best diaper for incontinence :-X

Really, over 100 innocent people died and you're making jokes like this?

definitely yes i am making joke of it...
because even more than 100 ppl could die if you help them spread their terror.

 the  more powerful weapon of terrorism or any form of bullying is the insurgent
into your mind.. to make you believe they are more powerful than you think.
if the general public are afraid, the terrorist will have already succeeded to spread terror and paranoia of their threat
and power to seize the general public by getting the common folks to spread the news
of their terror.
in spreading the news and discussion, you are doing exactly what they want you to do...

granted the newspapers discuss this, but they do not blow it out of proportion to give it headlines.
even when a so-called copyist-terrorist is trying his own to terrorize who he considers the guilty party,
the police or dept of defence or whatever, do not entertain these people
to discuss it any further.

ok, back to serious business,
you still haven't answered my question...
what is the best diaper for incontinence because when people get paranoid they drip constantly 8)

 ;) ...
Also, don't forget that you can put the off-topic comment about an equally off-topic thread on ignore if you wish
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 19, 2015, 08:11

Quote

definitely yes i am. the main purpose of terrorism is to spread terror and paranoia.
in spreading the news and discussion, you are doing exactly what they want you to do...

That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 19, 2015, 08:21

Quote

definitely yes i am. the main purpose of terrorism is to spread terror and paranoia.
in spreading the news and discussion, you are doing exactly what they want you to do...

That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information.

yes, and they said the same thing about some other ridiculous person when he told the public the world is round and not flat. the intelligent boob came back with the response...

"That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information  rumour"

 8)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 19, 2015, 08:27

Quote

definitely yes i am. the main purpose of terrorism is to spread terror and paranoia.
in spreading the news and discussion, you are doing exactly what they want you to do...

That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information.

psst,... do you know what causes incontinence ???
it is the lack of moderation
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 19, 2015, 08:29

Quote

definitely yes i am. the main purpose of terrorism is to spread terror and paranoia.
in spreading the news and discussion, you are doing exactly what they want you to do...

That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information.

yes, and they said the same thing about some other ridiculous person when he told the public the world is round and not flat. the intelligent boob came back with the response...

"That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information  rumour"

 8)

What you are doing here is imposing your own criteria on what information is practically calling all information rumour.
If you dont like certain aspects of the discussion, critize those,dont paint it all as rumour.

Information means nothing by itself.It needs discussion and criticism to mean somethin and you just rejected those as means to that end.
Maybe it is people like you who are of the impression that earth is flat since all discussion regarding it's non-flattness must be rumour and these discussions dont belong here anyway?Hows that?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 19, 2015, 08:38

Quote

definitely yes i am. the main purpose of terrorism is to spread terror and paranoia.
in spreading the news and discussion, you are doing exactly what they want you to do...

That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information.

yes, and they said the same thing about some other ridiculous person when he told the public the world is round and not flat. the intelligent boob came back with the response...

"That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information  rumour"

 8)


What you are doing here is imposing your own criteria
on what information is practically calling all information rumour.
If you dont like certain aspects of the discussion, critize those,dont paint it all as rumour.

Information means nothing by itself.It needs discussion and criticism to mean somethin and you just rejected those as means to that end.
Maybe it is people like you who are of the impression that earth is flat since all discussion regarding it's non-flattness must be rumour and these discussions dont belong here anyway?Hows that?

isn't everyone here trying to impose their own critieria...
even the comment you just made...

which obviously you did not read what i said ... i did not say the world is flat...
i said the world is round..
have you taken a look at yourself in the mirror lately??? 8)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 19, 2015, 08:43

Quote

definitely yes i am. the main purpose of terrorism is to spread terror and paranoia.
in spreading the news and discussion, you are doing exactly what they want you to do...

That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information.

yes, and they said the same thing about some other ridiculous person when he told the public the world is round and not flat. the intelligent boob came back with the response...

"That must be by far the most ridiculous thing i've ever heard regarding criticism,discussion, and spreading of information  rumour"

 8)


What you are doing here is imposing your own criteria
on what information is practically calling all information rumour.
If you dont like certain aspects of the discussion, critize those,dont paint it all as rumour.

Information means nothing by itself.It needs discussion and criticism to mean somethin and you just rejected those as means to that end.
Maybe it is people like you who are of the impression that earth is flat since all discussion regarding it's non-flattness must be rumour and these discussions dont belong here anyway?Hows that?

isn't everyone here trying to impose their own critieria...
even the comment you just made...

which obviously you did not read what i said ... i did not say the world is flat...
i said the world is round..
have you taken a look at yourself in the mirror lately??? 8)

Ok we have a serious problem of comprehension here.Good luck.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 19, 2015, 08:47
Ok we I have a serious problem of comprehension here.Good luck.
8)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: 60D on November 19, 2015, 11:31



i said the world is round..

Is that true?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: robhainer on November 19, 2015, 12:47
Clearly, some people need a "safe space" where they wont risk being exposed to opinions that are different or challenge them.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: VB inc on November 19, 2015, 13:35
If you guys really want an informative read on the mindset of isis and their goals, below is a link to a long article who pretty much explains the group and their ideology which has been pretty much accurate to say even isis members are saying that thats who they are and about. Pretty scary too.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/ (http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: FlowerPower on November 19, 2015, 14:59
Clearly, some people need a "safe space" where they wont risk being exposed to opinions that are different or challenge them.

ER is a troll from day one. Just wants to cause the thread to be closeed so he doesn't have to let us speak freedom. In his own way he is a forum terrorist throwing bombs into our discussions to disrupt.

If the French were armed like the American's, those terrorists with guns would have fired a few shots and been silenced by the power of the people. Freedom rings and protects us against these people. That's why they take advantage of France or kill their own kind in their countries. Corrupt power from a small group of misguided religious fanatics, makes the good ones look bad. But the good have no weapons to defend, so they get murdered in homelands.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Shelma1 on November 19, 2015, 16:11
Clearly, some people need a "safe space" where they wont risk being exposed to opinions that are different or challenge them.

ER is a troll from day one. Just wants to cause the thread to be closeed so he doesn't have to let us speak freedom. In his own way he is a forum terrorist throwing bombs into our discussions to disrupt.

If the French were armed like the American's, those terrorists with guns would have fired a few shots and been silenced by the power of the people. Freedom rings and protects us against these people. That's why they take advantage of France or kill their own kind in their countries. Corrupt power from a small group of misguided religious fanatics, makes the good ones look bad. But the good have no weapons to defend, so they get murdered in homelands.

If the French were armed like the Americans are, they'd be killing themselves at much higher rates than any terrorists do. Americans shoot each other or themselves to death abut 85 times a day, every day, week after week, month after month, year after year.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 19, 2015, 16:13
If the French were armed like the American's, those terrorists with guns would have fired a few shots and been silenced by the power of the people. Freedom rings and protects us against these people. That's why they take advantage of France or kill their own kind in their countries.
I'm guessing that this is unobvious sarcasm or deliberate trolling.
However, I know from some stupid comments appearing on Facebook just after the Paris bombing, to the effect that it was Europe's own fault for letting in Syrian refugees (and there were some posts veering in that direction early in this thread) that I can't assume that this is not an actual, genuine opinion.
If you were really expressing your opinion, would you explain how freedom rang and protected Americans from 9/11, or protects US schoolchildren, again and again, from random gun attacks from their own countrymen?
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 19, 2015, 16:15
ER is a troll from day one.

lol, lemming !!!
flowerpower +99 hearts
troll +1205 hearts

that's pretty much speak alot for being a troll here  8)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: gcrook on November 19, 2015, 16:26
Cmon boys lets all whip out our rulers and measure the length of our +1's lined up.
Whoever has it bigger must be the lesser troll and a hell of a clever guy.
 (And people like these try to "inform" the others of the meaning of a proper discussion)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Firewall on November 19, 2015, 17:27
Of course, but attacks in Beirut, Damascus or Bagdad are not unexpected. The whole region is an unstable civil war zone.

Paris,London and New York are not known to be at war, an attack there is something new.

Moreover these are truly global cities probably visited by over a billion people have once in their life visited them, studied or worked there.

They are places millions of people around the world dream to move to, places we believe you can live safely and in peace.

More people around the world have some kind of emotional connection to Paris, than to Damascus or large cities in Africa that also have many attacks and violence.

The terrorists know this, an attack there will get them more attention and a lot more money from their supporters than an attack in Beirut.

If we do get monthly attacks in France, it wonīt be front page news anymore. That is just the way media works.

Even in the Middle East many people are more shocked about attacks in Paris or London than at home. Especially, if they have sent their children to school or to study there, hoping they have sent them to a safe place.
That's just too bad, but not uncommon for people to consider Middle East and Africa as dangerous and unstable places. Ask yourself, how many attacks were there in Beirut this year and how many in Paris?
There are safer places in the Middle East and Africa than in France. There are no terrorist attacks in let's say Lilongwe or Amman or Muscat or Kigali.

Speaking to people in the field, whether they are Egyptians, Palestinians, Syrians, Lebanese, Jordanians, Israeli or bedouins, all say the same thing, the West doesn't care about our lives. Even Facebook has a double standard here. Sad.

I have family in Amman and Beirut, so for me personally there is an emotional connection if something happens there. But for most people around me there isnīt. It doesnīt mean that only french lives matter. It is just not the same emotional connection.

Imagine you go to attend the funeral of a very dear friend and while you stand by the grave and mourn, somebody walks up to you and complains that you are not showing any emotion to the other person who died and whoīse funeral is being held two rows down.

Just because you are grieving for your friend doesnīt mean you have no empathy for other people. But you will feel a deeper loss to someone you are connected to than the rest of the world.

Attacks happen every single day somewhere across the globe. If there was an attack in my town of Cologne, the Sydney opera house would not be lit up in the colours of my city. Nor would I expect it or go on the internet to complain. There is no competition in grief.

If something happens in Asia, Sri Lanka, or Ukraine, it doesnīt affect me as much as London, Paris, Amman, New York or Athens. wherever my family and friends live will have the strongest pull on me. And I donīt see why I should feel guilty for it, I donīt expect the whole world to follow my life in Cologne, either.
It's called the proximity principle.
Lack of social and/or physical proximity leads to apathy.
Apathy is one of the reasons disasters got worse, i.e. Darfur, prelude to WWII etc.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: etudiante_rapide on November 19, 2015, 17:42
cobalt on November 15, 2015, 11:12
More people around the world have some kind of emotional connection to Paris, than to Damascus or large cities in Africa that also have many attacks and violence.

The terrorists know this, an attack there will get them more attention and a lot more money from their supporters than an attack in Beirut.

---------------------------------------------------------------

BRAVO ! bINGO!!!

it isn't that i do not grieve for the 140 dead. if it's just the number that shakes you to warrant a "discussion" to this to perpetuate the terrorists spread of terror,
here's something with bigger number for you to grieve and ponder...

239 million people in sub-Saharan Africa were hungry/undernourished in 2010 (its most recent estimate). 925 million people were hungry worldwide...

that is times more than 140 ppl.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: DiscreetDuck on November 20, 2015, 05:03
Were the victims in Paris hungry???
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: fritz on November 20, 2015, 09:24
Were the victims in Paris hungry???


9,752,179
Number of child deaths from poverty
In the world, this year

31,916,553
People who died from hunger
In the world, this year

and counting...




Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 20, 2015, 09:51
It will never end, will it?

truly shocking, prayers for the people in Paris

Please correct the number in the Subject of your topic. 140 to 129.
RIP to all innocent victims.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 20, 2015, 13:06
I rather leave it. I find it  pedantic and premature  to suggest

"The number of people killed in last week's coordinated terror attacks in Paris has now risen to 130, according to French Prime Minister Manuel Valls. One of scores of people injured in the attacks had died from their wounds in hospital."
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: loop on November 20, 2015, 13:47
Clearly, some people need a "safe space" where they wont risk being exposed to opinions that are different or challenge them.

ER is a troll from day one. Just wants to cause the thread to be closeed so he doesn't have to let us speak freedom. In his own way he is a forum terrorist throwing bombs into our discussions to disrupt.

If the French were armed like the American's, those terrorists with guns would have fired a few shots and been silenced by the power of the people. Freedom rings and protects us against these people. That's why they take advantage of France or kill their own kind in their countries. Corrupt power from a small group of misguided religious fanatics, makes the good ones look bad. But the good have no weapons to defend, so they get murdered in homelands.

Yes? An so, why every time some armed nut goes in a a murder spree at a school --Columbine style-- nobody is able to stop him? Not once, never.
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 20, 2015, 14:36
yes,  guns stopped 3000 people from dying in New york too
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: ShadySue on November 20, 2015, 14:46
To maintain the international perspective:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-34879955 (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-34879955)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 20, 2015, 14:48
I rather leave it. I find it  pedantic and premature  to suggest

"The number of people killed in last week's coordinated terror attacks in Paris has now risen to 130, according to French Prime Minister Manuel Valls. One of scores of people injured in the attacks had died from their wounds in hospital."

You should delete "140 dead"
Reason saying...somebody might think you counted dead terrorists too. 
Just saying....
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 20, 2015, 15:26
what?? youre a bit weird sorry
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 20, 2015, 17:05
what?? youre a bit weird sorry

Well if you don't want to change 140 to 130, then better change this title to
"Terrorist attack in Paris"

Because where/how did you get to 140 dead?

Again, RIP all innocent victims.  :(
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 20, 2015, 17:22
i posted the article when the attacks had just happened and media were reporting 100 dead, you can see the url has the number 100, and then the number went up to 140 and then to 159 and then it went down, i updated it once, but i am not going to change the title for every update sorry
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 20, 2015, 17:45
i posted the article when the attacks had just happened and media were reporting 100 dead, you can see the url has the number 100, and then the number went up to 140 and then to 159 and then it went down, i updated it once, but i am not going to change the title for every update sorry

And that's exactly I am saying just delete "140 dead" from that Subject line and leave: "Terrorist attack in Paris".

but if you don't see the need for it...nothing I can do.  :-X
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: Microstockphoto on November 20, 2015, 17:55
changing the title seems to be of more importance to you than the whole massacre, dont you have other things to worry about? sorry but your ongoing nagging about something so pedantic is not of my concern
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: KnowYourOnions on November 21, 2015, 07:12
changing the title seems to be of more importance to you than the whole massacre, dont you have other things to worry about? sorry but your ongoing nagging about something so pedantic is not of my concern

super nasty and unnecessary remark! thanks
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: stuttershock on December 17, 2015, 07:20
Even if 99,99% of freebie seekers are not terrorists, they certainly commit a hell lot of crime especially rape, sexual harassment and robbery. They will never show this on the mainstream media obviously, but there are tons of data available.

Germany: Leaked police report reveal that 38,000 Muslim “asylum seekers” committed 100 crimes per day in 2014
Imagine what's like in 2015 with 400% more illegals. When you take Germany away from the germans, the natural reaction is nationalism. It's a matter of survival, either you fight back or you're conquered. Common sense is coming back to Europe though, Poland and Latvia already said they won't take muslims anymore. Eurosceptic anti immigration parties will gain strength across Europe because people are tired of EU failure.
But Latvia and Poland take the money from the EU. In my view they should get no penny from the EU if they dont want to take refugees.

this "point" would only apply if everyone were too dumb to distinguish between an Economic Community and some monolithic  "United States of Europe" which we do not have any agreements in place for -- yet (thank God)! (Then again, even under the U. S. Constitution the states have considerably more leeway than this and would have the right to NOT accept refugees etc.)

Seriously, should all of us now base our "political demands" only on Starwars and wet dreams like that? People really talk a lot. They also have a lot of "opinions", even if they don't know the first thing about sth. Ouch.

Receiving "Money from the EU" is nowhere tied to "political obedience" let alone sharing some specific "Refugee Policy" -- which in the case of Germany's savage chancellor was illegal from day one (both by German constitutional standards AS WELL AS applicable European directives and legal framework)!

And this "is not just me": the EU commission has started legal proceedings for treaty violation against Germany. Well done, Ms Merkel :)
Title: Re: Terrorist attack in Paris 140 dead
Post by: sharpshot on December 17, 2015, 10:07
I find it disappointing so many people here don't support doing anything about ISIS. They control land and have a standing Army.

Who armed them?

Who create them?

People like this have always existed. They have just gone by different names like *, Communists, Socialists, etc.

You are afraid of being a victim of ISIS, but you refuse to understand the truth behind the whole thing. You just want to stop them somehow. It doesn't work in that way. Even you stop them, there will be another group supported by someone for some reason and they will continue what ISIS is doing now. You have to kill the cause, not the result.

ISIS is the cause. The murders in Paris are the result.
Until people stop to think what caused ISIS to form, the conflict will never be resolved.  Just look at all the wars in the middle east in the past decades and how the US and its allies have made a complete mess of it over and over again.  The US gave several billion dollars to Saddam Hussein to fight Iran, then they sold weapons to Iran.  My country, the UK is no better, still getting in to trouble for allegedly selling arms to a middle east country that might be using them on civilians.  The son of Margaret Thatcher was alleged to of been involved in arms deals.

Just imagine living in Iraq, an almost 8 year war with Iran, then the first gulf war, then sanctions and having to live under Saddam Hussein, then another war, then nothing done to secure the country and stop terrorists taking over.  How many families have been obliterated by all that?  Must be like living in hell and anyone that thinks ISIS can be destroyed by more bombs must have no understanding of history.  The UK never managed to stop the IRA and that was a much smaller organisation, the war on terror is about as likely to work as the war on drugs.

I think the way to massively reduce the threat of ISIS is by letting the middle east countries sort out their own problems and not arming them.  The terrorist attacks will probably carry on whatever the west does.  Just look at the list of terrorist attacks on France in recent decades,
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents_in_France